Crime & Punishment

 
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Incursions: CCP is too slow - now we will act

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#241 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:10
There I go again...

My former losec alliance friends who, like me, are using an alt (not this one silly) the alliance does not know about to run incursions in Hisec. We have to make some ISK somehow! The alliances are the only ones making ISK off the moongoo monopolies - quite unlike the Hisec incursion runners who eschew incursion based corps because they would be huge war dec magnets - so the incursions cash in hisec go into player accounts instead of alliance accounts.

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....
Gallente Federation
#242 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:12
wow, my jars are full of null bear tears! Mad because you cant control all of the isk in eve? or is it because you dont get paid for pvp? please, make them despawn quicker. That way i can just wait for them to come to my side of new eden instead of traveling 30+ jumps. So thanks for doing me a favor by stopping amarrs monopoly on the incursion sites!
Minmatar Republic
#243 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:29
Osmodeus wrote:
wow, my jars are full of null bear tears! Mad because you cant control all of the isk in eve? or is it because you dont get paid for pvp? please, make them despawn quicker. That way i can just wait for them to come to my side of new eden instead of traveling 30+ jumps. So thanks for doing me a favor by stopping amarrs monopoly on the incursion sites!



Didn't want those incursions anyways.
#244 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:32
Krissada wrote:
Before words ----
Yes, it's this thread again. No, it's not just empty words.
This was posted many days ago, but I decided to take it down to have some chats with a few selected people before finalizing everything.


_____________________

We have come to the conclusion that even though blackbird suicide ganking is a profitable and very fun activity it only limits the Incursion Bear activities by some degree.
If we are to end their reign once and for all which has lasted for almost a year it is time we do it now.

We would like to announce the creation of a wonderful and most generous channel named: "Grief the Bears" with the sole purpose of taking down all motherships in highsec as soon as they appear and end the incursion just like CCP intended....
We shall put an end to this inhuman farming and abuse of game mechanics. We have to put a gag to this ISK faucet and shake up those bears.
If they wanna do incursions they can go to lowsec or nullsec. Pirate

What do we require and why do we need you?


  • 30-40 bodies to effectively fight off the site and finish it.
  • Armor buffer fit battleships and a handful subbattleships.
  • T2 logistic ships.
  • Empty tear jars.

So join us at the channel ----> Grief the Bears
and let us finally put an end to all this.

Once all the highsec incursions are down they will not respawn for another 24+ hours. When that one will spawn it will only take the bears 4-5 hours to make the mothership appear and then we shall sweep in yet again and finish it.

Can you imagine highsec where the bears only get to incursion 15-20 hours for a whole week?
I can and it is filled with tears....


PS: Beware that extracting a sufficient amount of tears will result in merc wardecs hired by rich bears. I see this as a side bonus!

_______________


Above is the simple plan. We cannot keep on waiting and whining to CCP. We are taking matters into our own hands with or without you.
If you want to join, feel free to. If you rather not that is fine too.
But if you want to whine and complain because we are stopping the ISK faucet then make sure you are crying into one of our jars.

Fly much reckless Twisted


Sounds like another case of someone way too full of themselves bitching about the way others play the game. Last I checked Eve was so much fun for people because you could play it any way you like, several ways in fact, where as in WoW, Everquest, or many other MMORPG's, you really only have the option of playing the mainline game the way it was intended. So now, someone with power, trips all over it, demanding and forcing others to comply with their wishes of how the game must be played. Get over yourself. How stuck up do you have to be to whine like a little baby about others making money? The term carebears is bad enough to apply it to anyone who plays the game in any way other then killing weaker oponents, now your goingto become a "crybear" cus people found a way to make money without putting themselves in front of your overpowered guns? Wow. I'm truly amazed at the level of arrogance a simple game can give small minded, over focused people like you.
Advent of Fate
#245 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:38
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.
Hmmm
#246 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:42
Darius III wrote:
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


Can't Argue with that, but people in here seem to jump on the bandwagon with to much guille. People seem to take your words to the extreme Darius, when all you want is moderation to accomplish what you want.
"I saw him fight by the monument in Jita. He flowed in his Machariel like a Shinto spirit, 800MM shells sprouting in his passing. His hair flowed in the corona of his target's warp core breach. It was truly majestic. And while everyone stared in awe I stole the loot and ran off. Because I am like that." - NEONOVUS
#247 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:45
Darius III wrote:
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


I dont think that's an unfair request, but is being a pirate and attacking defenseless transports and helpless miners really that risky? I dont think it is. I havnt once been killed by a griefer that I posed any conceivable threat too. In fact, every time I've ever lost a ship it's been to someone far more skilled, equipped, and powerful then myself. What risk?!?!?!?!
#248 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:52  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
Sin Istersly wrote:
Darius III wrote:
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


I dont think that's an unfair request, but is being a pirate and attacking defenseless transports and helpless miners really that risky? I dont think it is. I havnt once been killed by a griefer that I posed any conceivable threat too. In fact, every time I've ever lost a ship it's been to someone far more skilled, equipped, and powerful then myself. What risk?!?!?!?!


I have had my fair share of losses and my fair share of kills aaist people that are far better equiped/skilled(SP wise)/ and more powerfull than I am. I don't look at it as risk, every engagement I see as a learining experience. That is my reward, even if I loose.

Our outlooks differ on how to percieve what happening or how we play the game. But I also agree with you, what risk is there to the guys engaging somebody that never PVP's?

On the other hand, it means Merc service are required even more so, and those we have engaged thus far loose a few ships before they leave corp.

That what's makes this game so awesome. PVE guys getted bugged by fruitcakes, PVE guys hire Mercs, Mercs bugg Fruitcakes, fruitcakes leave corp and the cycle continues. Sounds like a living universe to me.
"I saw him fight by the monument in Jita. He flowed in his Machariel like a Shinto spirit, 800MM shells sprouting in his passing. His hair flowed in the corona of his target's warp core breach. It was truly majestic. And while everyone stared in awe I stole the loot and ran off. Because I am like that." - NEONOVUS
#249 Posted: 2012.01.18 05:56  |  Edited by: Swiftsoul Tian
Darius III wrote:
I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


LMAO! Risk vs. Reward - what about those gate gankers killing 20-30 mission runners in a row and looting their T2 ships - muhaaaaa - very risky.

If you want balance do something about that. Everyone can farm Incursions - so where is the balancing issue?

Instead of talking about balancing - name it what you want: Force other players to play the way YOU want - that's it.
#250 Posted: 2012.01.18 06:09  |  Edited by: Sin Istersly
Swiftsoul Tian wrote:
Darius III wrote:
I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


LMAO! Risk vs. Reward - what about those gate gankers killing 20-30 mission runners in a row and looting their T2 ships - muhaaaaa - very risky.

If you want balance do something about that. Everyone can farm Incursions - so where is the balancing issue?

Instead of talking about balancing - name it what you want: Force other players to play the way YOU want - that's it.


My point exactly. Thank you Swift. Although I think part of their cryparty is about having to have the security status to get into high sec. Most pirates cant do incursions because of that. Sounds like a "you" problem to me though.

Cannibal Kane wrote:

I have had my fair share of losses and my fair share of kills aaist people that are far better equiped/skilled(SP wise)/ and more powerfull than I am. I don't look at it as risk, every engagement I see as a learining experience. That is my reward, even if I loose.

Our outlooks differ on how to percieve what happening or how we play the game. But I also agree with you, what risk is there to the guys engaging somebody that never PVP's?

On the other hand, it means Merc service are required even more so, and those we have engaged thus far loose a few ships before they leave corp.

That what's makes this game so awesome. PVE guys getted bugged by fruitcakes, PVE guys hire Mercs, Mercs bugg Fruitcakes, fruitcakes leave corp and the cycle continues. Sounds like a living universe to me.



I'd be really surprised if you've ever been taken out by someone that doesnt PVP at all. Learning experience or not. someone who's focused on mining, manufacturing, and research, even in with full skills on a ship, and the best gear, is NOT, I repeat, NOT, EVER, going to beat an experienced PVP player with full resist and weapons skills, and the knowledge of strategies to back that up. I've never seen a miner handle a griefer, it just doesnt happen. So I ask again, what risk? Their is risk if your going against other PVP'ers, but not carebears.

Stop trying to blurr the line. Bottom line is, Skilled PVP vs Highsec Carebear = Dead carebear.
Amarr Empire
#251 Posted: 2012.01.18 06:19
smells like a gonns thing posted with a high sec alt Big smile
Do you have problems with loosing willing slaves ?
Point Blank Alliance
#252 Posted: 2012.01.18 06:20
In lowsec you don't get to choose who engages you if you're incompetent. An incompetent PVPer will get ganked by people better equipped than him just as an incompetent bear will. A competent PVPer will not get ganked by people better equipped than him, and nor will a competent bear.
#253 Posted: 2012.01.18 06:25  |  Edited by: Sin Istersly
Tyralyn wrote:
smells like a gonns thing posted with a high sec alt Big smile
Do you have problems with loosing willing slaves ?


I'm a highsec miner, this is my only character. I'm not cowardly enough to use an alt to voice my opinions, sorry. I stand by what I say instead of hiding from it. To be entirely honest, I've heard of goonswarm, but I really have no idea what your referring to by 'willing slaves."


Kahega Amielden wrote:
In lowsec you don't get to choose who engages you if you're incompetent. An incompetent PVPer will get ganked by people better equipped than him just as an incompetent bear will. A competent PVPer will not get ganked by people better equipped than him, and nor will a competent bear.


You just proved my point, a PVP vs a PVP. You will NEVER, EVER, EVER see an incompetant PVP'er getting ganked by a Miner or Trader though. That is the point I'm making. Yet, you PVP'ers, think it's your responsibitlity somehow to mess with us miners and traders. Again, risk to isk ratio, way off. I have a chance to make more, but I also have a chance to lose my enormous teir 2 cargo ship. Thier is however no chance my cargo ship is going to take out your Navy Issue Raven. I'll be lucky if I can get away with my pod from that thing.


Their is one point I argue, yes, a competant bear can EASILY get ganked by a better equipped and skilled, yet incompetant PVP'er, simply for lack of ability to defend themselves. That doesnt seem to stop griefers from griefing though. In fact, they seem to get some sort of rush out of killing someone weaker then they. I personally cant imagine what kind of horrible, corrupted, deeply troubled person enjoys torturing helpless, weaker critters that we're no threat to them. But then, I've never had a desire to hurt others. I guess that might just be me and the other carebears though.

So again I ask, what risk?

This thread just seems like a "The herd found a place to hide" crybaby thread for griefers. Omg, their doing incursion to make they're money instead of flying into my nullsec area where I can jump them with a ship 10 times their size with 500 times the armament, not even mentioning skill bonuses. Wah!
Noir. Mercenary Group
#254 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:02
Great idea. The lack of incentive to defeat the mothership as soon as possible is a mechanic, risk vs reward, and immersion breaking hole in the Incursion feature. Looking forward to how this plays out vs the Incursion Cartel.
"Alekseyev Karrde: mercenary of my heart."
-Arydanika, Voices from the Void

Hero of the CSM
Noir./Noir. Academy Recruiting: www.noirmercs.com
#255 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:23
Sin Istersly wrote:
Darius III wrote:
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


I dont think that's an unfair request, but is being a pirate and attacking defenseless transports and helpless miners really that risky? I dont think it is. I havnt once been killed by a griefer that I posed any conceivable threat too. In fact, every time I've ever lost a ship it's been to someone far more skilled, equipped, and powerful then myself. What risk?!?!?!?!


I guess something like this could always happen.
#256 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:30
Killa Von Murderer wrote:
Sin Istersly wrote:
Darius III wrote:
Recoil Happens wrote:

Bet that won't be on Darius' re-election platform. Oh, if you only knew how close you were to being deposed... but don't give up hope! Not everyone is going to quit your alliance....


I want EVERYONE to enjoy Eve online. This includes hisec. Everyone must make money. I only want the ISK vs Work/Risk equation to be more balanced.


I dont think that's an unfair request, but is being a pirate and attacking defenseless transports and helpless miners really that risky? I dont think it is. I havnt once been killed by a griefer that I posed any conceivable threat too. In fact, every time I've ever lost a ship it's been to someone far more skilled, equipped, and powerful then myself. What risk?!?!?!?!


I guess something like this could always happen.

While it's true that this could happen . . (That was an epic trap setup btw, love it lol) most PVP'er's pick only on miners and traders, knowing that it's likely their ship, even with a full set of skills, is NO match for them. That's what I'm referring too. Although thank you much Von, you've totally given me a new goal to train for to have fun with in high sec.

I dont suppose theirs a corp of greifer griefers out their, is there? lol
#257 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:34
Killa Von Murderer wrote:

I guess something like this could always happen.


what happened 2 mins later....

The can flipper came back with his can-flipping friends and puffed the hulk - muhhaaaa - risk risk!


#258 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:38  |  Edited by: Sin Istersly
Swiftsoul Tian wrote:
Killa Von Murderer wrote:

I guess something like this could always happen.


what happened 2 mins later....

The can flipper came back with his can-flipping friends and puffed the hulk - muhhaaaa - risk risk!




Perhaps, but this was still a fight between two PVP'ers. Not a PVP and a carebear. Just because a PVP'er poses as a carebear, doesnt make him one. Were he actually a carebear, he would have lost his hulk during the first encounter if the hulk pilot we're foolish enough to flag himself to the griefer. Am I wrong?
Gallente Federation
#259 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:40
Quote:

Lets say five fleets of eleven guys each making 100M per hour per incursion: Thats 55 people in 5 fleets, making 100M isk each per hour + or - LP's or, 5.5 Bn PER HOUR and thats PER INCURSION Multiple by 20 hours effective per day for 3 incursions.Hope that banning Brick Squad turned out to be a good idea financially, especially regarding the theft of 50 K of Ore. Ban my whole alliance for one guys actions? I'll help the coalition shut down your entire way of life. Hope you guys enjoy having to contest each and every site. We are still in your channels, we had the buckets ready for your tears, and they are DEEEE-LICIOUSSSSSSSS


My my my, now what do we have here? I think I saw the word my used a bit too much there, mister Darius. Even from an alliance leader, using 'my' in reference to the alliance you lead is poor form. Even if the alliance is 'materially' yours, you are not what makes the alliance. The alliance is made up of the people within it. No members = no alliance. It makes you look the part of the dictator.... rather selfish, don't you think?

Then there's that vigilante attitude.... tsk tsk mister CSM... not looking pretty I don't think. You, who were so graciously permitted the luxury of being the player's voice to CCP concerning EvE matters, don't need CCP? It's like a mayor of a town saying he doesn't need the government....What does he plan on doing?...Tsk tsk....

Though I suppose I should move onto my point, yes? Your math, Dear Mister CSM, is atrocious. Five fleets won't be making 100 mill an hour in one incursion. It just won't happen. Why? Well that is rather simple. Each incursion constellation has only three vanguard incursion systems, with the rare exception of a few which have four. Some actually have two. Yes I have seen them. Now, while each system does have six to seven sites (optimally, when not being farmed) in them, there still won't be enough for five fleets to make one hundred million isk an hour each, especially when competing. In order to manage that, each fleet would have to be set up to fill a certain role to kill a specific site. And while BTL does excel at doing OTAs, and TDF completes NCOs at blinding speeds, this still would not be enough. When you have five fleets bouncing around, it is inevitable that there will be contesting. To put it in simple terms for you people who don't understand: One fleet will not get paid for each site contested. So while your theories work out nice on pen and paper mister CSM, I'm afraid I am going to have to inform you of your fatal flaw. This is reality, not the land of perfect. There's no denying incursions generate a lot of isk, however, if you're going to spout numbers, spout realistic ones.

This thread has generated quite a few chuckles from me on both ends. But I feel I must echo the sentiments of a few others here. I find this entire drive for tears to be entirely bemusing. Interestingly enough, the largest source of them are not from the would be grieved incursioners, but rather the gankers themselves, specifically one of their biggest supporters. Thank you mister Darius. You have made a bigger fool out of yourself then I could have done. In your own words, you have undeniably admitted your own butthurt over being banned by COMMUNITY driven incursion channels. You're doing this, by your own words, because they banned 'your' alliance for the actions of one of it's members. Do you know what that sounds like to me? Complaining. Threatening their 'way of life'? Might want to get your jar ready Mister Darius, looks like your own tears might fill them up.

And on another point, aren't you yourself proving your own words incorrect? The entire sentiment of this thread was that there was way too much isk being made by abusing a mechanic with no risk involved. Well, the fact that you CAN gank them proves you wrong. And more to the point, you can cost them large amounts of isk doing it. The fact of the matter is they farm isk by bringing ships. The shinier the ship, the easier they can do it right? That goes both ways. The shinier the ship, the more it costs them when it gets destroyed. So do the math. Destroy their shiny ships and cost them isk. Do it enough, and set them back into t1 battleships. Keep doing it, and drive them off.

"But that's impossible" .... Incorrect. It IS possible. However, the problem lies in the mentality of you and your fellow cohorts. You lack the drive to see your desires reach fruition. So you pick the easiest method possible and create some elaborate excuse for it. If you want to stop these incursions, it's going to take an extended campaign. You should well know Darius that the Delve wars did not last a week. The Siege of PR lasted a whole month ITSELF! and that was hardly the entire war! If you want something done, you have to work for it!

Finally, I'll have to echo a few more sentiments from the sane people of this thread. Either do it, or don't. The theatrics aren't fooling anyone. You'll either succeed in reducing the income generated by incursions in high sec, or you'll go down in history as someone who tried. However, keeping with these theatrics will have you written as the crybaby who fell on his face. Or, if for some reason you're successful with your little charade, You'll be viewed as the one who whined until he got his way.

Is that really how you want yourself to be viewed?

So enough with the Tears crap, and either get on with the show, or get off your little soap box, because if all you're going to do about it is whine, you'll get a little flair of attention for a few weeks, but then you'll be forgotten about. Actually pulling it off will get you remembered for years.

This message has been brought to you by ISKIES NOW!

P.S. CCP your new forums suck. They eat messages.
#260 Posted: 2012.01.18 07:52
Wow Iskies, I could not have said that better myself. I think we should all get together and coin a new term in honor of Darius.

Low and behold, the almighty "Crybear" Fear them for they will drown the world in their tears until they get their way. LOL!

Anyone else NOT voting for Darius next election?
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