Warfare & Tactics

 
 

State of the warzone (Minmatar vs. Amarr)

Author
Ushra'Khan
#1 - 2017-05-19 08:07:50 UTC
Here's an update on the current state of play in the Minamatr - Amarr warzone.

The Story so Far..
Over the last month or so, the Minmatar have been pushing the warzone, taking system after system. This started with a clear out of amarr held Minmatar systems and have continued with a push into Minmatar space. Efforts have focused largely on Amarr strongholds such as Kourmonen and Houla which have been taken, and now Kamela. The Amarr have been focusing on defence and slowing the Minmatar advance and have successfully held Kamela at a low contested level through a couple of weeks of Minmatar assault. At the same time, the Minmatar have claimed a few less well defended systems on the Amarr side of the warzone.

The fall of Kamelal
This week the Minmatar installed a Citadel in Kamela so facilitate faster re-shipping against the Amarr and pirate factions who have access to the Kamela station. This seems to have broken Amarr resistance and at the time of writing Kamela has risen to 64% contested level. Fighting in Kamela between the Minmatar, Amarr and pirate factions continues to be intense with both navy factions employing hit and run tactics to fight one another and claim the system during periods of overwhelming pirate incursion. https://zkillboard.com/system/30003069/ Although often we just killed the pirates too: https://zkillboard.com/character/444369874/

The Empire Strikes Back
As Kamela falls, the Empire have started to fight back in a number of Minmatar held systems such as Haras and Gurkala. Here the fighting has been significantly less, and the push seems to be the work of a few Amarr frigates assaulting the systems while the Minmatar are out fighting elsewhere. Defending these systems is a great opportunity for new Minmatar pilots to band together and practice their skills in smaller fights while earning defensive LP.

Pilots flock to the Minmatar cause
The last few weeks have seen a number of new pilots join the Minmatar ranks including new and old pilots, alpha and omega clones. Whether these pilots are drawn by the higher ISK return available to the Minmatar (see https://garemoko.github.io/eve-fw-data/ ), the welcoming nature of Minmatar fleets or the awesomeness of Minmatar ship design is unclear. You can join the Minmatar as a solo pilot, with your corp or by joining an existing Minmatar faction Warfare corp.
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
#2 - 2017-05-20 19:20:03 UTC
TL:DR Amarr Mil are still bad. Farmers swarming to Min Mil.
Ushra'Khan
#3 - 2017-05-21 18:33:55 UTC
And now we took Kamela too.

What's next for the Minmatar? Wait and see...
It Burns When I'm PvPing
#4 - 2017-05-22 23:07:47 UTC
Is there even a point to fw since citadels are a thing?

Pras Phil.

Ushra'Khan
#5 - 2017-05-22 23:09:15 UTC
Samwise Everquest wrote:
Is there even a point to fw since citadels are a thing?


Absolutely!
Of Questionable Repute
#6 - 2017-05-23 09:43:09 UTC
Would love for a good reason to participate on my main, but Crime.Net can't really beat Ushra' Kahn or the farmer swarm at the moment and the other groups seem too small to really make too much of a difference. It is just more fun when there is some give and take to the fight. The only thing that would do that now is another corp or alliance joining Amarr (or coming to this space from Caldari). I love the Minmatar, but turns out being on the winning side is pretty boring.

Eventually the LP market will crash and everything will reverse course and the Amarr will regain numbers, I just hope that middle period where there are lots of good fights from actual PVPers is longer this time around.
Prelium Ultima
#7 - 2017-05-23 12:46:47 UTC
Amarr vs Min has had a population crisis going on a number of years now.

Many of the willing fighters got fed up with the mechanics and moved along or they switched to the Gal - Cal zone. Many of those that switched are now semi-active in low sec Pirate / Moon Goo entities and only play to ping.

CCP has failed to realise the potential of FW to appeal to many different player types varying from the Casual player, Binge Player, Full time burnout type, Roleplaying type and cynical veteran.

Citing that FW does not have the activity to demand Development time is just crap. "if you build it, they will come" (bonus point for recognising the film).

Most of New Eden is unforgiving for people who have taken on RL commitments, that limit their commitments to Eve. Eve is old, so are many of the players.

FW could provide one of the few forgiving self-sustaining environments to nurture these different playstyles. Even whilst it simultaneously represents a "bridge" for new players into a higher risk & PvP environment.

I think CCP may have decided they'll just try to grab headlines with occasional ball buster headlines, from a single fight in null sec, as the means to draw new players from the next set of youngsters.

Sort out FW mechanics. NOW.

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"

Gallente Federation
#8 - 2017-05-23 18:11:13 UTC
ValentinaDLM wrote:
Would love for a good reason to participate on my main, but Crime.Net can't really beat Ushra' Kahn or the farmer swarm at the moment and the other groups seem too small to really make too much of a difference. It is just more fun when there is some give and take to the fight. The only thing that would do that now is another corp or alliance joining Amarr (or coming to this space from Caldari). I love the Minmatar, but turns out being on the winning side is pretty boring.

Eventually the LP market will crash and everything will reverse course and the Amarr will regain numbers, I just hope that middle period where there are lots of good fights from actual PVPers is longer this time around.


That complacency is what caused the fail cascade of minmil when Amarr kept pushing and got their medal.

There are some guys pushing warzone control in the hopes of doing something new that will merit recognition, but there is the catch. What may very well be a vain attempt to giving FW an end game goal that is recognizable and verifiable. Without medals being awarded there is really no other reason than farming LP that can drive pilots towards this mad endeavor of consistent pressure and constant fighting. Citadel reshipping makes for some of the fastest neck breaking PvP, but prove that there is no reason to take the loss of a home system to heart anymore. A tool that has become too useful and broke took too many other things when it came to FW.
Ushra'Khan
#9 - 2017-05-23 18:26:16 UTC
We're still getting good fights, even if they are as much with pirates as they are with Amarr and I'm enjoying pushing the warzone. I'd love to have more pilots in the faction and have multiple fleets at any one time doing different activities, whether that's pushing the plexes, hunting LP bots, roaming the warzone or other things completely unrelated to FW.

For me , the fight won't end when Minmatar take the warzone. I'm planning to keep pushing into Caldari space once we've defeated the Amarr.
Of Questionable Repute
#10 - 2017-05-23 19:29:46 UTC
Oreb Wing wrote:
ValentinaDLM wrote:
Would love for a good reason to participate on my main, but Crime.Net can't really beat Ushra' Kahn or the farmer swarm at the moment and the other groups seem too small to really make too much of a difference. It is just more fun when there is some give and take to the fight. The only thing that would do that now is another corp or alliance joining Amarr (or coming to this space from Caldari). I love the Minmatar, but turns out being on the winning side is pretty boring.

Eventually the LP market will crash and everything will reverse course and the Amarr will regain numbers, I just hope that middle period where there are lots of good fights from actual PVPers is longer this time around.


That complacency is what caused the fail cascade of minmil when Amarr kept pushing and got their medal.

There are some guys pushing warzone control in the hopes of doing something new that will merit recognition, but there is the catch. What may very well be a vain attempt to giving FW an end game goal that is recognizable and verifiable. Without medals being awarded there is really no other reason than farming LP that can drive pilots towards this mad endeavor of consistent pressure and constant fighting. Citadel reshipping makes for some of the fastest neck breaking PvP, but prove that there is no reason to take the loss of a home system to heart anymore. A tool that has become too useful and broke took too many other things when it came to FW.


To be fair, I played in FW long before docking lockouts, and probably got some of the best fights back then too. Yes there were alot of stupid Station games in Huola, but we also had lots of fights, despite the fact that victory points counted for basically nothing back then. Though the population of Minmatar low sec was just much higher for certain back then.

What really needs to happen though, is LP needs to be able to be put in hubs in order to upgrade systems, and those systems need to be able to do something like spawn anoms that will give LP when completed, or give isk, but only to one from that faction. You can put an Astrahaus in every system in nullsec, but it still matters who owns it because due to all space being upgradeable all space has value. Tiers are stupid, just do away with them and let upgrades happen.

The caution is though, that you don't want to be able to upgrade a system in a way that will benefit anyone who is outside of FW, so there would have to be big limits, but it seems pretty natural to me with citadels to make holding space valuable in some way.
Federation Uprising
#11 - 2017-05-29 00:35:10 UTC
Master Sergeant MacRobert wrote:


Citing that FW does not have the activity to demand Development time is just crap. "if you build it, they will come" (bonus point for recognising the film).




Field of Dreams, what do I win?
Prelium Ultima
#12 - 2017-05-29 13:12:58 UTC
Amber Stonei wrote:
Master Sergeant MacRobert wrote:


Citing that FW does not have the activity to demand Development time is just crap. "if you build it, they will come" (bonus point for recognising the film).




Field of Dreams, what do I win?


A ticket to Butterfly PHD's victory party, perhaps.

Are congratulations on the "victory" premature?

"Remedy this situation or you shall live out the rest of your life in a pain amplifier"

Jayai Syndicate
#13 - 2017-06-19 18:08:00 UTC
Interesting update. From what I've been seeing, the taking of the war zone was more a - don't want it, go ahead and have it. Tbh most of the pilots that comprised the core of Amarr in the past are still in the war zone - but because of the mentioned frustrations with certain mechanics, etc... are now the majority of pirates that continue to relish shooting the Minnies.

When the market drops the pendulum will do what it always does... be nice to have parity instead of LP palooza's.
But alas.....

When a tree falls in the forest...you get the picture.

Rovie
It Burns When I'm PvPing
#14 - 2017-07-13 14:54:59 UTC
The minmatar LP market recovered? When? What is considered recovery?

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815

Prelium Ultima
#15 - 2017-07-14 06:29:23 UTC
Samwise Everquest wrote:
Is there even a point to fw since citadels are a thing?



NO
It Burns When I'm PvPing
#16 - 2017-07-17 14:46:02 UTC
ALUCARD 1208 wrote:
Samwise Everquest wrote:
Is there even a point to fw since citadels are a thing?



NO

I suppose you mean the point of gaining sov in fw.

Everyone might think there is supposed to be some different "point" to faction war. IMO the "point" was supposed to be to have fun fighting in an easily accessible war for casual players. CCP never really delivered on that and instead made it a very unfun game where you grind your plexing alts until any normal person sees how stupid it is and leaves.

There used to be no consequences to taking space except a note somewhere on a map. Then CCP added consequences such as lots of lp (to the point where lp is worth a fraction of what it used to be) and station lockouts. But it was still and has always been a game of grinding alts. This is the problem with fw sov. We don't need more consequences for refusing to be drones rabbit plexing alts. We need mechanics where that is not the optimal way to gain sov.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815

Ushra'Khan
#17 - 2017-07-20 14:10:46 UTC
DrButterfly PHD wrote:
Samwise Everquest wrote:
Is there even a point to fw since citadels are a thing?


Absolutely!


As they currently are for FW, I disagree.
#18 - 2017-07-24 03:31:23 UTC
DrButterfly PHD wrote:
We're still getting good fights, even if they are as much with pirates as they are with Amarr and I'm enjoying pushing the warzone. I'd love to have more pilots in the faction and have multiple fleets at any one time doing different activities, whether that's pushing the plexes, hunting LP bots, roaming the warzone or other things completely unrelated to FW.

For me , the fight won't end when Minmatar take the warzone. I'm planning to keep pushing into Caldari space once we've defeated the Amarr.



really hanging on to the delusions of grandeur huh? FW is broke AF and CCP with its neglecting attitude toward probably one of the most easiest ways to get all player types in the same mixing bowl for PVP action has sat on their thumbs. Citadels in FW space was the worst idea. I have been saying this for years now that there needs to be a quarterly or every six months reset in FW space. You have to give the other side a reset in the event of total domination otherwise you have this bullshit happening. Pushes players away into doing other things.
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