Warfare & Tactics

 
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CCP - FW What a waste of time.

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#41 - 2012-02-20 03:42:43 UTC
Mechael wrote:

Yikes. What is warfare without spying? Please don't push for that. Instead, please push for more inventive ways of sifting out spies. I'm sure it's possible. A rank system is a good start. I know there's one built in already, but having special comms for higher ranking FW pilots would at least be a start even if it isn't infallible. On that note, nothing should be infallible.


What he is speaking of is a couple day old alts that take no effort at all getting into the warring millitias to gain as much information as possible. This is not really 'spying,' but is more asshattery than anything else. It has very little practical value other than irritating and disrupting the hostile militia. This level of "spying" takes absolutely no effort or actual ability to disguise motives.
#42 - 2012-02-20 06:24:32 UTC
Vordak Kallager wrote:
[quote=Revolution Rising]I:words:


You either sack up deal with the abuse for a little while until the old-hats get comfortable having you around and come to trust you a bit, or you join a FW player corporation.

^That! I (after a vote) signed up my corp for FW against you slimy slavers. We've taken a few knocks, but soon we had a few contacts in the "real" FW. It really wasn't too bad, even though they were effectively trusting me with the job of filtering out spys. Get a few in-game friends and form your own FW corp if you want to, but show you are gonna be loyal, and it will happen. And then I'll make a point of targeting you, lol.

Or, like others have said, engage your irl social skillz and make a few friends in your FW. Doors will open, if you work on it for a few weeks/months.

(goes back to Ammar FW spai alt)
Ushra'Khan
#43 - 2012-02-23 01:07:12 UTC
Wonder if there's any money in being a double agent? :P

going solo and passing intel on both sides... could be fun XD

But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.

.................It's the eye of the tiger, it's the thrill of the fight Risin' up to the challenge of our rival And the last known survivor stalks his prey in the night And he's watchin' us all with the eye of the tiger...............

Ushra'Khan
#44 - 2012-02-23 01:19:56 UTC
FWs "peak" was 2010. Since then there's been a slow degradation of participation and kills. While the core concept is a good idea the execution was terrible and continues to be flawed. I would love to see it improved, but until then it will continue it's slow slide.
Thermodynamics
#45 - 2012-02-23 01:45:02 UTC
Jones Bones wrote:
FWs "peak" was 2010. Since then there's been a slow degradation of participation and kills. While the core concept is a good idea the execution was terrible and continues to be flawed. I would love to see it improved, but until then it will continue it's slow slide.


Yes, but hopefully CCP's iteration on FW this year (with our man Hans whispering in their ear) should help jolt some life back into it.

Sa souvraya niende misain ye.

Gallente Federation
#46 - 2012-02-23 01:48:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Mekhana
That's if he gets elected. He's already not popular with the 'big' candidates, they are trying to get more 'like minded' people elected to phase Hans out.

We need to all actually vote for the CSM (gasp!) so he has a chance of winning.

Vide longe er eros di Luminaire VII, uni canse pra krage e determiniex! Sange por Sange! Descanse bravex eros, mie freires. Mortir por vostre Liberete, farmilie, ide e amis. lons Proviste sen mort! Luminaire liber mas! 

#47 - 2012-02-23 02:23:39 UTC
Mekhana wrote:
That's if he gets elected. He's already not popular with the 'big' candidates, they are trying to get more 'like minded' people elected to phase Hans out.

We need to all actually vote for the CSM (gasp!) so he has a chance of winning.


He's already been involved with the process from what I understand, but I completely agree - we have to so some solidarity behind Hans for his wonderful support of the core gameplay aspects we all enjoy. This is now a +1 for Hans thread Blink
The Bloc
#48 - 2012-02-23 02:44:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Deen Wispa
Ash Stewart wrote:


But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.


Right. Because nullsec doesn't have spies. Seriously though, people make a bigger deal out of the spies meme than it needs to be. FW doesn't allow for sov and there isn't alot to be gained from spying other than passing off intel about enemy movements. And that's already gained by seeding pilots at various choke points in lowsec and reporting back in exclusive channels .

I would suggest posting Han's thread in militia channels as a way to rally votes. As well as telling corp CEOs to promote him as well

High Five. Yeah! C'est La Eve .

Amarr Empire
#49 - 2012-02-23 17:30:49 UTC
Personal memory from FW times has horrid pictures of "arranged" fights done by the militia FC guys running our lowtech t1 fleet into enemy fleets with +8 logis and t2+faction ships.

The excuse was "well we got a fight out of it" ... when everyone died obviously.

I have to agree that people playing both sides destroy the whole idea of the FW with the "lol just a game" attitude.
#50 - 2012-02-23 23:10:26 UTC
Ash Stewart wrote:
Wonder if there's any money in being a double agent? :P

going solo and passing intel on both sides... could be fun XD

But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.



Give it a go - You'll make tens of isks. Big smile


The Bloc
#51 - 2012-02-24 20:18:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Deen Wispa
Here's a A Candid Look at Faction War and Small-Gang PVP from Susan Black;

Quote:
If null-sec pvp is like fighting as a storm trooper, then small-gang pvp is like fighting like an Ewok.
When I was in null-sec, a lot of my fleet 'thought' was about conformity. Did I have the proper fit the FC needed at that time? (Along with the 200 pilots in the same ship?) Was I in the right place? Was I near enough to the titan so I could bridge at the appropriate time? Am I doing my best to switch targets when the FC calls it? (Oh how I remember the lag!)

In small gang, low-sec pvp, and Faction War, there is the complete opposite mentality to this group-think. You need...and are expected to have a keen sense of personal creativity. With this creativity comes a lot of freedom to just play.


Consider the Amarrian FW corp, Imperial Outlaws, and their campaign on TEST. Ilaw is a small 30 man corp waging small gang warfare on a major nullsec alliance with thousands of members. Their campaign in Otosela has netted them 500+ kills and 40+ losses. Not bad for a bunch of supposed noob pilots. It just goes to show what creative and cohesive combat unit can accomplish unlike those who suffer the typical lemming and group think mindset. Damn those Amarrian Ewoks :)

You will always have naysayers in any part of space. FW, like many parts of New Eden, is simply social Darwinism. Skillpoints alone doesn't get you far. Your ability to socialize and learn to network with others will get you into the 'country club" mentality that some speak of.

And TBH, I think the people who complain about not being able to break into FW or any other part of the sandbox in New Eden are the same people who sit idly at a bar with a drink in hand waiting for the pretty girl to come talk to you. Loser mentality. You're supposed to go to the girl and talk to her. Win her over with your charm, wit, and personality. If she rejects you, say, "No big deal. I love rejection. Let me find another!"

People who complain about not being able to "get in" are the same ones who will find a reason to not being able to succeed elsewhere be that nullsec, WH, piracy, etc... Some just can't handle rejection and obstacles be that ingame or in life.

You can win. Or you can make excuses. But you can't do both at the same time.

High Five. Yeah! C'est La Eve .

Goonswarm Federation
#52 - 2012-02-25 19:50:28 UTC
Well said, Deen.
Faction Warefare is alife, but it is not a sitting duck like high-sec missioning. You have actively to search for a target and be creative in hunting it down. This can be frustrating from time to time but once you have learned the ropes and have some success you will feel the spice of FW.
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2012-02-25 21:00:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Revolution Rising
lol this thread is still going, I'd completely forgotten about it.

Started a low-sec corp with some friends instead.

Hope all the FW spying works itself out, GL with that.

edit:
Really had to laugh at this post.

Ash Stewart wrote:

But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.

Seriously?

.

Ushra'Khan
#54 - 2012-02-26 13:10:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Ash Stewart
Deen Wispa wrote:
Ash Stewart wrote:


But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.


Right. Because nullsec doesn't have spies. Seriously though, people make a bigger deal out of the spies meme than it needs to be. FW doesn't allow for sov and there isn't alot to be gained from spying other than passing off intel about enemy movements. And that's already gained by seeding pilots at various choke points in lowsec and reporting back in exclusive channels .

I would suggest posting Han's thread in militia channels as a way to rally votes. As well as telling corp CEOs to promote him as well


My point was .... the whole paranoia around spies in FW... not the spies themselves. If you got paranoia to the point that you won't trust your fellow militia-men, that basically limits the capacity of the militia in general.

Naturally.. Null sec has a lot of spies...

.................It's the eye of the tiger, it's the thrill of the fight Risin' up to the challenge of our rival And the last known survivor stalks his prey in the night And he's watchin' us all with the eye of the tiger...............

#55 - 2012-02-27 00:03:58 UTC
Revolution Rising wrote:
[quote=Gallactica]
If you can't understand what I'm saying, go to the next thread in the forum.
It's not some personal attack on corps doing what corps must do to survive.


Are you sure yourself what you are saying?
The Bloc
#56 - 2012-02-27 08:21:51 UTC
Ash Stewart wrote:
Deen Wispa wrote:
Ash Stewart wrote:


But seriously though... i've found the whole spy thing annoying and joined a null sec alliance.... there's that option for you too.


Right. Because nullsec doesn't have spies. Seriously though, people make a bigger deal out of the spies meme than it needs to be. FW doesn't allow for sov and there isn't alot to be gained from spying other than passing off intel about enemy movements. And that's already gained by seeding pilots at various choke points in lowsec and reporting back in exclusive channels .

I would suggest posting Han's thread in militia channels as a way to rally votes. As well as telling corp CEOs to promote him as well


My point was .... the whole paranoia around spies in FW... not the spies themselves. If you got paranoia to the point that you won't trust your fellow militia-men, that basically limits the capacity of the militia in general.

Naturally.. Null sec has a lot of spies...


You know who are the ones complaining about the so called spies? The people who want to provide an excuse for why they couldn't cut it and complain about it on forums.

High Five. Yeah! C'est La Eve .

Friendly Probes
#57 - 2012-02-27 09:34:41 UTC
Joined FW about a week ago, and it literally only took me ten minutes to figure out something that the OP couldn't figure out: You gotta be in a dedicated militia corp to access the TS and all the other goodies. Since then I've had nothing but small gang warfare and goodfites. If you want to stay in the 24th IC and then baaaw that you're in the 24th IC then you're doing it wrong.

CCP, I don't like the fact that the default corp you made for FW doesn't run on it's own like a well oiled machine. FW is broken. Delete it. Baaaw baaaw baaaw.
Thermodynamics
#58 - 2012-02-27 11:28:54 UTC
Tali Naraya wrote:
Joined FW about a week ago, and it literally only took me ten minutes to figure out something that the OP couldn't figure out: You gotta be in a dedicated militia corp to access the TS and all the other goodies. Since then I've had nothing but small gang warfare and goodfites. If you want to stay in the 24th IC and then baaaw that you're in the 24th IC then you're doing it wrong.

CCP, I don't like the fact that the default corp you made for FW doesn't run on it's own like a well oiled machine. FW is broken. Delete it. Baaaw baaaw baaaw.


Thank god, a person with a brain. (Amarr needs more of those. Huehuehue.)

See you on the battlefield, mate. o7

Sa souvraya niende misain ye.

Shadow Cartel
#59 - 2012-02-27 15:31:43 UTC
Tali Naraya wrote:
Joined FW about a week ago, and it literally only took me ten minutes to figure out something that the OP couldn't figure out: You gotta be in a dedicated militia corp to access the TS and all the other goodies. Since then I've had nothing but small gang warfare and goodfites. If you want to stay in the 24th IC and then baaaw that you're in the 24th IC then you're doing it wrong.

CCP, I don't like the fact that the default corp you made for FW doesn't run on it's own like a well oiled machine. FW is broken. Delete it. Baaaw baaaw baaaw.


I don't think Faction Warfare has to be all tough, closed doors fight club recruiting style though. There should be a place for folks in the general militia corp, in terms of meeting friends, hopping in thrashers, and seizing small plexes for occupancy.

I think the sooner we get a UI revamp with some actual intel involved that points players in the direction of the proper plexes to flip a system, spy paranoia will reduce as more battlefield info becomes open and public anyways.

I want to see as much info available as possible (within reason) so that players can find fights readily and easilly. This is the future. Each militia should know where it is being attacked, that intel would exist independent of player scouting due to automated transmissions and such. I think by opening up the militia UI and adding useful feedback we reduce the value of a planted spy, minimize the ability of a militia to "ninja-flip" a system without anyone knowing about it, and make fleeting with random militia corp members a much less scary affair than it is under current circumstances.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Minmatar Republic
#60 - 2012-02-28 05:34:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Mfume Apocal
Deen Wispa wrote:
Consider the Amarrian FW corp, Imperial Outlaws, and their campaign on TEST. Ilaw is a small 30 man corp waging small gang warfare on a major nullsec alliance with thousands of members. Their campaign in Otosela has netted them 500+ kills and 40+ losses. Not bad for a bunch of supposed noob pilots. It just goes to show what creative and cohesive combat unit can accomplish unlike those who suffer the typical lemming and group think mindset. Damn those Amarrian Ewoks :)


It's inconceivable how they even took those 44 losses, considering about 95% of their kills were on the station undock and they would simply store their ships when the tables turned.

Off the undock, they literally couldn't stop TEST from AFK sieging their pos(es) with a single dude triple-boxing dreads while playing League of Legends. That's how much of an actual threat ILAW was to TEST.
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