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Burner Mission - Ship advice to solo them including fittings

First post
Author
League of Unaligned Master Pilots
#1 - 2014-08-25 15:53:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
Topic will be closed soon due to new forum.
LINK TO NEW FORUM TOPIC



Burner mission guide
Update 07.04.2017
Full Burner mission guide with more details and alternative layouts
If you find any mistakes, misspellings or unclear advice let me know and send me an EVEmail.
If you like to have your layout added, i need of course the layout in EFT format a how to use it and the time to kill.

Advice and fair warning
– Don't blame anyone when your ship pops it's usually your fault. Basic Rules tl:dr don't get cocky when dealing with Burner. Burner missions are not your usual LvL 4 missions they are far more challenging. You’ll need rather good skills, sometimes pimped layouts and over-heating. Running them for the first time you may try them on the testserver first to avoid unnecessary losses.
– Many of you won’t have all V skills then stick with the more expansive pimped layouts until you know what you do

Special thanks to Ploing and Chainsaw Plankton for their help and Anize Oramara for her vids and guide.


Pirate Burner
Burner Dramiel Angel Agent – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Succubus Sansha Agent – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Worm Gurista Agent – Daredevil
Burner Cruor Blood Agent – Wolf
Burner Daredevil Serpentis Agent – Hawk
Alternative layouts
Burner Dramiel Angel Agent – Daredevil Cheap
Burner Succubus Sansha Agent – Daredevil Cheap
Burner Worm Gurista Agent – Daredevil Cheap


Team Burner
All Team Burner – Garmur
Alternative brawling layouts
Burner Hawk Caldari Agent – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Vengeance Amarrian Agent – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Enyo Gallente Agent – Enyo
Burner Jaguar Matari Agent – Retribution

Base Burner
Burner Ashimmu Blood Base – Gila
Burner Talos Serpentis Base – Vagabond
Burner Escort Dramiel Angel Base – Vigilant
Alternative layouts
Burner Ashimmu Blood Base – Cerberus
Burner Talos Serpentis Base – Deimos cheap
Burner Escort Dramiel Angel Base – Vigilant cheap


Important Links
EFT
– NPC stats: All Burner
– To get an idea Burner Video Playlist by Anize Oramara and Anize Oramara guide
– Old data but still useful Rudimentary guide how to blitz LvL 4 missions More information
– Cap stable layouts by Zarek Kree and Zekir Shardani

General Notes
– All layouts were made with EFT and an all V character designed for fastest possible finishing the missions. No Implants are needed, no booster or drugs were used.
– To optimize your kill speed or in case you can’t match the minimum tank use drugs to boost your tank and DPS
– Don't ask for Drone ship layouts, the AI likes Drones very much and on top of that is more or less erratic.

Downgrading modules
– Be aware that most pimped layouts increase your margin of error a lot and allow for some minor mistakes. Downgrading layouts work most of the time but you also reduce your margin of error. Downgrading is useful in lowsec and nullsec and might be necessary in the face of ganking.
– In pimped layouts with expansive damage mods/rigs you can always switch for cheaper ones. Sometimes you need to fix your CPU then via Implantat or CPU mod/rig.
This is only for professionals who know exactly how to use EFT:
In pimped layouts with expansive armor tank modules you can most times switch for cheaper ones but in addition you have to replace damage mods with extra tank mods.
In pimped layouts with expansive shield tank mods you can very rarely switch to cheap ones.
Make sure after you switched modules that your tank is sufficient and you still have enough DPS to break the Burner tank. Use EFT to compare the layouts.




Old links with outdated layouts

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar

Caldari State
#2 - 2014-08-25 18:21:56 UTC
Have you tried any of the other Assault Frigs?
Sir Livingston
#3 - 2014-08-25 18:25:02 UTC
nice work

Sci-fi games as played by an earthbound human in the 21st century http://www.youtube.com/JonnyPew

ChaosTheory.
#4 - 2014-08-25 18:30:30 UTC
You should have posted this in the test server thread , it would be helpful for all those people wo could not figure them out and lost a dozen frigs failing Twisted
League of Unaligned Master Pilots
#5 - 2014-08-25 19:35:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
Out of historical reason and to save all the links i put them here. The orginal answer is at the end.

Update 30.05.2015:
Rudimentary guide how to blitz LvL 4 with Burner missions and make ridiculous amounts of LP and ISK. More information
Patch Carnyx: Frequency of Burner Missions offered by level 4 Security agents has been lowered.
If you post a setup, please add Time to kill so we can compare it's usefulness to other setups.

Base Burner
Main post Base Burner ships recommended fittings and advise.
NPC stats: All Burner

Burner Ashimmu - Gila Time to kill avrg. 3:06
Burner Talos - Vagabond Time to kill avrg. 5:22min(includes looting)
Burner Escort Dramiel - Vigilant Time to kill ~2:35
Alternatives:
Check Main post Base Burner

Update 25.01.2015:
Basic Rules tl:dr don't get cocky when dealing with Burner

Update 15.01.2015:
WARNING: CCP changed the Pirate Burner Daredevil, they upped the tank a lot and the recommended Enyo does not work anymore. It barely works with ALL V stats.
Alternative Hawk tested it and it works fine
Garmur Update final version, recent patches nerfed the RoF for LML.

Update 30.09.2014:
Main post Team Burner ships recommended fittings and advise.
Team Burner Stats Made by jackudza, thank him
How to defeat Team Burner Vids Made by jackudza, thank him

Update 13.09.2014:
Pirate Burner Stats Made by jackudza, thank him
Update on AF
How to defeat Pirate Burner Vids Made by jackudza, thank him



Team Burner Ships used:
Main post Team Burner ships recommended fittings and advise.
Burner Enyo - Garmur
Burner Jaguar - Garmur
Burner Hawk - Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Vengeance - Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)

Primary kiting setup Used Ship: Garmur
Primary brawling setups Used Ships: Worm, Daredevil (Unified Versions)
Alternative brawling setups Used Alternatives: Enyo, Retribution, Worm
Alternative kiting setups Used Alternatives: Harpy, Retribution


Pirate Burner Ships used:
Main post Pirate Burner ships recommended fittings and advise.
Burner Dramiel – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Succubus – Daredevil (Unified Daredevil)
Burner Worm – Daredevil
Burner Cruor - Wolf
Burner Daredevil - Enyo Alternative: Hawk

Alternatives:
Burner Cruor - Wolf v1 and Wolf v2
Burner Daredevil - Enyo, Hawk v1 and Hawk v2


Orginal answer
Quote:
Estella Osoka wrote:
Have you tried any of the other Assault Frigs?

Yes, none work really. The major problem is the low sig + relatively high speed of all Burner, examples even with dual web+TP Hawk DPS is not even at 25% vs any Burner, even with dual web Enyo hits the Burner Dramiel never and so on. You need triple web so Vengeance/Jaguar might work, but their DPS is abysmal, Wolf and Retri suck because 2 meds. So whats the point when you can have 90% web + Blaster + Void.
Jenn aSide wrote:
You should have posted this in the test server thread , it would be helpful for all those people wo could not figure them out and lost a dozen frigs failing Twisted

Naah i didn't want to spoil their fun and i only posted today because tomorrow is patch day.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar

#6 - 2014-08-25 20:47:27 UTC
Jori McKie wrote:
Estella Osoka wrote:
Have you tried any of the other Assault Frigs?

Yes, none work really. The major problem is the low sig + relatively high speed of all Burner, examples even with dual web+TP Hawk DPS is not even at 25% vs any Burner, even with dual web Enyo hits the Burner Dramiel never and so on. You need triple web so Vengeance/Jaguar might work, but their DPS is abysmal,


Vengeance does work for the angle one .. allthough you need to overheat your repper/launcher or you will die:

Quote:
[Angel Burner]
Small Armor Repairer II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II

Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

Rocket Launcher II,Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
Rocket Launcher II,Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
Rocket Launcher II,Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
Rocket Launcher II,Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket

Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II


Against the Sansha, a retribution works fine:

Quote:

[sansha burner]
Small Armor Repairer II
Small Armor Repairer II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

Tracking Computer II,Tracking Speed Script
Small Capacitor Booster II,Navy Cap Booster 400

Small Focused Pulse Laser II,Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II,Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II,Scorch S
Small Focused Pulse Laser II,Scorch S

Small Anti-EM Pump II
Small Anti-Thermic Pump II


They both do work, allthough yours seem to be a little bit faster.
#7 - 2014-08-25 20:58:36 UTC
Thorondir 42 wrote:

Vengeance does work for the angle one .. allthough you need to overheat your repper/launcher or you will die:


Hm, thats weird, I used vengeance against angel guy and had absolutely no issues tanking him with single t2 sar and got him down really fast, like under 1 min - and with faction nova rockets...
League of Unaligned Master Pilots
#8 - 2014-08-25 21:18:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
Lugalzagezi666 wrote:
Thorondir 42 wrote:

Vengeance does work for the angle one .. allthough you need to overheat your repper/launcher or you will die:


Hm, thats weird, I used vengeance against angel guy and had absolutely no issues tanking him with single t2 sar and got him down really fast, like under 1 min - and with faction nova rockets...


Fozzie changed/tweaked the Burner two days ago. Maybe that's the reason, but aside form that the Angel one is shield tanking, so EM is its lowest resistance, i doubt you have killed him with nova = explo in under a 1min.
For all Burner
Shield tanking = EM lowest resist
Armor tanking = explo lowest resist
You need at least ~250 DPS (not sure about that anymore as Fozzie changed/tweaked stuff after i got that number) on paper that shoot into the resist holes of the Burner to break their tank, except the Burner Daredevil here are ~180 explo DPS enough.

The thing with the Daredevil is the 90% web makes sure your blaster have at least "penetrates" often "smash" hits and you are always like 100% of the time in optimal. The good hits add 12,5% to 15% more DPS with Blaster+Void that adds up into the range of 450 to 500 real DPS so the kin/therm damage output doesn't matter the raw DPS is enough.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar

#9 - 2014-08-25 21:23:14 UTC
Jori McKie wrote:
Lugalzagezi666 wrote:
Thorondir 42 wrote:

Vengeance does work for the angle one .. allthough you need to overheat your repper/launcher or you will die:


Hm, thats weird, I used vengeance against angel guy and had absolutely no issues tanking him with single t2 sar and got him down really fast, like under 1 min - and with faction nova rockets...


Fozzie changed/tweaked the Burner two days ago. Maybe that's the reason, but aside form that the Angel one is shield tanking, so EM is its lowest resistance, i doubt you have killed him with nova = explo in under a 1min.


Yes, the tweak changed the angel burner quite a bit .. way less tanking but more damage. Before the tweak, i had no problems tanking him for ever with one SAR.
#10 - 2014-08-25 21:43:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugalzagezi666
Jori McKie wrote:

Fozzie changed/tweaked the Burner two days ago. Maybe that's the reason, but aside form that the Angel one is shield tanking, so EM is its lowest resistance, i doubt you have killed him with nova = explo in under a 1min.


Thats why it is weird to me What?. I even warped into mission accepting that he will tank me (just over 200 eft dps), but he dropped like a fly and I remember I even didnt need to reload. Well, that was on friday, so most likely something changed.

E: I checked game logs and I indeed used cn nova rockets and it took him exactly 60s to die from first hit to last hit. Makes me nervous what other changes to burners devs did.
Caldari State
#11 - 2014-08-26 08:54:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Archetype 66
Jori McKie wrote:
Estella Osoka wrote:
Have you tried any of the other Assault Frigs?

Yes, none work really.


You can defeat them all with Assaults Frigs (even before Blood Raider nerf). Solo, no faction/deadspace modules, no links, no implants. Hawk can do the job against the Serpentis Daredevil, Wolf for the Blood Raider, and Enyo for the Guristas Worm. It needs overheat most of the time but with cheap faction + cheap implants, it will be a breeze, really ^^

i didn't have the time to test it, but I think a Retribution can kill the Dramiel and some have already stated that Wolf deafeat easily the Sansha
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2014-08-26 11:22:44 UTC
...and then they complain about PVE bein a min-max borefest...

Friends are like cows: if you eat them, they die.

League of Unaligned Master Pilots
#13 - 2014-08-26 11:34:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
Archetype 66 wrote:
Jori McKie wrote:
Estella Osoka wrote:
Have you tried any of the other Assault Frigs?

Yes, none work really.


You can defeat them all with Assaults Frigs (even before Blood Raider nerf). Solo, no faction/deadspace modules, no links, no implants. Hawk can do the job against the Serpentis Daredevil, Wolf for the Blood Raider, and Enyo for the Guristas Worm. It needs overheat most of the time but with cheap faction + cheap implants, it will be a breeze, really ^^

i didn't have the time to test it, but I think a Retribution can kill the Dramiel and some have already stated that Wolf deafeat easily the Sansha


Yes, different Assault Frigs work but only barely and in comparsion to the Daredevil they are bad, really bad. It is simple you can't beat the 90% web and the resulting DPS with any Assault frig.

- Hawk vs Burner Daredevil, your Faction Scourge Rocket volleys are 111 with TP+1x web, so it is 111/365, yeah 30% of your DPS get through. The Ishkur is way better.
- Wolf vs Burner Cruor, you are kidding me, Arti Wolf with AB+web can't hold the range at all, you will be neuted at 10km like hell. AC Wolf with 2x ASB and no web.... What works is an 2x ASB + web, AC Jaguar but barely.
- Enyo works vs the Burner Worm but you have to fit so many speed mods/rigs, not funny. It is inferior to the Daredevil because the base speed of the Daredevil is better.
- Retribution won't work vs the Burner Dramiel, you need triple web or dual 90% on the Burner Dramiel
- Wolf vs Burner Succubus, you need either AB+1x 90% web to get in range, so no AC Wolf. Arti Wolf with 2x webs work but you have like 200 DPS.


So, still none work really

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar

#14 - 2014-08-26 12:00:40 UTC
Does the Burner Worm use drones and does it have an infinite supply of them?
Caldari State
#15 - 2014-08-26 13:36:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Archetype 66
Jori McKie wrote:
- Hawk vs Burner Daredevil, your Faction Scourge Rocket volleys are 111 with TP+1x web, so it is 111/365, yeah 30% of your DPS get through. The Ishkur is way better.


Faction scourge + 2 Webs OH + rigors rig destroy it fast enough (before your web burnt).Try it.

Jori McKie wrote:
- Wolf vs Burner Cruor, you are kidding me, Arti Wolf with AB+web can't hold the range at all, you will be neuted at 10km like hell. AC Wolf with 2x ASB and no web.... What works is an 2x ASB + web, AC Jaguar but barely.


220mm AC Wolf works pretty well.

Jori McKie wrote:
- Enyo works vs the Burner Worm but you have to fit so many speed mods/rigs, not funny. It is inferior to the Daredevil because the base speed of the Daredevil is better.


Correct. But you can still it do it whith a cheap Enyo ^^ Although, you only need that mwd to put a scram on the worm. Enyo's tank is better and DPS is even.

Jori McKie wrote:
Retribution won't work vs the Burner Dramiel, you need triple web or dual 90% on the Burner Dramiel
- Wolf vs Burner Succubus, you need either AB+1x 90% web to get in range, so no AC Wolf. Arti Wolf with 2x webs work but you have like 200 DPS.


Will test it tonight. Retribution with 2 webs should be enough. I'll come back wiht report.

Jori McKie wrote:

So, still none work really


It works fine, and with the kind of fits you posted for the Daredevil, it does equal or better game for less isk ^^ Note that I didn't say it was the best ships to go for but just that it works very well unlike what you said.
#16 - 2014-08-26 17:18:37 UTC
Can add enyo as usable ship against serpentis burner :

[Enyo, New Setup 1]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Centii A-Type Kinetic Plating
Centii C-Type Small Armor Repairer
Centii A-Type Thermic Plating

Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Small Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 200
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier

150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Rocket Launcher II, Nova Javelin Rocket
150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S

Small Hybrid Burst Aerator II
Small Anti-Thermic Pump I

Warrior II x1

Time to kill : 1m17s so it should work with overheated m4 webs. Tank was generous, probably I could use second mfs but I ran out of cpu so it would need much more pimping. Deadspace platings were very cheap, so was t2 rig.

Btw I think that triple web hawk will be even better vs serpentis burner.
#17 - 2014-08-26 18:39:28 UTC
Do the burner's drop anything good? or just isk/lp rewards?
Pandemic Horde
#18 - 2014-08-26 18:47:19 UTC
Next up: ganking faction/ded fit frigates
League of Unaligned Master Pilots
#19 - 2014-08-26 18:55:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Jori McKie
@Lugalzagezi666, nice Enyo better than my Ishkur.

Hawk works nicely on the Daredevil Burner, question is triple faction web or dual faction web+TP both setups should use rigor rigs. I'm not sure if the tank is enough with those setups, i used one med slot for a kinetic ampli and it was barely enough.
Time to kill: 1:38min on the Hawk

Anyway i run out of faction webs on Sisis, so i can't test them anymore.


I did some final testing with Assault frigs, only Burner Cruor and Burner Daredevil need some more testing. The Daredevil still works best on this ones:
Burner Dramiel – Daredevil
Burner Succubus – Daredevil
Burner Worm – Daredevil

Burner Cruor
Hawk > Time to kill: 8:05min
Jaguar > Time to kill: 5:03min, 220mm AC+dual ASB+web
Wolf > Time to kill: 3:47min, 220mm AC+SAAR+400Plate+web+cap booster

Wolf is tricky read this
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4953434#post4953434
but use 400Navy Booster instead, because with 400er you will get 4xSAAR cycles through while with 200er only 2 at a time. Some math about heat and reload for cap booster and 400er are better even if you waste 40cap per charge.
Quote:
[Wolf, Burner Cruor]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Small Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Prototype Energized Thermic Membrane I

Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400

200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
[empty high slot]

Small Anti-Thermic Pump II
Small Projectile Collision Accelerator II



Burner Daredevil
Enyo > Time to kill : 1m17s, check this https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4954137#post4954137
Hawk > Time to kill: 1:38min
Quote:
[Hawk, Burner Daredevil]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II

Medium Shield Booster II
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Dread Guristas Stasis Webifier
Dread Guristas Stasis Webifier
Upgraded Kinetic Deflection Amplifier I

Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket
[empty high slot]

Small Processor Overclocking Unit II
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." - Abrazzar

Caldari State
#20 - 2014-08-26 20:11:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Archetype 66
Jori McKie wrote:

Burner Cruor
Hawk > Time to kill: 8:05min
Jaguar > Time to kill: 5:03min, 220mm AC+dual ASB+web
Wolf > Time to kill: 3:47min, 220mm AC+SAAR+400Plate+web+cap booster

Wolf is tricky read this
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4953434#post4953434
but use 400Navy Booster instead, because with 400er you will get 4xSAAR cycles through while with 200er only 2 at a time. Some math about heat and reload for cap booster and 400er are better even if you waste 40cap per charge.
Quote:
[Wolf, Burner Cruor]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Small Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Prototype Energized Thermic Membrane I

Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400

200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Fusion S
[empty high slot]

Small Anti-Thermic Pump II
Small Projectile Collision Accelerator II




I defeated the cruor with that :

[Wolf, Blood Raider Burner]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Thermic Plating II
Small Armor Repairer II

Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

200mm AutoCannon II, Hail S
200mm AutoCannon II, Hail S
[empty high slot]
200mm AutoCannon II, Hail S
200mm AutoCannon II, Hail S

Small Anti-Thermic Pump II
Small Auxiliary Nano Pump II


And the Angel Dramiel with that (1min20. Also I got AF lvl IV only ^^) :

[Vengeance, Angel burner]
Explosive Plating II
Ballistic Control System II
Small Armor Repairer II
Ballistic Control System II

Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
[empty high slot]
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Rocket

Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
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