Missions & Complexes

 
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Struggling to web the Burner Agent Worm

Author
Brave Collective
#1 - 2017-01-06 02:53:01 UTC
I'm trying to do Anomic Agent (Guristas) with a Retribution. I'm tanking his damage with 2 slots, so I'm happy with that. I feel like if I can hit the 13 km mark and web him, I'll take him out. But I keep coming up short! I can get to 4061 m/s overheating the MWD but I'm coming up short (or burning out my MWD) just shy of 13 km, usually getting into the high teens.

My Thermodymics is III (and training) but will it make that much of a difference for covering those last few kilometers? Is there a trick to getting that bastard into range?

I understand the Retribution is not the best ship for this--I just want to see if I can do it.
#2 - 2017-01-06 03:23:57 UTC
Which MWD are you using?

T2s burn out faster than anything else. You might want to consider a low end deadspace both for the extra speed and the extra overheat time.

If you're already using one... then someone else with experience will need to answer.
#3 - 2017-01-06 05:00:04 UTC
The most common "trick" is to get a faster ship. Barring that, then using a faction web or faction MWD. A Guristas web is currently running about 47M isk and Caldari Navy web runs about 53M. Both have an optimal range of 13 km and will overheat to almost 17 km. You can get a faction MWD for about 30M.

I know you're trying to run these burners with what you have on hand, but it seems to me that you either have to go faster or reach out a bit farther with your web. Once he's within 10 km, you can simply scram him to shut down his MWD.

In terms of tactics, have you tried to simply sling shot him? Fly away from him at full speed with your MWD on, then control-space and fly directly at him by immediately hitting approach. The MWD speeds plus the delay in his reaction will commonly get you into scram/web range momentarily. But I don't know if it'll work with the agility of these burner ships.
Brave Collective
#4 - 2017-01-06 06:09:05 UTC
Using a Coreli A-Type 5MN, good as it gets.

I'm using a T2 webber at the moment. Looks like that's what I'm going to have to change. If I faction web it up there, then I should be able to grab him.

Regarding a scram--I actually want his MWD on--once he's webbed I'm much faster than him, but he wants to orbit @ 39k, so he'll just fly away from me in a straight line, eating my full pulse DPS.

Still, this would be much, much easier in an Enyo, which I'm training towards, since I want gallente frigate V for the Astero anyway.

The closest slingshotting ever gets me is about 30k, then I have to just slowly close in the last 17k at about 1 km every 2 seconds. With thermo 3, occasionally i make it, but usually I don't.

I'll see if it goes better with a faction web.
RvB - BLUE Republic
#5 - 2017-01-06 10:34:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Ploing
maybe try a zor hyperimplant. this gives you a nice speedboost. as u also train into an enyo u can try a shield enyo.

[Enyo, guriburner semi bling]
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II
Vortex Compact Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Vortex Compact Magnetic Field Stabilizer

5MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive
Caldari Navy Warp Scrambler
Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster

Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Corpii C-Type Small Energy Nosferatu

Small Auxiliary Thrusters I
Small Hybrid Burst Aerator II

Hobgoblin II x1

unheated 400 dps. approach as you land with the oh mwd. turn on shield booster as he started to hit u. activate scram and nos when in range and turn of the mwd.

if something went wrong release the emergency drone and warp away when you lost the scram.
#6 - 2017-01-06 13:43:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Zarek Kree
I've been running it in one of the recommended fits - a Daredevil with a Coreli A MWD. 5945 m/s with my skills (which aren't exceptional). It gets me inside of 10 km within just a few seconds. Once I scram him, I actually shut down my MWD and can stay within 1.5 km of him while I blast him down. An armor repper and cap boosters keep ahead of the incoming damage just fine.

From gate activation to warp out (including time spent looting his wreck) takes me 2 min, 45 secs. It's about a 250M isk ship as fitted (making it one of my cheaper burner ships), but it flies this mission comfortably.


[Daredevil, Gurista Burner Fit]

Centii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener
'Monopoly' Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener

Coreli A-Type 5MN Microwarpdrive
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Warp Scrambler II

Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
[Empty High slot]

Small Ancillary Current Router I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters II
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I
Brave Collective
#7 - 2017-01-06 14:18:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Takh Meir'noen
Thanks for the fits, I see the goals with them, though they don't line up with my current skills:

My core is Amarr ships (Paladin mastery 4, all T1 Amarr mastery 4) and Stratios mastery 4. I just finished mastery 4 with the Retribution & Vengeance, so now my light missile skills are up to snuff. But my shield tanking is lacking, so the shield Enyo isn't going to work for me. I already have Gallente Frigate IV, so I just need V + T2 Hybrid Turrets to get into an armor fit--that's my current plan. The Daredevil looks great, and I'll work towards it at some point, but I'll be training Caldari Frigates next (since I'll have missiles/hybrids done) and then finally Minmatar Frigates/Projectiles.

I killed the Guristas Worm last night. It was tedious and painful, but I did it, with a Vengeance. Right after hitting Thermodynamics IV, I was able to keep the MWD overheated long enough to reach him most of the time.

[Vengeance, Burner (Guristas)]

Corpii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Corpum A-Type Energized Kinetic Membrane
Overdrive Injector System II
Ballistic Control System II

Coreli A-Type 5MN Microwarpdrive
Dark Blood Warp Scrambler
Republic Fleet Small Cap Battery

Rocket Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Rocket
[Empty High slot]
Rocket Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Rocket

Small Auxiliary Thrusters II
Small Auxiliary Thrusters II

It really sucked. A set of snake implants would have allowed me to run 2 ballistics and it would have been great then, but I just BARELY broke the tank with this. With the Worm scrammed it does 350 m/s which let the rockets apply for full. It took a very, very long time to break through the peak shield regen. Towards the end he would have a sliver of shields... BAM half the armor gone. Another rep of shields to pound through... BAM rest of the armor gone... reload, 2 pulses of shields UGH... it was terrible.

The Enyo I'm training towards (15 days) will look like this:
[Enyo, Burner (Guristas)]

Corpii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II

Coreli A-Type 5MN Microwarpdrive
Dark Blood Stasis Webifier
Republic Fleet Small Cap Battery

Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
[Empty High slot]

Small Capacitor Control Circuit II
Small Capacitor Control Circuit II


Hobgoblin II x1

It'll tank 184.6 HP/s of kinetic, which is enough to tank it all day (after my 4-hour slowboat to freedom yesterday I'm quite confident of how much damage it puts out). Pushes 4,364 m/s overheated, and can snag with a web from 19.5k out. Once it's webbed, turn off the overheat and keep @ 500m. Worm will fly in a straight line ~1600 m/s w/ 0 transversal. Then turn on the blasters, 314 DPS will break the tank without issues. 208M isk for the fit, and cap stable.
#8 - 2017-01-06 15:20:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Zarek Kree
That Enyo is known to work effectively in this mission. Though I've usually seen it with a cap booster to make room for more speed mods in the rigs. However, your fit looks like a safer - if slower - alternative.

The same goes for your Vengeance fit. Putting on a cap booster would allow for speed rigs that would get you in range substantially quicker.
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2017-01-06 19:39:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Muffinmixer
Zarek Kree wrote:
I've been running it in one of the recommended fits - a Daredevil with a Coreli A MWD. 5945 m/s with my skills (which aren't exceptional). It gets me inside of 10 km within just a few seconds. Once I scram him, I actually shut down my MWD and can stay within 1.5 km of him while I blast him down. An armor repper and cap boosters keep ahead of the incoming damage just fine.

From gate activation to warp out (including time spent looting his wreck) takes me 2 min, 45 secs. It's about a 250M isk ship as fitted (making it one of my cheaper burner ships), but it flies this mission comfortably.


[Daredevil, Gurista Burner Fit]

Centii A-Type Small Armor Repairer
Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener
'Monopoly' Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Corpus X-Type Armor Kinetic Hardener

Coreli A-Type 5MN Microwarpdrive
Small Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 400
Warp Scrambler II

Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Void S
[Empty High slot]

Small Ancillary Current Router I
Small Auxiliary Thrusters II
Small Auxiliary Thrusters I


I use a cheaper version of this but the result is the same. The strat is as follows

Pre-OH guns, MWD, Scram, and both hardeners. Set default keep-at-range to 1500 meters

When you land, hit keep at range on the burner and turn on hardeners, rep, and MWD. Lock him as soon as you can

When you are at 10km, scram him and TURN OFF your MWD. Stop OHing the scram after 1 cycle.

When you are withi. 3km, stop OH'ing the hardener next to your rep and activate guns.

Use cap booster as necessary. OH armor rep for a few cycles as necessary. Watch your distance to the rat and make sure he stays within 3 km. If not, either your MWD is still on and is screwing your ship's AI up or you don't have Navigation at 5.

Now, you might lose the fight even if you did everything right simply because you burned something out. In such a situation, I advise that you bookmark your wreck, quit the mission, warp back to the wreck to salvage whatever is left, and then go cry softly in a comfy pillow.
Brave Collective
#10 - 2017-01-06 19:59:37 UTC
My vengeance already runs speed rigs; the Vengeance just isn't that fast. That cap battery is the only cap mod I'm using, so it really doesn't matter if it's a booster or a battery. I figured up that my effective DPS on that Worm is 85.6 DPS. The Worm at peak recharge recovers 77.28 Shield/Sec. No wonder it took almost 7k rockets. Unless I can catch him to scram AND fit 2 BCS, it's really just not a viable fit.

The Enyo looks like a decent option for a couple of these ships so I'm looking forward to being able for fit one.
Goonswarm Federation
#11 - 2017-01-06 20:29:38 UTC
Takh Meir'noen wrote:
My vengeance already runs speed rigs; the Vengeance just isn't that fast. That cap battery is the only cap mod I'm using, so it really doesn't matter if it's a booster or a battery. I figured up that my effective DPS on that Worm is 85.6 DPS. The Worm at peak recharge recovers 77.28 Shield/Sec. No wonder it took almost 7k rockets. Unless I can catch him to scram AND fit 2 BCS, it's really just not a viable fit.

The Enyo looks like a decent option for a couple of these ships so I'm looking forward to being able for fit one.


Yeah, it's bad enough that the worm is fit to kite you, but it's also got an incredibly thick tank.

Just be careful with that enyo. When you fly frigates with an MWD they have a nasty habit of straying off the target, usually not a problem for most guns but with neutron blasters having such a short optimal you might find that you won't be able to keep the worm within range to apply full damage. And damage is so important in this fight.
Brave Collective
#12 - 2017-01-06 20:59:45 UTC
Yeah I already caught the Worm once with a Retribution and MWD+Web was absolutely perfect. I was faster than the Worm, and it just flew away from me trying to get to 38km. I just followed it at about 1600 m/s plugging away with pulse lasers. Unfortunately I didn't have any heat sinks fitted (I was testing if I could catch it, running 3 overdrives) so I couldn't even dent the tank. However I was just sitting ~2km behind him with 0 transversal for about 5 minutes till I got bored and left.
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