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Planet V Trade

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Stain Confederation
#1 - 2017-03-05 03:42:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Moac Tor
Greetings all,

I am posting here to officially announce our market operation, the aim of which is to provide a neutral offshore free trading option for all traders of New Eden.

We are continuing the good work started by Karin Yang whom I worked closely with in defending the original much loved ♔ Planet V Trade Hubs in Perimeter. I have been given permission to continue the operation under the ♔ Planet V name, and Karin Yang may in future return to join us in running the market hubs.




The Future of Free Markets


Nullsec alliances have been attempting to extort ISK from anyone looking to provide trade hubs around Jita. This is an unwelcome development indeed, and it is sad to see that some operators have succumbed to this pressure and are looking to pass these costs onto the trading community through high broker fees. Unstopped, this will eventually result in exorbitant broker fees as the nullsec alliances demand increasingly more.

We vow to never succumb to the demands of the null sec alliances by paying extortion money. It is all too clear that In doing so would be of detriment to the future of trading around Jita.

Currently our presence alone is enough to drive down the fees of all operators in the area, although it is for this reason that our competitors will resort to anything in order to destroy our operation. Be under no illusion, if our trade hubs were to disappear overnight, broker fees would increase dramatically. I have had confirmation of this from our main competitor who is struggling to meet the extortionist's demands whilst maintaining the current low broker fee being offered.




What We Offer


Planet V Trade will always offer the following at all of our market hubs:

• We will charge no more than a 0.1% public broker fee at all of our structures.

• We will offer a permanent 0.0% broker fee to traders who are willing to support us.

• We will replace any market hub which is lost to ensure you are able to continue trading.

• We will never lock anyone out, or prevent them from seeing orders placed in any of our hubs unless attacked.

• We will never pay a single ISK in extortion money to entities looking to make profit from traders.




Trading at Our Market Hubs


We aim to have a market hub active within one jump range of the major market hubs located in the The Forge, Domain, Sinq Laison, and Metropolis.

We have a significant amount of capital to invest in order to ensure we are able to continuously replace any market hub which is lost, and all assets can be securely transferred via tether to tether citadel docking mechanics. For those that are able to wait for 5 days you are able to use asset safety to instantly transfer your assets to the new market hub.

By trading with us, you will never lose any items which you store in our structures, and can freely recover them at any time using asset safety.

ASSET SAFETY
CITADEL SHIP TETHERING




Support Planet V Trade


The future of free markets in New Eden is at stake, and we hope you will consider supporting us by trading in our market hubs.

For further details please join the in game channel 'Planet V Trade', or feel free to contact me via mail or through this thread.


[Link to Latest Update]
Stain Confederation
#2 - 2017-03-05 03:44:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Moac Tor
Questions


How do I become a supporter?

Anyone who currently donates 100 million ISK or more to support us receives the 0.0% broker fee for life. The fee to receive the traders rate may increase in the future, although we will always be transparent regarding any changes to this rate, and any increase will simply be to reflect the cost to maintain the operation. Our core principles will never change as described in the opening post. And once you have the 0.0% broker fee for life this will always apply, and you will never be asked for any additional ISK to maintain it.


Isn't asking for only 100 million ISK too little to sustain your operation?

100 million ISK is indeed very cheap in comparison to the savings even the casual trader would normally incur, and does not reflect the cost of maintaining such an operation. Even so, this is not a problem as we have large reserves of personal ISK to fund the continual replacement of any lost market hubs, and so ISK is not primary concern. Our motivation is to prevent null sec entities from controlling the high sec market to ensure we retain a free trade area.

We would also like to reward anyone who is looking to support us as we become more established, and want to encourage trade within our market hubs as that is the best way to support the development of our operation.

Also by running the operation in this way we have received many donations of support well in excess of the 100 million ISK. The support is greatly appreciated, and keeps us motivated to know that the ♔ Planet V market hubs are highly valued by traders of the Forge.


Are you on the Haulers Channel's Citadel White List?

I have not made any arrangement to be on the haulers channel white list, although this is certainly something we could look into if doing so would be beneficial to anyone looking to use our market hubs. Currently a lot of offshore trade is done through remote buy orders, and in selling easy to transfer PLEX based goods. In the future I could certainly see more tangible goods being sold on our market as our operation becomes more established. As we are based within one jump of Jita for certain items it will certainly make a lot of sense to transport items to one of our market hubs to avoid the Jita broker fee.


Is there any way in which I can support the ♔ Planet V market hubs?

The best way to support our market hubs is to simply use them for all of your trading needs.
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2017-03-05 04:42:13 UTC
..Thanks for making this public and putting your operation out in the open to be scrutinized.

Are you on the Haulers Channel's Citadel White List?

Quote:
We will always offer a 0.0% broker fee for lifer to traders who are willing to support us.


How much ISK does it take to become a supporter?

Quote:
We aim to have a market hub open in each of the systems within a one jump range of the Jita market.


I don't want all the tiny citadel markets. I want to trade in a large market. The biggest reason Citadels haven't put Jita and Amarr out of business is because they are so fragmented, and none have emerged as the single top dog. The direction you are headed in will dilute my operations, why would I support that?
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2017-03-05 11:19:50 UTC
Fully support this service! My understanding is, that "Planet V" is primarily targeted at offshoring buy-orders and trading easy to relocate high price stuff in the PLEX category.

If you donate a minimum of 20M to the replacement fund, you get 0.0 fee for lifetime. I know many pledged more.

To reiterate the most important point:

Quote:
Be under no illusion, if our trade hubs were to disappear overnight, broker fees would increase dramatically.


Every trader whether using "Planet V" or other trade stations should have a vital interest in this initiative to exist and live on.

I'm my own NPC alt.

Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2017-03-05 12:54:36 UTC
Moac Tor is a trustworthy friend. He has offered me great help in organizing defense of the planet v trade hub, and he also has invested a lot of isk to keep this service running. And I think to keep this service runninng healthily, a service fee of 20mil or higher per structure is more reasonable than for lifetime
Stain Confederation
#6 - 2017-03-05 13:00:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Moac Tor
Karin Yang wrote:
Moac Tor is a trustworthy friend. He has offered me great help in organizing defense of the planet v trade hub, and he also has invested a lot of isk to keep this service running. And I think to keep this service runninng healthily, a service fee of 20mil or higher per structure is more reasonable than for lifetime

Thank you for your endorsement friend, and for your continued help and advice.

We will continue to keep the ♔ Planet V market hubs operating in order provide traders with a neutral free trading option, and we hope to see you back if you decide to return.

I have added a response in the Q&A regarding the sustainability of the operation.
Stain Confederation
#7 - 2017-03-05 15:04:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Moac Tor
Syds Sinclair wrote:
..Thanks for making this public and putting your operation out in the open to be scrutinized....


Thank you for your feedback and questions which I will try and answer as best as I can (I have also added the responses to the Q&A secion).


"Are you on the Haulers Channel's Citadel White List?"

I have not made any arrangement to be on the haulers channel white list, although this is certainly something we could look into if doing so would be beneficial to anyone looking to use our market hubs. Currently a lot of offshore trade is done through remote buy orders, and in selling easy to transfer PLEX based goods. In the future I could certainly see more tangible goods being sold on our market as our operation becomes more established. As we are based within one jump of Jita for certain items it will certainly make a lot of sense to transport items to one of our market hubs to avoid the Jita broker fee.

Thank you for this suggestion, I will look into this as we develop.


"How much ISK does it take to become a supporter?"

The answer to the question regarding becoming a supporter is answered in the posts above, and I will also add this to the Q&A section.


"I don't want all the tiny citadel markets. I want to trade in a large market. The biggest reason Citadels haven't put Jita and Amarr out of business is because they are so fragmented, and none have emerged as the single top dog. The direction you are headed in will dilute my operations, why would I support that?"

In regards to operating multiple hubs around Jita, this is done for a number of strategic reasons. As we do not pay extortion ISK we need to be able to replace market hubs efficiently when under attack, and by limiting ourselves to a single system it makes it easy for any potential attackers to wardec our market hubs before they are able to online. By operating in multiple systems surrounding Jita it makes it far more difficult for any potential attacker to disrupt our operation, and thus allows us to continue to offer our service. Any operation that is static will be at the mercy of extortionists and will not be able to maintain low broker fees indefinitely.

In the longer term then a single market hub will likely emerge as the most popular, and we will then continue to keep the remaining market hubs active in order to maintain visibility, provide confidence, and to dissuade potential attackers.

Also most of the traders who use our markets sell PLEX based items and so are highly mobile, and all of our markets will be within one jump of Jita which makes it simple to remotely buy items from Jita and then transport them to the market hubs for sale avoiding the Jita broker fee. For these reasons we feel this strategy provides the right balance between being able to efficiently maintain our operation, whilst still providing a valuable service to traders of The Forge.
Caldari State
#8 - 2017-03-05 19:16:34 UTC
Fully supporting this movement and using Planet V citadels for all of my high value transactions (mostly injectors/extractors) and all 1-range from Jita buy orders. Keep up the good work!
Trade All Day
#9 - 2017-03-05 20:58:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Trade All Day
What happened to the "we will keep our rate to 0.0% permanently (It applies to all future structures. This is not rounding down...)"? You seem to now be demanding a "donation".

Also, weren't you behind the Planet V Trade Hub that had random tax hikes to 50% tax? You kept telling people to continue trading there despite the tax hikes.

Here is another one from you where you encourage people to trade in the citadel with random tax hikes.

And another one: http://i.imgur.com/n7DrkmO.png

In each of these you knew that the citadel was scamming people yet you encouraged them to continue using it. Why should we trust you now that you have lost almost all of your clients?
Stain Confederation
#10 - 2017-03-05 21:25:02 UTC
Trade All Day wrote:

We are actually the successor to the original ♔ Planet V Market Hub which you linked, although we still offer a permanent 0.0% rate for supporters of the ♔ Planet V Trade Hubs as mentioned in the opening post. We want to be transparent regarding our fees, and by charging a minimal 0.01% public broker it will help maintain our operation in the long term without the need to constantly modify our fee unlike our competitors. Most traders will still be trading at the 0.0% rate though.

We weren't behind the imposter ♔ Planet V market hub, if you check that same thread which you linked you will see the following.

"Just letting you all know, this is not the 'actual' PV Citadel run by Karin (I know because I have spoken to him and he has not been playing the game for the last week or so). It is actually an imposter citadel looking to capitalise on the absence of the official PV citadel.

Double check any orders that you put in this citadel for the meantime as the broker fee is changing intermittently. A neutral alternative will be in place by this weekend for those who wish to continue trading safely at 0% broker fee."


I actually petitioned CCP to change the name which is why it got changed later.
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2017-03-05 23:40:02 UTC
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll
Stain Confederation
#12 - 2017-03-06 00:00:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Moac Tor
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do. Mercenaries will simply do what their paymaster asks of them, whether that be for good or bad.

Our current strategy doesn't require that we hire mercenaries as we are looking to keep our costs low. Although if they offered their service for a fee which is low enough for us to continue to efficiently run our operation, then I would have no issue in hiring them in order to help fight the null sec entities looking to extort the traders of The Forge.
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2017-03-06 00:07:59 UTC
Moac Tor wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do.


Before he hired the mercs to fight Horde, he was using them to bully other market owners into shutting down or raising their rates so he could increase his profits. So the extortionist was just replaced with another.
Stain Confederation
#14 - 2017-03-06 00:12:30 UTC
Battle Apple wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do.


Before he hired the mercs to fight Horde, he was using them to bully other market owners into shutting down or raising their rates so he could increase his profits. So the extortionist was just replaced with another.

I believe he had the mercenaries hired against him initially by a competitor, and he then retaliated by hiring the mercenaries himself to attack the competitor. You would need to ask him for full details if he is willing to divulge them, although I am certain it was not him who initiated the attacks by using mercenaries.
#15 - 2017-03-06 00:50:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Jarr Kaleb
I'm also fully support ♔ Planet V - Offshore Trading!

Moac Tor wrote:
Be under no illusion, if our trade hubs were to disappear overnight, broker fees would increase dramatically.
True.

Right now every trade hub around Jita (except Moac Tor's Planet V) is either ceased its operations\destroyed or is paying extortion money to Pandemic Horde. Planet V is literally the last oplot standing. As soon as it falls they will raise fees immediately and we will get similar fees like we have in Dodixie's player owned hubs.
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2017-03-06 00:52:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Karin Yang
Battle Apple wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do.


Before he hired the mercs to fight Horde, he was using them to bully other market owners into shutting down or raising their rates so he could increase his profits. So the extortionist was just replaced with another.

That's the story told by Ichooseyou, the one who surrendered to PH and then asked PH to attack Minmatar and Amarr player free hubs now. He sent mails to those citadel owner, "raise tax rate, or be destroyed by pandemic horde", and I kept the screenshots
#17 - 2017-03-06 12:47:27 UTC
I'm happy to see someone came up with the 0% fee for ISK. I'd pay ~50m/month to get that service, along with a mailing list that is well updated and transparent about attacks.
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2017-03-06 19:54:40 UTC
Moac Tor wrote:
Answers to Syd's questions.


..Thanks for the answers. One last question.

Do pilots need to donate 20M per Offshore Trading Hub? Or will one 20M donation cover all of your installments.

I'll contribute to your operation. Primarily because I think Pilots Doing Things In Space is good for Eve.
IChooseYou Holdings
#19 - 2017-03-06 20:30:38 UTC
Karin Yang wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do.


Before he hired the mercs to fight Horde, he was using them to bully other market owners into shutting down or raising their rates so he could increase his profits. So the extortionist was just replaced with another.

That's the story told by Ichooseyou, the one who surrendered to PH and then asked PH to attack Minmatar and Amarr player free hubs now. He sent mails to those citadel owner, "raise tax rate, or be destroyed by pandemic horde", and I kept the screenshots


Funny, since I have those same mails that you sent me. Remember? When you forced me to raise my taxes and said that, next time, it wouldn't be VMG that you hired to bash my citadels.
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2017-03-07 01:50:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Karin Yang
IChooseYou wrote:
Karin Yang wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Moac Tor wrote:
Battle Apple wrote:
Isn't it a bit silly to pose as this savior of free trade under Karins banner, when he himself was paying highsec Mercs to do the very same thing that Horde is doing now? Roll

Karin hired the mercenaries to help fight the extortionists, so that is very different to what Pandemic Horde are looking to do.


Before he hired the mercs to fight Horde, he was using them to bully other market owners into shutting down or raising their rates so he could increase his profits. So the extortionist was just replaced with another.

That's the story told by Ichooseyou, the one who surrendered to PH and then asked PH to attack Minmatar and Amarr player free hubs now. He sent mails to those citadel owner, "raise tax rate, or be destroyed by pandemic horde", and I kept the screenshots


Funny, since I have those same mails that you sent me. Remember? When you forced me to raise my taxes and said that, next time, it wouldn't be VMG that you hired to bash my citadels.


Interesting, I didn't deny that you're my enemy, but where is the screenshot of that said mail? Anyway, at least you have admitted you're PH's pet, and are killing citadels in other regions to raise rate.
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