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  • Date of Birth: 2011-05-31 20:50
  • First Forum Visit: 2011-09-06 16:45
  • Number of Posts: 11,333
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Jonah Gravenstein

Security Status 5.0
  • Machiavellian Space Bastards Member since

Last 20 Posts

  • Ships/drones/something and mecha in EVE Communication Center

    Agent 5B wrote:
    I understood that reference.

    2000AD represent.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Zander Moreau wrote:
    Hazel TuckerTS wrote:

    I love goonies, almost was one years ago...buzz buzz

    And how bad do you have to be for Goonswarm to deny your application again?

    They probably enacted the no scrubs emergency protocol for it.

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Mister Tuggles wrote:
    The main use I've seen for alphas is for players to create throw away catalyst gank squads. This can be seen with the huge uptick in suicide ganking since the release of the alpha and omega states. If CCP wants to start retaining players they need to start taking a hard line stance against extended bumping (more than 2-3 minutes), significantly reduce the 15 minute conflict timer you get if someone engages you that you don't even lock up in high sec space, and start to pull some of the wealth out of Null/make nullsec more dangerous. Right now it is the rich kid's playground that has almost 0 risk but immense rewards.

    Despite suicide ganking with alphas requiring multiple ships and resulting in Concord killing the active participants, Concord are killing less people than they have done in the past.

    Graphporn of current data from Zkill shows an overall downwards trend. The larger spikes in Concord activity are Burn X events.

    TL;DR What huge uptick in suicide ganking?

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Rivet Alene wrote:
    As I understand it, I need to train skills I don't understand, for several months, before I can actually do something in "less-than-high-sec" (well, besides getting killed, that is Roll )
    My hope is, I don't get bored with this high-sec-grinding, before that.
    Wrong mindset, you can live anywhere in Eve from day one, however it's very unlikely that you can do it alone.

    Don't get stuck in the fallacy of I need X SP to go somewhere, it'll kill the game for you. If you want to avoid the grind, get your ass out to nullsec. Pandemic Horde, Brave Newbies, TEST Alliance and KarmaFleet all welcome players like yourself with open arms. You won't be alone, you won't be struggling for isk, you'll have access to years of accumulated knowledge about everything Eve; you will get used as cannon fodder, you will make friends, you will explode and you will have fun.

    I don't mind the PVP - Got killed once, and the attacker ("Shadow Healer" or something) took the time to explain to me what I had done wrong and what I could do to prevent being such an easy target; Learned more in these 10 minutes than a whole week of mission running Big smile.
    You learnt an important lesson, namely that the bad guys are often more than willing to explain how they managed to kill you, and how you can make it harder for them to do it next time.

    For any other newbies reading this.

    Ask questions, after being explosively separated from your ship offer a GF in local and you'll often get a positive response, if you whine and rage you will become an object of ridicule; if you get podded this also applies to sending an Evemail.

    It's just that I can't really afford this "loose ship, buy new ship, buy fitting, rinse and repeat", if it happens too often.
    I'm a casual player (Big house, Demanding job, Big and Demanding wife) so cannot invest endless hours mining to get the ISK
    If you enjoy mining go for it, but be aware that it's the McJob of Eve and that the refining taxes can be painful, the connections skill will reduce them somewhat as well as possibly open up the next level of missions to you.

    If you're short of isk and haven't already done so, hit f12 ingame and look for the tutorial agents, completing those gives free ships and a decent amount of isk to get you started, as well as going someway towards standings (see connections skill). The Sisters of Eve Epic Arc is also worth doing for the mission rewards, which are 30ish Million IIRC.

    Many of us are casual players, kids, work, wife aggro, bills etc; personally I rarely manage more than a few hours a week these days due to RL commitments.

    Really appreciate what was mentioned earlier, that goonswarm (is that a coorporation?) hands you ships for free, but I feel I should somehow be able to fund my own ships and pay for my own mistakes.

    Kind Regards
    Goonswarm are one of the bogeymen of Eve, everybody loves to hate them; despite claiming to be terrible at Eve they're successful at it too.

    Ship replacement is up to you, if you join a corp with a Ship Replacement Program it's generally confined to PvP ops and certain fits, however as a newbie you'll get given frigates etc to get involved with those PvP ops without being constrained by your wallet; holding down an expensive kill for everybody else tends to make your financial situation a little less tight too.

    PvE losses are generally your responsibility, but some corps may keep a stock of frigates and destroyers available to newbies either free or at heavily discounted prices.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    ^^ The only tosser in the thread.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Sere O'Asis wrote:
    Sivar Ahishatsu wrote:
    Zander Moreau wrote:
    Same old ganker rhetoric

    Your freedom stops where someone else's freedom starts. meaning that the you do not have more right to what you want than anyone else. meaning that the unnamed miner has equal right to decide to go mine and has a right to be able to mine without you coming along and preventing him to mine out of a self-established mindset that somehow the miner decided to become your victim the moment they embarked in a mining ship and unlocked.!

    This I feel is the crux of the dispute.

    "Your freedom stops where someone else's freedom starts" is applicable in real life if your local courts/government agree, it is not applicable to the game as it is currently sold.

    "meaning that the you do not have more right to what you want than anyone else" I am not disputing this.

    "meaning that the unnamed miner has equal right to decide to go mine" absolutely agree.

    "and has a right to be able to mine without you coming along and preventing him to mine" this does not exist in game as the game is currently.

    EVE Online, I'll quote again, "In EVE Online, any player may attack any other player if they choose to, no matter where they happen to be. This is because EVE Online is essentially a PvP (Player versus Player) game at its core." This is from page 15, of the EVE-Online New Pilot FAQ. Here is the link: https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/communityassets/pdf/EVE-Online-New-Pilot-FAQ.pdf

    The gameplay you advocate so passionately for, in the quoted post, does not exist in EVE Online currently. It may never exist. Any character in this game can at any time violence any other character......if the other character......is so situationally blind as to allow it.

    Every player can take steps to pursue their desired type of gameplay, but must contend with the gameplay of every other player. Each player must decide for themself how they will contest each situation in which they find themselves. Will they be informed? React? Retaliate? Will they seek the counsel of others? Form groups for support? Or hide in the sand? But this game is a sand box, not a bottomless sand pit.

    In EVE Online not only do you confront other players, but you confront your own character.

    Not empty quoting.

    From page 21 of the new player FAQ.

    Furthermore, as we mentioned previously, once you enter New Eden you must consider every action you take as a form of PvP since this is the core game concept. In the asteroid field you’re competing with other pilots to obtain resources; you may also have to defend against ore thieves. On the market you battle for control of the economy in certain areas; for the supply and demand of your products versus other aspiring tycoons. On the battlefield you may fight for glory, for money, or for the right to rule whole areas of space. As always in EVE, it’s your choice.
    TL;DR Eve is first and foremost a PvP game, one in which everything is PvP; it's not limited to shooting other people in the face.

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Teckos Pech wrote:
    Trasch Taranogas wrote:
    Rroff wrote:
    require the resources of an experienced player with either lots of alts or an active corp behind them to carry out - which many newer players might not have access to.

    Yep, this is the hard part too. You are too small a cog as a newbie.

    Big things need small cogs too. Like I said Goons are very helpful for people new to the game from the Something Awful forums and then there are groups like Karmafleet, also in the same alliance as goons. They'll help with training both in getting the skill books and in what to train so you can get into a useful ship ASAP.
    A ship that they'll probably give you by the dozen, fully fitted, until you get on your feet..

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Trasch Taranogas wrote:
    @Jonah Gravenstein

    You right. Here is where you oldies now what you are talkin about.

    Im still amazed why newbies are afraid to enter WH and losec.
    Maybe this is where the focus should be.
    I would hazard an educated guess that the retention rate for newbies that join from OOG communities such as Reddit and SA and go to nullsec when they start is far higher than that of those who never leave hisec. Part of it is the support network that the OOG communities provide for their newbies, in terms of knowledge, attitudes to explosions and SRP's.

    In hisec players are left to fend for themselves, they often receive poor information from people, who have often never left hisec themselves, in the NPC corps. Many of the player run corps in hisec are lead by people who are poor leaders, either through lack of knowledge or just being not cut out to lead. In short hisec is probably what drives more newbies away than anything.

    That said, there are knowledgeable people and social groups in the NPC corps that provide many of the advantages you get with well established corps that like newbies, and there are well led hisec player corps that do the same, it's just a shame that so few ever find them.

    Every now and then Im completely alone in a losec system, scanning and hacking.
    Despite being a mainly hisec player I do my PI in lowsec, because it absolutely sucks in hisec; Wormhole spelunking is also fun, I often leave an alt in one for a week to get the right TZ, and then I strip all the sites while they sleep.Pirate

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Trasch Taranogas wrote:
    How about this.

    Make Highsec antigank, let everybody live in harmony and
    AFK the **** out of this game.
    That would ruin the economy with a flood of stuff that nobody has put any effort into obtaining, and basically turn hisec into a PvE only shard. It also completely ruins it for everybody that doesn't AFK all of the things.

    AFK is not fun, you may as well not be playing at all.


    On the other hand, make Losec so alluring and profitable that
    you are superwilling to take the risks.
    They moved lvl 5 missions to lowsec in an attempt to draw players from hisec in pursuit of the higher rewards; it failed. PI is better in lowsec, mission rewards are better in lowsec, exploration is better in lowsec, anoms are better in lowsec, etc, etc. People still don't go there.

    Skip those lowtier ships. Let newbies get some decent ships
    and beginner skills.
    Newbies already have better skills and access to more ships than they have at any time in the past, many of us started playing when there were learning skills, skills you trained in order to train other skills faster, despite a SP speed bonus to 1.5M SP they took months to train; if you didn't train them any skills you did train did so at a vastly reduced rate. We mined in frigates, because the Venture didn't exist, hell many would have exchanged a testicle for a ship like the Venture to mine with.

    CCP could start people with millions of SP and access to battleships and they'd still demand more, because they'd still die by the dozen in entertaining fashions. The amusing thing is that the SP isn't as important as knowing how to leverage it properly; it's not what you have, it's what you do with it. Older players are better at most things not because of the amount of SP we have, but because of where that SP is placed and because we know how to leverage it properly.

    I think the highest SP on any of my characters is 45M ish, and it's an alt.

    Remove some of that "rock, paper, scissor" mentality from the dogfights.
    Everything has a counter, this is known as balance. Ship doctrines are constantly evolving and new tactics developed, it's up to you to figure out the counters; you do this by trying and dying, and then having another go.

    How about a panicbutton that will teleport you to nearest
    highsec space, with cooldown.
    God no.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Get away from the trade and mission hubs and Empire is a desolate wasteland. There's probably 1000's of hisec systems that rarely see more than 3 people in local, I know of entire constellations which have a collective number of residents in the single digits.

    Expanding Empire space will not result in a more widespread population, it will result in even more empty systems for those in the know to farm the shite out of the resources while everybody else clusters around the trade and mission hubs.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Hiasa Kite wrote:
    Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
    Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
    Having no meaningful interaction with another human in a mmo. It wouldn't be for me either
    A wise man once said that Eve is an MMO, and playing an MMO by yourself is like masturbating in the middle of an orgy.

    New signature achieved. Thank you.
    I can't take credit for that Sad

    In addition...

    I'm a solo player. FML

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
    Having no meaningful interaction with another human in a mmo. It wouldn't be for me either
    A wise man once said that Eve is an MMO, and playing an MMO by yourself is like masturbating in the middle of an orgy.

  • So finally people will fight against Suicide Ganks and Harrasments in EVE Gameplay Center

    Hazel TuckerTS wrote:
    a, b, c, d, e, F
    6th letter


    6 you !
    Oh I get it now.

    Does mummy know that you play adult games?

  • Alphas and F2P Have Failed in EVE Communication Center

    Infinity Ziona wrote:
    Jenn aSide wrote:
    It's 1600 EVE time, isn't it time for your daily rage quit and promise (ie lie about) deleting your toons again?

    Tommorow maybe :)
    3rd time lucky... I won't be holding my breath.


    If subscribers don't want to PvP why would you force them to or have them quit.
    If subscribers don't want to PvP, why are they playing a game that is first and foremost a PvP game?

    Lets not forget that PvP in Eve isn't limited to shooting each other in the face.

    Like I said there are 7000 systems designed for PvP. 8000 if you declare war.
    Wrong, every system in Eve is designed for PvP, CCP have specifically created mechanics such as crimewatch to facilitate PvP being possible in every single one of the player accessible systems.

    The only way to increase sub's is to target non pvprs . its a no brainer which doesn't bode well for the nay sayers.
    Yeah great idea, CCP should dumb the game down to the extent where hisec is essentially a PvE realm and the game becomes just another generic MMO set in space, and is doomed to fail like all the other spaceship games that were going to kill Eve.


  • Suicide Gankers in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Dom Arkaral wrote:
    CONCORD is only there to punish... not to protect :)
    Further correction.

    They do protect one thing, and one thing only, as revealed long ago in the following post.

    Concord Guy's Cousin wrote:
    My cousin, Angry Concord Guy, would like to point out that Concord are only responsible for the punishment of criminals, that is their sole remit when it comes to dealing with capsuleers.

    The only things that Concord protects are beyond the door, especially the donut shops that can be found on level 2 of the food mall present in every station.

    It is a capsuleers responsibility to provide for their own protection, as far as Concord is concerned those that fail to do so may as well turn in their implants and clones and resume life as a mortal.

  • Suspect Timer (lvl2) for better interaction, pvp&fun in EVE Technology and Research Center

    We did this idea a couple of weeks ago, it was shite and unnecessarily punitive then, it's still shite and unnecessarily punitive now.

    You and your ilk are constantly claiming that ganking doesn't have risks and consequences, yet you're afraid to incur those 'non existent' risks and consequences Shocked

    If you want to make life more difficult for gankers, try thinking about how you play and what you do with your stuff. The nature of the sandbox is such that the level of risk and consequence, over and above that provided by the game engine, is entirely up to you.

  • Suicide Gankers in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Otlichnick wrote:
    If gankers were put to a stop it would be easier to mine. Prices would drop for minerals. Ships would be come cheeper.

    What is the problem with that.

    Sounds more like content for other people that actually declare war or live in lawless space. More bang for their buck when they plex and more opportunity for engaging game play instead of the ganking 12 on 1 playstyle.
    It's already easy to mine, and in as close to complete safety as you can get without CCP locking people to green in hisec, it's called paying attention to your environment using all the tools that are at your disposal.

    How can i be what is wrong with this game when when this game first started there wernt whole gangs running around wasting ships killing haulers and the game was friggen great then. Highsec was safe. No one was complaining. Content was being created easily.

    Now you say how Ganking is essential to eve. That is the biggest made up bs i have ever heard. No one is buying that.
    When was this? Ganking has been in Eve since beta.

    Its ruining experiences for lots of players before they even try to have an experience. They are getting ready to have fun and get blown out of the sky before it happens. Really there is no worse game experience when a large group of people prey on individuals for a profession with out risk or repercussion. You have a monopoly on highsec space. These arbitrary rules of how much will get ganked and when can change at any point and for any reason.
    There most certainly is risk involved in suicide ganking, and there are repercussions too. If you feel that the risk and repercussions aren't enough then it is up to you to make them harsher, you already have the tools to do this.

    The people getting ganked are not dumb. They are not lazy. They are just NOT INTERESTED is griefing.
    I'm pretty sure that doing anything AFK in a PvP game is considered dumb and lazy, putting eleventy billion isk in an unescorted freighter in a full loot PvP game is also considered dumb, especially if the pilot autopillocks it into a chokepoint or hub.

    Some of us are informed and know about ganking some do not or think its really not worth the effort to protect against since they will not survive no matter the amount of preparation which ofc is true.
    Risk mitigation isn't risk elimination, 99.5% of the time the fact that I'm at the keyboard, not packed with shinies, have a respectable tank, know who to look for etc means that someone else gets ganked; nothing is guaranteed but you can tilt the odds considerably in your favour by not being foolish with your stuff.

  • Suicide Gankers in EVE Technology and Research Center

    ^^ Likewise, I classify myself as a noncombatant in terms of shooting others in the face. Unlike the hapless folks that keep feeding easy kills to the suicide gankers I take care to protect my stuff. The competition exploding at the hands of predators presents opportunity for those of us not dumb enough to be them.

    Not being ganked because you're smarter, faster, harder to kill and generally more prepared than the other guy is as much PvP as ganking the guy that isn't.

    In a game of cat and mouse there is no shame in being the better mouse. ~ one of Eve's great lowsec industrialists.

  • Suicide Gankers in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Sally Clay wrote:
    ccp need remove lowsec tags for clean sec. status
    few years ago before that tags was added balance with gank&punishment was ok
    you shoot someone > ok > then go to lowsec and clean ur ss > SPEND UR TIME < most important thing
    What we see now? gankers kill whatever they want don't care about ss coz u easy fly to near hub just buy tags and few minute later ur ss clean and u can kill next freighter, barge, e.t.c. < it's broken
    Very few gankers bother with tags, something like 90% of the people that regularly gank with CODE. have outlaw status and can be shot at anytime.

    What is broken is people thinking that hisec is a safe place to stuff their ships with shinies and use autopillock or otherwise go afk in space; despite CCP stating repeatedly that Eve is a PvP game and that nowhere is safe.

    If people want to be safe in Eve then it's up to them to make themselves safe, not CCP. If all of the whining wazzocks stopped doing stupid shite with their spaceships, their spaceships wouldn't explode as much.

  • If CODE owns highsec... in EVE Communication Center

    Tisiphone Dira wrote:
    Alessienne Ellecon wrote:
    (like the anti-CODE fits developed by the Rangers)

    The who?
    Roger Daltrey, Keith Moon, Pete Townshend and John Entwistle.

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