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  • Date of Birth: 2013-03-08 08:49
  • First Forum Visit: 2013-03-10 09:16
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Tian Toralen

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  • Deep Core Mining Inc. Member since
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Last 20 Posts

  • EVE's appeal in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Rivr Luzade wrote:
    No one is going to participate because it will get disrupted immediately because -- as you mentioned -- boredom. And because the ships in these tournament fleets are easy prey.

    And just like in your older thread -- which you could have asked to get unlocked in order to contribute more ideas to the existing "I want Arenas" thread instead of creating another redundant "I want Arenas" thread --, the tools to create tournaments in game are already there. Will it be difficult to maintain? With the requirement of the possibility to disrupt matches that you yourself demand, sure, it will be. But why should it be easy? Or why should CCP setup this tournament where it can be disrupted? Just so that the players do not need to put in the effort? That's a sound logic.

    And just like in your older "I want Arena" thread: No, we do not need arenas. We need more people who actually do things in space instead. And we need more things to do that make people travel around space for meaningful reasons, like Random Agents in Landmark and Natural Phenoma sites.

    No arenas. Just safe spots "created by pirate factions" in certain low/null systems. Players can use these for their tournaments. They still have to bring ships there. Safe spot has a time duration, once warped in players can't warp out, and the game does not decide the winner. Whoever is left is the winner, or - nobody if both teams/players survive until the safe spot is gone and warp out.

    An in-game "tournament brakets" page could be useful, this page would be visible to players taking part, and it could be modified by the organisers. The difference from now is - those low/null systems where pirates give (maybe sell?) safe spots, would see almost continuous tournaments and duels.

  • EVE's appeal in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Holding space in a MMORPG appeals only to hardcore roleplayers. Besides holding space and participating in space wars (this is a RP thing), EVE offers nothing fun.

    PVE - try to rat anomalies, and you will fall asleep. PVE is fun only because game time and ships (ships wich should offer fun in game) can be bought with isk. So players accept the boring PVE, only for the ISK, hoping they will have fun after.

    Get your ship, fit it the way you like, train your skill then - participate in a fleet where you listen to orders for 1 hour. There is some fun/and challenge when playing logistics, where you get to use your own skills and make decisions, but not so much. Fleet battles could be replaced by a RTS where the FC just controls every other ship, because there is nothing for fleet members to do except - align, warp, target, shoot.

    Besides this, fleet battles where equal opponents meet are very rare. First I get bored because all I do is press buttons as ordered for 1 hour, then I get bored because the other fleet did not show up, or the other fleet showed up and my fleet avoided them. Or someone - the enemy or my fleet fough but it was one sided battle. And even if the battle is equal, it's totally boring. Just give the FC his own RTS.

    Then, CCP organizes the "annual tournament". I wonder why do they organize it between equal teams (in terms of ships) and in Jovian space where they can't be disturbed... A mistery! They should create random teams both in terms of numbers and ships, then show players the reality of EVE - a 30 man gatecamp, getting bored for 30 min, then cheering when they kill one frigate. Fleets in EVE are mostly social events where people talk and pretend to play a spaceship game.

    Short story: I ask again for players tools to organize their own in-game tournaments, and have some fun. I want to be able to participate in a meaningful and equal fight every evening, without the trouble of having to organize a tournament. I am busy enough irl. Else, - CCP should hold their tournament somewhere in null-sec, let's see how fun is that going to be and who is going to even participate.

    Another thread of mine requesting the same thing:

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    "I attack a newbie in a weaker ship to teach him EVE reality, that's reality man, that will even help him!".
    No that is not "reality". That is what you choose to do. I choose not to do that ever in this game because I don't feel like it. No matter how many deaths and loses I suffered because of people choosing to exercise their ability to attack a weaker opponent, I don't feel like doing that. Even if I have opportunity to do that.
    Others have done that to me, it was not the new player I can gank but choose not to. If there is no equal opponent in front of me, I will not attack him. Not because e-honor and other **** like that, just because I don't feel like it. Yes I'm drunk. Being drunk is not illegal. Yet. Feel free to be all goodie and correct and delete this post.

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    I see no problem, if players enjoy fighting 1v1, or 2v2 or more, against equal numbers of opponents. Pre-made teams, I presume - random teams will result in awox-fest, and the opponents can be random or pre-selected.
    Teams are formed, the pirate safe spot is created. Once the teams are both there they can't warp out any more, and the safe spot is unscannable for a period of time.

    There will be two modes: one with pre-selected opponents, people will agree to fight the other fleet, no matter the differences between them, and one mode with random opponents, where people will mark some checkboxes for example: I am in a frigate, I will accept a fight selected by the game ("the pirate organisers") against: frigates (number), destroyers (number), assault frigates (number) etc. And a (+) sign that can also be selected between checkboxes, so people can for example select to accept a fight against frigate (3) + battleship (5) or less.
    Maybe prizes or betting could be implemented in a way that can't be abused.

    I was in Brave, after a long break from the game, I decided to join GSF to fight PL, that's why I am in goons.

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
    Because eve is about organic unscripted fights an arena is in direct opposition of that

    But tournaments are fun and players can organize them? This means they are in game. Why is there an annual tournament held by CCP then? Are they trying to destroy EVE? Why do they try to arrange fights between equal opponents, why don't they just broadcast a random fight between random forces, resulting in 90% one side avoiding the fight ? Or one side being completely destroyed because they take the fight because it's the annual "real-EvE tournament", they must show something.

    Organic unscripted fights will still happen, players need to PVE to fund their tournament ships, and if null sec will be tuned so it offers amazing PVE, players will fight for ownership of null-sec, and there will be plenty of unscripted fights.

    And casual players like me will find a reason to play EVE, because it offers something fun, and the subscription numbers will rise, and they lived happily ever after.

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Rivr Luzade wrote:

    Besides, the real targets with PVEing are the defenders who engage your roaming hunter fleet, but all these guys are sitting in their arenas having fun.

    So what's your problem then? You recognize people would have more fun in tournaments that trying to hunt you down - and you blueball them because they got a stronger fleet, or the reverse of the situation. The only reason for people to stay on field - is sov or space assets like towers, CSAA, etc. And usually these are tidi boring fleet fights.
    But now you can always obtain a response in null, just bring a sov wand and you get your fight - if people still care about null. Whoever owns null is a content farm now, anyone can get content out of them with little effort, tournaments will not take this away.

    Every other space engagement is created by people trying to coerce content out of the game: gate camps, dropping on ratters, roaming trying to obtain a defence fleet (approximately equal fleet, else there is no fight). I don't know who finds these things fun, maybe the game is full of 5 year olds. "My ship is better, my skills are better, I blew up your ship that was weaker than mine! hahaha!", or "We are 30, you are 1, you jump through gate, you are stupid, we win!".

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    In case a system is in place where people win isk by winning fights, 50% of them will always lose and need isk for ships. For fights that would not have happened any other way, this means more ships destroyed. People will still need to PVE or defend their null space if they want PVE riches. Or maybe everyone will have so much fun with tournaments that they won't bother to PVE and will just buy PLEX.

    This game has an amazing PVP potential, but right now it sits unused, like - here have all these weapons, but you can only have random encounters with each other, and very few times you will feel you are using your skills or the weapons.

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Rivr Luzade wrote:
    Tian Toralen wrote:
    There is no content lost from this point of view.

    No content lost? People like you would not roam ever again, which removes targets for roamers in many areas of space. With the lack of targets for roamers, the already tedious act of roaming becomes even more tedious, which results in more people flocking to your arenas, which in turn removes even more people from the open systems to hunt, which in turn removes a lot of content and activity from the game. If people can find easy to access and secure PVP in your arenas, they will not look for it in the open world. No content lost by the introduction of your arenas? Only CFC affiliate can fall prey to such a ridiculous delusion.

    For further information, please google the many arena threads that appeared over time in this forum and read up in them why your idea is horrible for the game at large. Your redundant thread does not make the idea any better or less damaging to the game.

    I am not roaming anyway. What you are saying - let people try to coerce content out of the game, and do not give them something they enjoy.

    People will still have to do PVE to fund their tournament ships. People will fight in the open world for other stuff - for the amazing faction warfare system, or to conquer null - if it would indeed offer the rewards or the fun to make people bother holding it. It should offer greater PVE rewards, for the PVP trouble it requires.

    I mean - people will use tournaments for fun, and will fight in the open world for holding null-sec as a source of PVE riches, to enable them to have even more fun in tournaments. For some maybe the PVP of null-sec is really fun, and won't even try tournaments. All I can see is people trying to coerce content out of the game. How is gate camping content? How is 30 people shooting at 1 target content, and fun and challenging? Or the reverse of that situation, or fleet fights where I just obey orders. I'm bored as I said, so - good bye EvE for now.

    The idea of an unscannable spot for tournaments, created by pirates with technology found in secret space place is outlandish?

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Go ahead, try scanning people fighting in safe spots now. Tell me how many you caught after 1 week. You don't understand: those people would not be there fighting in their scan immune safe spots if the tournaments do not exist, or if the spots are not immune to scanning? Just try to find them now, I wonder where they are. There is no content lost from this point of view.

    There will be players coming in and out of those low/null systems where the "pirate tournaments" are organised. There will be ships lost in the tournaments. More content for everyone.

    Yes, I know I can organize tournaments. Maybe if I drop corp first, then organize, then schedule, then oversee. Don't have time for that. I am not interested in any scheduled game activity.

  • In-game tournaments in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Casual player: bored again. Don't know why I resubbed ~4 months ago, perhaps I forgot the reasons for why I got bored last year. But EVE looks so good from the outside, and captures people's imagination.

    Fleet fights: I participated and struggled not to get asleep. Follow orders, align, target. With time dilation and potato mode - it's even worse. The "I was there" video is...misleading. I tried being logi, that is a cool thing to do, but lately I avoided it, so to not be an important part of the fleet. I am a casual player as I said, more than 1h in fleet is not for me.

    Smaller fleet fights: still it's a time investment, and gate camping is not for me. I participated in one of DBRB fleets and we were shooting newbies like "fish in a barrel", still I got bored after half an hour. I was just following orders - align, shoot, align, shoot, change ammo, etc.

    Solo PVP? Sure - and I will find one fun and satisfying fight once every 1000 hours.

    FCing - still did not try it properly, mostly because of the time investment needed. I can't take people out on a fleet then say I have to go. The fact that english is not my native language does not help.

    PVE: exploration is kind of less boring, still 80% boring. Doing anomalies is death by boredom.


    The single thing that would make me sub again: in-game tournaments. 1v1, 2v2, etc, based on ship classes. This means I could jump into the action the moment I log in, and have a satisfying game experience, a "fair" or "fun" fight, so rare to find otherwhise.

    From a RP perspective: pirate factions organize these tournaments in certain systems. Players go there, transport or buy ships there, then they wait in space or in station, until opponents are found by the game and are given coordinates to warp to. Everything else is details.

    The fight zone cannot be scanned. This is the biggest complaint I heard in the past about my idea. Solution: if the tournaments don't exist players would not be flocking to certain low sec systems to fight in safes and get dropped on in the first place. There would be nothing to be scanned down by the hardcore EvE players annoyed by my suggestion. But there would be more activity around that system and increased chances to catch players when they are not fighting. They still lose their ships when fighting.

    Once in the safe zone they can't warp out until the enemies ships are destroyed. Also the safe zone has a duration of ~ 1 hour, after that the safe zone disappears, and the fighters can be scanned down. There are no decisions by the game about who won, just this safe zone creation, the ones that still have a ship are the clear winners. This would keep things simple.
    Prizes and other stuff, maybe betting, can be sorted out later. Yes, I proposed in-game tournaments in the past, I propose it again.

  • More rewards for group PVE in EVE Technology and Research Center

    The chances will not grow so much. Just a little. And if you pay for 12 accounts, it's your right to use them as you please. And Ibises should be shot down by rats, so you won't be able to do that. Increase chances based on number of players present in the area, in a ship. And - these players have been there since the start of the anomaly. Programmers bussines how they implement this, to avoid things like brining 12 ibises just for the final boss.

  • More rewards for group PVE in EVE Technology and Research Center

    The extra rewards would not be much more, the bounties would be the same, just the final loot would be more. Not always, just a chance for more loot, according to the number of players in a 100km radius maybe. I don't know how they calculate it now, let's say there is the max loot that can drop right now. To that max loot they add extra stuff for each player present but do not increase the chance to drop. Or increase the chance to drop and keep the loot as it is.

    I only have one main, if some people will use their 1000 alts to get even more rich, I don't mind. This would encourage more PVE fleets. It's not like people with 1000 alts are not using them for farming alone places that are designed for groups right now.

    There will be more loot on the market, the prices will fall a little - nobody will get super rich farming with 10 alts (he has to pay for them). Isn't that CCPs view about alts - they are treated like regular players, even if only one person pushes the buttons?

    But the incentive for PVE fleets will remain, even if there will be more loot in the market.

  • More rewards for group PVE in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Rivr Luzade wrote:
    By group you mean someone's alts? I can have my alt(s) in my anomaly circling it in a ceptor at 100km and get a nice bonus reward.

    Yes, I forgot this is "game of alts". Still, there is more effort from your part, and you pay 2 subs, you are entitled to extra rewards. This is no more "pay to win" than the fact that 2 subs allow you to never be caught by a gate camp, if you want to use them for that purpose.

  • More rewards for group PVE in EVE Technology and Research Center

    There is no reason to group up for anomalies and exploration.

    The attempt to make people group up for relic/data sites failed because it was somehow designed to punish people not in a group instead of rewarding those in a group. People could hack the site fine by themselves, without the need for help, and because of this - the spew can system felt like a punishment - "if you are not in a group it is possible to miss loot!".

    I don't want to say make anomalies and exploration too hard to solo, I want to say: give extra rewards when completing them in a group. Or a chance of extra rewards.

    Why? People group up for extra reward, that leads to more stuff happening in space. PVE and PVP.

    For example - 3 people do an anomaly, the rewards from bounties are divided by 3, but also it's the time required - and at the end there is a bigger change of an escalation or spawn. And the escalation, if completed in a group has a bigger chance for blueprints or extra loot. In such a way that the total possible end rewards divided by the number of players are bigger than the possible end reward for a single player.

  • Variable sov defence in EVE Technology and Research Center

    ADMs are now tied to ratting, forcing people to rat or mine.

    1. Owning sov should offer more opportunites besides ratting and mining.
    2. It should not be tied to ratting and mining.
    3. Entosis links should disappear.

    How will it work?

    In fact there won't be any sov. Players would colonize space wherever they please, and the only indication they own sov would be the fact that their structures are there - and not someone's else's structures. And these structures improve that space, in various ways, and this is "owning sov".

    And all of these "improvement structures" come in various sizes (the same as citadels). And this is the variable sov-defence - if you invest more you get bigger structures, more defence, if you invest less, you get less. And these can be attacked only with ship guns.

    I am not talking about a return to the POS sov system. All structures in a system would be vulnerable, useful and in sizes ranging from small to XXL, and there would be no sov system as I said before. You install upgrades - you get better space, someone destroys them - you lose the upgrades. Why all this complication with "owning sov" and paying sov bills. To who? From a RP perspective this is strange. Maybe add a "flag" structure that has no role except displaying your flag near the system name.

  • Why do we need an abstract sov system? in Council of Stellar Management

    True. Let players place their structures - including those that require sovereignity now, everwhere they want.

    The fact that the structures are there and not shot down - means they "own" sov, or structures. If the structures are shot down, they don't "own sov" there, because - we can see clearly they can't defend their structures. Anyway there is no "sov" there are only structures. It's not like installing an anomaly generating upgrade prevents the enemy to see and use the generated anomalies...

  • AFK Cloaking™: Ideas, Discussion, and Proposals in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Teckos Pech wrote:

    Because if I don't press it at that precise moment I could de-cloak at a critical point. And why? Because I was a bit slow on starting my stop watch? And I am not even your "target demographic". It is ****** ****** game design.

    No. After 1 hour I said there should be a time interval you have to press the button, you are not deckloaked instantly. Let's say you have 10 minutes to press it. Then you get dekloaked. What critical point? Add even a sound effect to it so it allerts you you have to press the button. I don't care. Maybe even an option to log out in space after a set time, so if the cloak runs out you are still safe.

  • AFK Cloaking™: Ideas, Discussion, and Proposals in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Teckos Pech wrote:

    Edit: Oh and how in the Hell are you plexing 50 accounts while all your accounts are AFK cloaking 23.5/7? Hyperbole much?

    I don't know. Something something IWANTISK.COM maybe.

    How is requiring a key presss every 1hour nerfing cloak play? Nothing changes compared to now during the first hour you hold cloak, (I never used cloak for so long) then after 1h you get to press a key proving you are not AFK. During an interval of - let's say 10 min, I don't mind. If you don't press it - cloak just turns off, nothing else. You are still in a safe, and need to be scanned.

    A certain key indicated by the module, not any key (anti-bot mechanism). Who holds cloak for more than 1h without pressing any key? AFK players.

    There could be a mechanism to refresh the timer, whenever the user wants, then someone can do his stuff for 1h and come back.

  • AFK Cloaking™: Ideas, Discussion, and Proposals in EVE Technology and Research Center

    ADMs are threatened with no effort or risk whatsoever. It's enough if you can PLEX 50 accounts just to have them cloaked in enemy space. Perfect pay to win.

    I said the solution: cloak requires input at certain intervals of time (let's say 1h), and these are known - nobody will be deckloaked when he does not expect it, else cloak stops working.

    Some say: you need to be in a defense fleet to rat. Even then I don't feel I want to risk my Ishtar. I am not space rich. What about DED sites? What about moving planetary interaction materials? Nobody can move around, the intel does not work as it should with all the neutrals everywhere. I have nothing against them camping if they at least would put the effort to be at their computer every hour to press a key. They have a disproportionate effect in relation to their effort (0) and risk (0).

  • AFK Cloaking™: Ideas, Discussion, and Proposals in EVE Technology and Research Center

    Structure that can deckloak things: It's a nerf, unless it acts all by itself every N minutes, and all players can see this number. And owners can set the time interval. I'm cool with this. The AFK campers won't be there to recloak themselves - but it's easy to program a bot to press F1.
    Else, if someone is able to decloak me and I don't know when it will happen, it's very bad for cloaked gaming.

    I also support the idea of the cloak module requiring an input every hour. It will display a random letter after 1 hour has passed since activated, and the letter must be entered whitin 1 minute, else you get deckloaked. It's harder for a bot to do this.

    Or a combination of both: sov structure that broadcasts a "message" every x minutes, everyone can see the timer, message must be entered during 1 min, to keep the cloak going.