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  • Date of Birth: 2011-04-13 00:24
  • First Forum Visit: 2011-11-25 21:22
  • Number of Posts: 69
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Nair Alderau

Security Status 1.7
  • The Blessed Chains of Freedom Member since

Last 20 Posts

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    space chikun wrote:
    Mirana Rinah wrote:
    I'm with you!


    I can't believe I'm agreeing with E-UNI!


    We'll even support your right to wardec us and destroy our new, shiny, scalable, modular POSes.
    In the future, it won't be a pain to rebuild them after all... (*hope*)

    Naturally, we'd prefer to defend them successfully. ;) *blob,blob*

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Sorxus wrote:
    Gogela wrote:
    I don't think that CCP disagrees that POS's need to be redone. From what I've read it seems to be just a couple of things:

    1) CCP Doesn't think enough players care. You guys are doing a good job of correcting that here.

    2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months. I sure didn't come to EvE for the stations. Stations are a little more complex and require a lot of game knowledge to understand all of their functions... and to set one up you need to read a friggin' phonebook written in Greek. That's a hard sell to a newcomer especially. The real crux of this thread is whether POS's are going to bring in fresh meat or coming out with panda avatars or something will do better.

    ...that's the last I'll say on this. It's *popcorn* time for me.

    GL o7


    You are not completely right about 2nd point. I remember when i was rookie in this game, i've heard other players talking about player owned stations and control towers. I was very excited by the idea of having my own "space base", building it. Thought that some day i will have it, my own base of operations. Remember how awesome it looked back then.

    And now as a CEO i have to look after multiple POS'es and mark my word - i am getting tired of this outdated and incomplete game mechanic.


    This. If well done, the smaller/cheaper end of a scalable POS system would be HUGE attraction to new players.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Akyla Dey wrote:
    87 pages right now...

    CCP, have you noticed that no one's in here saying "you know what, I think it's fine", or "I'd rather you work on something else instead"? Even with the Unified Inventory debacle there were proponents of it from the player base. Most every major issue that's come up in this game has had people on both sides. This one does not. There may be people that don't care or that it doesn't affect, but everyone who uses POSs, even tangentially or on a limited basis is in favor of this. Please take note.


    Quoted with emphasis.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    BennyBoy Starhopper wrote:
    OK - I am not usually one for CCP bashing at all - I usually avoid it like the plague.

    However - CCP - one of your representatives lied to me face to face about this.

    It very likely is a case of he thought it was true and later on sbd else changed it. And mind you, it's not as if CCP says they are not doing POS in 2013. The question is how much (priority) and how exactly (iteration vs revamp).

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Borlag Crendraven wrote:
    Two step wrote:

    Lets try playing nice until the planning process is done, to start with.


    Are we talking another 6 years here or? Like said before, enough playing nice, it's time to deliver and stop making excuses. If they've allowed themselves to fall into a situation where fixing this is too much work, they have only themselves to blame.



    He means the planning process for the summer expansion, which is starting now and lasts a few weeks. Have you read Hans Jagerblitzen's "The (P.O.S.) Elephant in the Conference Room"?

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    CCP Seagull wrote:
    Both me and CCP Unifex are following this discussion, and will respond when we've had a chance to catch up on all of it and can address and clarify some things properly. Please see CCP Gargant's post: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2475724#post2475724


    Good to hear.

    I was always of the opinion that the POST-Incarna CCP was way better at listening to and communicating with the playerbase than the old CCP.

    Thankfully this thread has stayed very polite and constructive. All we are emphasizing is that POSes are probably the area of the game almost the entire playerbase wants to be properly done.

    Also think of the allure to newer players... Your own small POS (even if you can dock only 2 cruisers worth of m³) somewhere in a bookmark/safespot in your highsec system... It's not just an older player thing. Most new players LOVE the idea of their own little home. Just theirs. If it's cheap enough, they won't even ragequit when it gets destroyed after they've been wardecced. :p

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Finarfin wrote:
    There will be no major POS usability tweaks in 2013 nor will there be any kind of modular POS in 2013 or 2014. It was nice for the short time I actually thought these long asked features would actually be developed but then again I have to be realistic. It's CCP after all. Monopols have never been favourable for high quality work or innovation.


    Relevant: Hans Jagerblitzen's "The (P.O.S.) Elephant in the Conference Room"

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Hans Jagerblitzen on the POS thing.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Tover Chris wrote:
    mynnna wrote:

    In the interest of being fair and balanced I would like to point out to my fellow players that nothing from a game developer should be taken as a promise until there has been a firm commitment to doing so.


    Part of the outcome of the Jita riots was to be more upfront and honest with the playerbase.

    That means when you say you plan to do something, that it's not just blowing smoke up our asses.


    Thankfully, part of it is we also hear about it earlier. Just now, they are planning the summer expansion in Reykjavik, so this is just in time. I am optimistic that there IS a difference to the pre-summer-of-rage CCP. Post-Incarna it took weeks before we got any response from CCP. It took less than a day and the first CCP dev answers in here, and CCP Unifex apparentely is also aware (and somewhat responded on twitter - mind you, this week is summer-expansion-meeting-time in CCP headquarters, so many devs don't have much time between meetings to reply, but we'll force them to Lol) It is not quite the same old CCP. The CSM is involved in the planning sessions for the summer expansion this time - and they all agree on POSes.

    Really, our position ain't that bad. I am not having a complete deja vu yet. CCP can be convinced.

    The summer expansion shall include work on the POS system.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    mynnna wrote:
    To reiterate what I see is the problem here is not that they aren't doing them yet and (evidently) that they aren't working on them at all, but that they seem to see it as a problem that only affects "a small part" of the playerbase and so perhaps do not regard it as a higher priority item.

    That is clearly very, very wrong.


    Very, very wrong indeed.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Two step wrote:
    Respectfully (because you are a giant and can crush me), I think you misinterpreted my post.

    What I said was:
    1) CCP has decided to not do modular POSes all at once
    2) CCP has not decided what they will be working on this Summer
    3) CCP did say that modular POSes would matter for only a small population of players

    What I am trying to do with my blog post and this thread is demonstrate to CCP that #3 is wrong, and that POSes should be a part of the summer expansion (#2).


    Reposting this, because it is important.

    I'd add that I am doubtful that iterating on POSes as they are now can actually lead to the desirable endgoal of modular, scalable POSes that can allow docking, coexist on one grid and also be somewhere but just moons.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Everybody here, remember: We knew of this early enough. The design phase for the summer expansion is begining right now.

    Be firm, be constructive, be polite. Keep up a gentle pressure.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    CCP Gargant wrote:
    It is good to hear that all of you are so heavily invested in the game, and specifically in things that need an overhaul. You guys still have passion for EVE and that in turn makes me more passionate for what I do here. Furthermore, it would appear that Two step, albeit being present at the CSM summit, seems to have misinterpreted what has been stated so far. That said, I want to bring three quotes from the CSM meeting minutes to your attention:

    Thank you for stepping in here, it is appreciated.


    CCP Gargant wrote:
    From page 19:

    "Unifex: Once we have a theme, we can begin to thread the issues you've identified as needing to be prioritized into that theme. POS's, for example, desperately need some improvement. How do we fit that work into our theme? Maybe we don't do all of the modular POS work at once, but we start by making some modules, solving the hangar problem, for instance. But that new hangar module would also exist to support other new activities as part of the themed expansion. "

    This is a bit weird. I don't think you could start the work on (new) modular POSes and have them work together with existing POSes... but that would need to be asked to the coders/developers in charge.

    Overall, I somewhat dislike the approach of ... we need a theme... If you agree POSes need work... why do you just have to fit them in a theme of some sort? Just decide what your goal is and start working to get an initial base (mustn't be feature complete, just ready and useful and ready to be expanded upon - coexisting with the current POS system for a while).


    CCP Gargant wrote:
    From page 99:

    "Seagull: We have 4 things that are interacting [regarding the POSes]: the gameplay and design of the POS system, the role POSes play in achieving things in the game (its features), the technical layer (code) then manages all of this (which currently is old and needs refactoring), and art. Regarding art, there is the question of do you want to redo the art, do you want to show individual modules (as opposed to have things inside, like a station), and then you have technical issues, such as what does the rendering complexity of a scene do to client performance?"

    "Seagull: The reason there's a “no” to doing [Modular POSes] right now is that it was affecting all of these areas in a way that was too big to do at once. What you're trying to do is try to find a way to get what you want, but what we need to do is go back and look at how we can separate all these layers, and figure out something reasonable, and then have Art do something that's immersive and amazing."

    Nowhere has CCP stated that the Player Owned Structure system will not receive attention. Many of you have already pointed out that it is painful to use at best, a huge pile of unusable dingleberries at worst. Some talk about this being the "old" CCP appearing again but I want to assure all of you that the mistakes that happened in 2011 will not repeat themselves. CCP has only stated that THE OVERHAUL CANNOT HAPPEN ALL AT ONCE

    Okay, the currrent CCP position seems to be: "we will iterate on the current POS system and make it less painful". That is good. But in the long run, the promise of a truly modular, scalable POS system (including docking, multiple POSes on one grid, POSes not only at moons) seems incompatible with the current POS system. If you say that you can work toward that goal by just iterating on the current POS code... okay. I am sceptical, but willing to see how this goes. But the complete revamp, with old and new system coexisting for awhile, was more convincing to me. I thought that had a better chance of actually getting there.


    CCP Gargant wrote:
    I can't make promises for game designers or the people that make content for EVE Online. Please try to remember that. What I can do is assure you that your voices have been heard, the opinion of the CSM has been heard, and the concerns raised in this thread have been heard.

    Read and understood. Also appreciated.
    Just spread the word in Reykjavik that POSes effect not only a small portion of the community, but most of us. This is probably the only development decision that could receive unanimous consent from empire to null and deep into wspace. From industrialists to PvP corporations. As long as CCP knows that...

  • Dev blog: You have insulted my honor - I demand satisfaction! Dueling comes to EVE Online in EVE Information Center

    Bubanni wrote:
    I have a suggestion, Honourable duel tags on killmails... Thus a killmail that resulted from your duel is different, potentially a tab/list of killmails from these duels that others can look at if you set it to public.


    This, So much this.

    Just excluding them from killmails is obviously a bid idea, but a tag is pretty interesting...

  • Dev blog: You have insulted my honor - I demand satisfaction! Dueling comes to EVE Online in EVE Information Center

    Good change, I like it.

    But do sth. about POSes as well, spread the word in Reykjavík.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Finarfin wrote:
    Tikktokk Tokkzikk wrote:
    I belive you read that wrong.
    Here is what they meant:

    Quote:
    Unifex stated that what CCP did was spend effort and prototype what would make a good POS system. It would, however, not affect Dust 514 players. Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game that doesn't affect Dust 514 and delivering only that “is what will kill the business”. (page 37)


    So in the future the only worthwhile features that will receive significant Dev time must benefit Dust and EvE? Has CCP learned nothing from the WiS debacle.


    I actually doubt that. Right now, CCP is hoping Dust is successful. They don't know, though. They are not betting all on this new unproven game. If Dust in the future makes them significantly more money than Eve (big if), then things might go that way.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Zackgar wrote:
    And after 1000 posts, can we get an official CCP response to this in here?


    I want this as much as anybody. But sometimes I think waiting a bit is smart.

    The worst that could happen is that a snubbed CCP dev comes in, reiterates their current position and gets entrenched.

    Give them time to think it over, let our opinions sink in. Now, obvs., if they NEVER reply, that would be bad. But i don't need an immediate reply, I actual prefer not to get one.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Allucia Darkcreft wrote:
    CCP,

    I am a new player; I bought in to EVE after years and years of abstaining with the advent of Retribution.

    I come from years of playing virtually every MMO other than EVE. I have an MMO career that can be measured in decades. I have given years of my life to Zork, Everquest, World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy XI, Rift, Guild Wars and its sequel, and, most importantly yet not prominently, Star Wars Galaxies. Of those games, only my Star Wars Galaxies time is a time I yearn again for. That is because it was a sandbox that allowed true freedom, much to the same extent (though far further in its heyday) that EVE does.

    After years of holy trininty hotbar gameplay, EVE has me rapt. It's different. It's freeform. It's bold and ruthless, cold and merciless. It challenges me to use every skill I have in real life — social skills, business skills, and of course some level of dexterity and strategic thinking — to make a path for myself in it. It is a fascinating universe, and I hesitate to call it a game: it is a simulation of reality, and as a result, I am hooked.

    As a new player, I feel that my voice should be of utmost concern to you. I have not years of allegiance to EVE. I have not a swath of friends which keep me in the game regardless of the changes you make. I am the 99%; I am the non-subscriber turned subscriber on the verge of becoming an evangelist — an EVEangelist.

    To me, the thought of having my own POS is the current driving force. That's what I want to do in your sandbox. Your sandbox is sold as one where I can make my own way and do what I love. POSs are exactly what I want to do, and to think that the one thing that is propelling me in my newfound journey is not of consequence to you has me reconsidering my newfound addiction to your fine product.

    POSs represent what I believe to be the most unique aspect of EVE and one of its biggest potential selling points. The PVP aspects of EVE are well known to outsiders, but that you can own your own piece of the game world is something that largely exists only in the minds of outsiders as an element of SWG. I had no idea you could own your own chunk of space until I had already subscribed, and I would bet quite a great deal of money that if non-subscribers knew about POSs, and they were given the time in the limelight with a solid update, that a HUGE chunk of new players would come onboard. This would be especially true if the POS gameplay could offer newer players a way to manage a smaller base in high sec; something simple but something to call their own.

    Prove to me that you listen, CCP. Prove to me, and to the new players like me — the ones that you want, which will grow your universe and your profits and give you another ten years — that I owe it to you to give you years of my life, my voice, my imagination, and my money.

    Prove to me, and I will be yours.


    Quoting another valuable post, so it doesn't get lost.

  • POSes: I am a small portion of the community in Council of Stellar Management

    Biterno Sintaph wrote:
    Dear CCP,

    When I was a young carebear I dreamt of owning my own little empire. An empire consisting of beautiful Amarr ships, cargoholds full of exotic dancers, and some place to settle down and call my own. A "Biterno's Pleasure Hub", if you will. Some place I never had to share with any other pilot.

    And then I learned about the POS interface. And how long and painful it was to set one up. And how much of a pain it was to do things in a POS that would be fairly easy at a station. I decided it wasn't worth the effort.

    My point is, a POS revamp doesn't just have to be a "make the bittervets shut up already" feature. It could also be a "Hey newbies, here's a way to carve out your own empire that doesn't require the cost of a Station egg!" feature. You have stated in previous blogs and minutes that a major factor of EVE sales is empire building and empire crushing; giant null-sec fights of people attacking and defending the things other people built. Then encourage the newbies to make more things to crush.

    Please reconsider.

    Thank you,

    ~~ Biterno Sintaph


    Quoting a valuable post.

  • Why CCP Is Wrong About Modular POSes in EVE Communication Center

    Tippia wrote:
    Tippia wrote:
    A working modular POS system could stand a chance to become the pride and joy of the game, rather than the constant source of “fix it!”-threadnoughts that they have been for the last decade.
    Just to iterate on this point, the same thing could have been said about WIS, but there's a crucial difference here:

    WIS had no content and no gameplay attached to it.
    POSes already do.

    We already know what they're for and they are already a critical component in a wide array of different forms of gameplay. A reduction in horribleness alone would improve the entire game; iterations to add more functionality, to widen their usage to even more gameplay elements, and increasing the reasons for players to use them would inherently be a good addition to something everyone + dog uses… Iteration and visual upgrades (the actual modularity — the functionality doesn't necessarily require it) stands every chance of being unavoidably spectacular.


    So, so much truth in this.