# A data point in the whole 'who owns a wreck' debate **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [September 20, 2018, 11:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969 "2018-09-20T23:40:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![The\_Larold](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_larold/32/458090_2.png) [@The\_Larold](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Larold)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2018, 11:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/1 "2018-09-20T23:40:43Z")
I had always seen this debate off-and-on - does the killing shot result in ownership of a wreck, or most damage done? I’m not claiming to know what gives ownership of a wreck. BUT - I have a data point, my first, to tell me what it isn’t - the killing shot. Today I was hopping around doing event sites, and encountered a site where the BS was down to about 2-3% armor and 3-4% hull. There was no other player in local. I flew up with my piddly little Jackdaw and fired off a volley to finish it off. The wreck was yellow. Please keep in mind I’m not complaining at all. I was actually excited to see this phenomena first-hand (finally!). So, that’s pretty much it. Wanted to toss a data point out there that I can absolutely confirm: - I killed a ship that was almost, but not entirely, dead - delivering the final shot - No one else was in local - The wreck was not mine I’m sure many of you will chime in with jibes that this has always been known, but believe me - I’ve seen many people (forums, blogs, in-game) who believe wholeheartedly that killing-shot-owns-wreck. What I just saw tells me “Not necessarily.” ---
**Author:** ![Ganellon\_Devians](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ganellon_devians/32/13647_2.png) [@Ganellon\_Devians](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ganellon_Devians)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/2 "2018-09-20T23:47:35Z")
The “most damage done” defines the wreck’s owner. ---
**Author:** ![Keno\_Skir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/keno_skir/32/460582_2.png) [@Keno\_Skir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Keno_Skir)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 1:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/3 "2018-09-21T01:48:48Z")
It’s overall damage during the combat flag of the rat, not final blow. We used to do a trick to make people go suspect that relied on this principal. ---
**Author:** ![Noragen\_Neirfallas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noragen_neirfallas/32/375148_2.png) [@Noragen\_Neirfallas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noragen_Neirfallas)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 7:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/4 "2018-09-21T07:10:53Z")
Did it involve scanning down mission runners? 😄 ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 7:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/5 "2018-09-21T07:37:30Z")
Loot and tractor rights arent wreck ownership. ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/6 "2018-09-21T13:39:03Z")
What debate ? ---
**Author:** ![Rocket\_Hellfire](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rocket_hellfire/32/396905_2.png) [@Rocket\_Hellfire](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rocket_Hellfire)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 2:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/7 "2018-09-21T14:57:36Z")
> [@Ganellon\_Devians](#): > > The “most damage done” defines the wreck’s owner. I wonder why, then, does the the player with the Final Blow in PvP get the KM, and not always the player with the most damage… ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 3:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/8 "2018-09-21T15:05:42Z")
Because otherwise I would not be able to piss off war deccers by stealing their killmails. : - ) ---
**Author:** ![CCP\_Darwin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ccp_darwin/32/464013_2.png) [@CCP\_Darwin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/CCP_Darwin)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 3:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/9 "2018-09-21T15:55:03Z")
With regard to wreck ownership, as it turns out, the precise mechanics are documented on our support site. Normally, NPC wrecks are owned by the player who did the most damage, unless they were spawned by a mission, in which case the wreck is owned by the player who picked up the mission. PvP wrecks are owned by the destroyed pilot: > **[Container and Wreck Ownership](https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000597345-Container-and-Wreck-Ownership)** > > Attacking a Container or Wreck > Cargo containers and wrecks are considered valid property just like drones and ships. If a player damages either, they are initiating aggression on its owner. If this... Regarding the question of who receives a killmail in a PvP situation, that does not necessarily follow the same rule. Edit: Who receives a kill mark on a ship, however, is documented on our support site too: in this case it’s the character who delivers the final killing blow. Presumably the killmail goes to the same character. > **[Killmarks](https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us/articles/206403789-Killmarks-)** > >   > Players can see their PvP accomplishments represented as killmarks on their ships hulls. However not every kill will mean a killmark is given. Killmarks are only awarded to players who achieve th... ---
**Author:** ![Cypherous](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cypherous/32/499883_2.png) [@Cypherous](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cypherous)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/10 "2018-09-21T16:31:06Z")
> [@Ganellon\_Devians](#): > > The “most damage done” defines the wreck’s owner. Unless its a mission site, because then wreck ownership is automatically granted to the mission runner ---
**Author:** ![Cypherous](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cypherous/32/499883_2.png) [@Cypherous](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cypherous)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/11 "2018-09-21T16:31:24Z")
> [@Rocket\_Hellfire](#): > > > [@Ganellon\_Devians](#): > > > > The “most damage done” defines the wreck’s owner. > > I wonder why, then, does the the player with the Final Blow in PvP get the KM, and not always the player with the most damage… Because killmails predate wrecks 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Keno\_Skir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/keno_skir/32/460582_2.png) [@Keno\_Skir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Keno_Skir)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 8:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/12 "2018-09-21T20:47:58Z")
Not that specific trick no, needs belt or anom rats 😊 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Larold](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_larold/32/458090_2.png) [@The\_Larold](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Larold)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 1:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/13 "2018-09-22T01:27:49Z")
@CCP_Darwin - A sincere thanks for adding authoritative information supported by links. Not only did you answer my question - I think you’ve demonstrated why there has been confusion over time - different rules are applied in different situations. Thanks again for the clarification(s)! ---
**Author:** ![Isaac\_Galang](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isaac_galang/32/370906_2.png) [@Isaac\_Galang](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Isaac_Galang)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 2:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/14 "2018-09-22T02:35:24Z")
Most damage? So waiting for that swarm overmind or that Outuni Mesen to hit armor before unloading alpha on it is pointless? Or does wreck ownership /= who has rights to the event loot or wins an incursion contest? ---
**Author:** ![CCP\_Darwin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ccp_darwin/32/464013_2.png) [@CCP\_Darwin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/CCP_Darwin)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 10:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/15 "2018-09-22T10:58:53Z")
Based on what’s in that article, if you are competing with another player for ownership of the wreck of an NPC that drops loot, you’ll definitely want to start applying damage as early as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Noragen\_Neirfallas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noragen_neirfallas/32/375148_2.png) [@Noragen\_Neirfallas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noragen_Neirfallas)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 11:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/16 "2018-09-22T11:53:24Z")
And people say CCP don’t read the forums or interact with the community here ---
**Author:** ![Krysenth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/krysenth/32/58194_2.png) [@Krysenth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Krysenth)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 12:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/17 "2018-09-22T12:08:09Z")
> [@CCP\_Darwin](#): > > Regarding the question of who receives a killmail in a PvP situation, that does not necessarily follow the same rule. It goes to whoever landed the final blow because in the grand scheme of things, _they were the one who successfully landed the killing blow_, irrespective of how much damage they’ve dealt. ---
**Author:** ![Isaac\_Galang](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isaac_galang/32/370906_2.png) [@Isaac\_Galang](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Isaac_Galang)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 12:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/18 "2018-09-22T12:32:14Z")
Oh so it’s really not last-hit for wreck ownership. Thanks for clearing that up! Now if only I could get a firm answer on how incursion contests are judged, because if this also applies there, then alphaing Machs have Brennan contesting wrong this whole time. ---
**Author:** ![March\_rabbit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/march_rabbit/32/453160_2.png) [@March\_rabbit](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/March_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 12:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/19 "2018-09-22T12:48:46Z")
Could you please describe what happened in OP’s example? ---
**Author:** ![CCP\_Darwin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ccp_darwin/32/464013_2.png) [@CCP\_Darwin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/CCP_Darwin)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2018, 1:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969/20 "2018-09-22T13:06:17Z")
> [@March\_rabbit](#): > > Could you please describe what happened in OP’s example? Sure. Another player comes in and attacks the NPC, getting it down pretty low but not killing it. They leave or log off or their baby pulls their internet cable out of the wall and they get disconnected. OP comes along and finishes off the NPC, but does less damage than the first player. Wreck ownership then gets assigned to the first player, not the OP, since they did more damage to the NPC. [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-data-point-in-the-whole-who-owns-a-wreck-debate/107969.md?page=2)