# Alpha clone suicide ganking need to stop! **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 1, 2020, 7:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191 "2020-03-01T19:50:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 9:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/286 "2020-03-11T21:55:47Z")
> [@Wadiest\_Yong](#): > > Okay, now verbatim. “ \*(4:33) Unfortunately we lose quite a bit of players in the first three months. I don’t want to blame you guys, but you don’t necessarily treat them nice… (5:42) What you guys can do though, treat them nice for the first three months. (…) _Not only target the prey when it’s young and fragile, but make it grow, help it to understand. And then … the prey is much bigger_ \* is literally and verifiably what he said after explaining player and SP distribution across New Eden, with a highlight on **hisec**. No more, no less. In my slightly ironic post with the video link I did use the word “ganking”, which I explained in a subsequent post as a paraphrase for “killing”, for your better understanding. I think you missed that part, or chose to ignore to fit your views and your attempts to have an argument. I hope Ramona can spare me some of those painkillers. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/287 "2020-03-11T22:17:20Z")
> [@Wadiest\_Yong](#): > > I think you missed that part No I didn’t miss it. You claimed words were said that weren’t. What did he mean by “nice” for example? That is where your whole point, trying to claim he said anything about ganking newbies in highsec, and referring to naughty gankers, falls down completely. There is nothing you can point to, other than your own interpretation, of what he actually meant. So trying to ascribe your thinking to him, is BS. He didn’t say what you think he said at all, and certainly not what you’ve claimed. However, this remains off topic. This whole thread is one you should disagree with if newbies are important. The thread is about trying to limit characters that provide a first experience of the game for people. If newbies are important, then limiting what they can try can’t be a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/288 "2020-03-11T22:22:27Z")
you seem to have comprehension issues ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/289 "2020-03-11T22:24:11Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > you seem to have comprehension issues If you can provide a timestamp in the video where Dr Gudmundsson even mentions ganking, or where what he meant by his words relates to ganking newbies, I’ll gladly eat my words and apologise. If not, then maybe it’s you that has the comprehension issue. I already know you can’t provide that timestamp, because he never said what Wadiest claimed. Wadiest wants to think that Dr Gudmundsson meant what Wadiest wants it to mean, but there is no proof of that, hence he is just talking BS. ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/290 "2020-03-11T22:28:09Z")
there it is you would only have to understand the meaning of the word “nice” but dickheads dont have that kind of words in their vocabulary ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/291 "2020-03-11T22:30:42Z")
I assume you are guessing what it means then? ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/292 "2020-03-11T22:33:52Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > there it is you would only have to understand the meaning of the word “nice” but dickheads dont have that kind of words in their vocabulary Or alternatively, I can understand quite well that as a game of immense depth, there are a lot of different meanings of that, and only Dr Gudmundsson can really say what he meant. We also know that CCP believe that activities including early access to pvp, fleets, market involvement, social activities are positive indicators of retention. So it’s possible that by his words, Dr Gudmundsson was referring to those types of activities, while reflecting on the community back then not necessarily assisting new players to get into those elements of the game. We don’t know and trying to claim he said something he didn’t is BS. Unfortunately, immediately jumping to think other people are dickheads just for thinking differently is pretty toxic really. You aren’t better than anyone else, nor worse. You are just different to others and your ideas aren’t superior. To think others are dickheads for not thinking like you is pretty arrogant. ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/293 "2020-03-11T22:42:02Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > there it is you would only have to understand the meaning of the word “nice” but dickheads dont have that kind of words in their vocabulary “Nice” is introducing new players to the parts of EVE that are actually interesting, not coddling them and keeping them farming menial tasks in artificial safety until some arbitrary “newbie time” has ended and they are considered old enough to play the real game. ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/294 "2020-03-11T22:47:44Z")
except its not for you to decide what is interesting for others 😃 the more you comment the clearer how dumb you are ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/295 "2020-03-11T22:49:58Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > except its not for you to decide what is interesting for others Offering an opinion isn’t deciding for them. Only individuals can decide for themselves, which is pretty closely related to this whole line of discussion. Clearly you have opinions, so should the same judgement be applied - that the more you post, the clearer how dumb you are? I don’t think that’s reasonable, but that’s just my opinion. Maybe it is correct. ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 10:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/296 "2020-03-11T22:54:02Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > except its not for you to decide what is interesting for others But it’s ok for you to decide that newbies shouldn’t be ganked? ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/298 "2020-03-11T23:00:59Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > am i not the one giving you freedom while he wants to force you? Nope. You’re taking away the opportunity for EVE to be a PvP game, the kind of game that many players want it to be. You’re doing the equivalent of joining a FPS server and demanding that everyone stop using their guns because everyone should have the freedom to decide if they want to be shot. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/299 "2020-03-11T23:04:32Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > there is a bully want to smash your face and I tell him not to That’s just the law. Abiding by it isn’t a bad thing. However, that’s also where RL comparisons fall way short, because playing within the rules of the game includes a lot of possibilities, including smshing them in the face. That one for example, we definitely know Dr Gudmundsson recognised: [We do like shooting each other, preferably in the face](https://youtu.be/7MZD6-vGQms?list=PLDDA989F65CD6E98A&t=723) Clearly, in RL that isn’t acceptable, but in EVE it’s totally within the rules. Great example. ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/300 "2020-03-11T23:05:56Z")
> [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > > [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > > > am i not the one giving you freedom while he wants to force you? > > Nope. You’re taking away the opportunity for EVE to be a PvP game, the kind of game that many players want it to be. You’re doing the equivalent of joining a FPS server and demanding that everyone stop using their guns because everyone should have the freedom to decide if they want to be shot. nope, nobody takes it away, your comparison is the dumbest I’ve read in like 10 years. you know on fps servers there is a mode you can just watch the fight? yeah, its pretty possible even there to just watch what others do. you can keep playing pvp regardless of what others do ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/301 "2020-03-11T23:06:59Z")
yes, and do it with those who are thinking the same. make them want to fight, but that needs balls, its easier to harass the smaller ones, thats the only way you can fell pixelpower ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/302 "2020-03-11T23:07:54Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > you know on fps servers there is a mode you can just watch the fight? Spectator mode =/= joining the server as a participant. If you join the game to play you will get shot at, just like if you play EVE instead of just watching someone streaming as they play EVE you will get shot at. PvP is part of the game, like it or not. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/303 "2020-03-11T23:08:47Z")
If thats what some people want, arent they just watching on You Tube and Twitch anyway? Actually changing the game they enjoy watching would be an imposition on them too. ---
**Author:** ![Amun\_Doshu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/amun_doshu/32/191569_2.png) [@Amun\_Doshu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Amun_Doshu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/304 "2020-03-11T23:09:01Z")
> [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > > [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > > > you know on fps servers there is a mode you can just watch the fight? > > Spectator mode =/= joining the server as a participant. If you join the game to play you will get shot at, just like if you play EVE instead of just watching someone streaming as they play EVE you will get shot at. PvP is part of the game, like it or not. yes, as you said: “PART” no more no less. get over it ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/305 "2020-03-11T23:10:26Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > yes, as you said: “PART” no more no less. get over it It is part of the game for all players. PvP is not happening to you 100% of the time every moment that you are logged in, but every single system in EVE is space where PvP can and does happen and every player can be attacked in PvP at any time. There is not and never will be any way to opt out of PvP, just like there is no way to join a FPS game and prevent other players from shooting at you. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2020, 11:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191/306 "2020-03-11T23:11:10Z")
> [@Amun\_Doshu](#): > > yes, and do it with those who are thinking the same. make them want to fight, but that needs balls, its easier to harass the smaller ones, thats the only way you can fell pixelpower The stupidity of assumptions on show. Check my killboard. EVE isn’t about thinking the same. It would be much poorer a game in my view if it was, and challenging a BS claim doesn’t personally make me a ganker (I’m not), even though if I want the freedom to choose how I play, others have that right too, within the rules of the game that allows (and encourages) non-consensual actions. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191.md?page=14) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/alpha-clone-suicide-ganking-need-to-stop/223191.md?page=16)