# An Open and Honest Letter to CCP from an Alliance Leader **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [October 10, 2022, 8:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870 "2022-10-10T20:47:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/530 "2022-10-12T17:45:22Z")
A sell-out to whom, or against what? My focus is on nullsec, it is where I enjoy playing the game. I like the idea of empires in space, war between groups of players and the ability to create a home for myself and those in my community. Who am I selling out from? Why does my interaction on this forum count for anything? I mostly use Reddit and Twitter, but since my alliance leader wrote a thread on this forum I have partaken in it, as well as the Reddit thread. Again, I ask, who have I sold out? This extremely narrowminded view you have is utterly destructive to the very foundational designs of Eve Online. I simply don’t understand how any rationale being can believe they are beneficial. Can you explain that to me? ---
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/531 "2022-10-12T17:47:35Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > Is it our fault ya’ll have been secure so long you’ve forgotten how to use d-scan? LOL. If you want gameplay based around d-scan, its already in the game. Go into wormhole space. ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/532 "2022-10-12T17:48:00Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > Increasing revenue for nullsec causes disadvantage to everyone else Your justification for that is what? From my perspective I see null sec vets rolling high sec alt accounts. I’ve personally spun up 3 high sec accounts for ISK making. I’d much rather be spending the time in null. Look at the MER, the economy was more balanced pre-Scarcity / BRM so I don’t think it has achieved what you think it has achieved: [[Album] imgur.com ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/5/c/65c32d01b39b6dea0000c53d193c8504a27281e5.jpeg "imgur.com") ](https://imgur.com/a/DXRBYvS) It has only served to: - Alienate a lot of null players causing them to leave. - Moved those that remained from making ISK in risky space (null) to safe space (high). Which is not good for the game’s longevity imo. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/533 "2022-10-12T17:50:07Z")
> [@Shamen](#): > > It is not primarily a PvP game, no matter how much people wish to convince themselves of this. By creating a zone of no local in nullsec, you will have far fewer people mining, ratting or using CRAB beacons than you do now. > > It’s essentially like hunters trying to turn grazing land into a salted-earth wasteland and then wondering why all grazing stock that was there previously isn’t anymore. > > It is a fool’s errand to pursue the idea of blackout (even if its time-limited). As said, “numbers go up” people want everything safer with less effort and less interaction. > [@Shamen](#): > > since my alliance leader wrote a thread on this forum I have partaken in it Like the good clone soldier you are. ---
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/534 "2022-10-12T17:51:47Z")
This is something I have also done. I have 4 high-sec alts that run abyssals in a relatively low-traffic system. I am a high-sec player, even though my focus is on null-sec. The narrow thought processes some of these high-sec people use astounds me. Do you understand it, I am still trying to get them to explain it to me. I work based on rationale evidence, and they have yet to provide a scintilla to give grounding to their response. ---
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/535 "2022-10-12T17:54:31Z")
> [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > interaction You have said it, but have provided zero evidence or substance to give your words any value at all. It’s just all ad-hom regurgitations. > [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > Like the good clone soldier you are. What? This would be like me saying you are a clone solider because you hold your positions. Even though you haven’t substantiated them here, I would never even think of doing that. It is beyond childish and a waste of my time to do so. Again, I ask. Who am I selling out? Who have I sold out from? Why does having allegiance to a player-group mean I am a sellout? I genuinely want to understand your position here, but it is incredibly difficult given your responses. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 5:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/536 "2022-10-12T17:57:47Z")
> [@Boags](#): > > In drone lands there is hardly a system over 100% Then kill your competition, or leave. Fight or flight. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/537 "2022-10-12T18:00:43Z")
> [@Shamen](#): > > zero evidence or substance It’s directly in the quote which boils down to “blackout sucks because it’s not as safe, give us more grind gameplay”. > [@Shamen](#): > > This would be like me saying you are a clone solider because you hold your positions No, you’re a good clone soldier because your boss told you to go do something and you did it, and it’s also the first interaction ever on these forums so it’s not like you normally care much (which in itself is fine). ---
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/538 "2022-10-12T18:04:12Z")
So you are simply here to troll, post positions that you simply cannot substantiate all while using an alt with no affiliations, no history, no kills. It’s a shame. I hope you find more joy in doing something that will give you happiness rather than focusing on trying to make sure others don’t get any. Have a nice evening. ---
**Author:** ![Donald\_J\_Spock](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/donald_j_spock/32/336534_2.png) [@Donald\_J\_Spock](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Donald_J_Spock)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/539 "2022-10-12T18:07:12Z")
@Shamen needs to be banned for life. Null botting must go! ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/540 "2022-10-12T18:07:35Z")
> [@Shamen](#): > > simply here to troll No, just calling out the hypocrisy and lies. > [@Shamen](#): > > no kills Your solo interactions don’t even make past page 1 while having been around since 2003, and most of them are losses. I’m sure you’re a good clone soldier who can push F1 when told to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/541 "2022-10-12T18:08:50Z")
> [@Hatch\_Nasty](#): > > Although, I would challenge (a bit) the premise of your comparison by zooming in from the macro level to the individual, and posing the question: are the day-to-day operations of an individual null bloc member operating within their alliance’s space more or less “safe” (i.e., vulnerable to destruction of assets) than a pilot operating in highsec? I would challenge that the individual null block member is discernibly more safe, by virtue of the intel provided by Local. More of the destruction in null comes from larger fleet battles for sure, however in my experience having spent years either running rorqs/super ratting in null and triple boxing abyssals, the individual risk is significantly lower in high. I used to put 40b in assets on the fields in null (4 rorqs) or a hyper nyx (18b) or 3 rorqs + nyx if I felt particularly motivated. Came very close to losing caps a number of times and saw numerous rorqs whelped on the same grid as me and ratting supers whilst I was in response fleets, into the hundreds. It was only a matter of time before I became a victim, but that was half the enjoyment. Also lost billions in regular ratting VNIs. High sec is chill by comparison, losing a 3b gila or 1.5b set of Hawks/Retris wouldn’t feel like much of a loss, abyssals pay out so much (rorqs made 90b/hour for a 10b ship, I make 400+ with a 1.5b triple box setup - never lost a set to ganks). > [@Hatch\_Nasty](#): > > The fact that highsec ganking is a thing, should inform that CONCORD protection is not something to be taken for granted. In nullsec, local intel can tell a pilot at a glance who are their friends and who are threats. Highsec ganking is so rare in my experience, the larpers on here love to make a fuss of themselves, but don’t believe the nonsense. I’ve been ganked once in 15 years (lost an Astero on the Jita undock whilst afk). I’ve lost tens of billions in null. > [@Hatch\_Nasty](#): > > Again, I would bring up the fact that any PVE activity in highsec is subject to ganking, so there is already a risk counterplay involved in those activities Sounds like you’ve only ever played in high. Ganking is rare, significantly less chance of being ganked in high compared to being ganked in null by NPSI / WH / random Blops multi boxers / small man gangs in null. It’s an order of magnitude more risky in null. You’ve clearly bought into the memes. Try null and find out. > [@Hatch\_Nasty](#): > > Regardless, the Burners bit, I could maybe get onboard with. My hesitation is that Burners are a pretty good income maker for low-SP/new players. So maybe a compromise would be to move battlecruiser-tier Burners to lowsec, and keep frigate-tier in highsec for newer players? Establish a progression path, etc. I was actually being provocative, I don’t think high sec needs nerfs, I think null should have parity, the decline for me is because the game feels unrewarding, all areas need juicy carrots to strive for, we shouldn’t be removing them from anywhere. More resources/ISK more pvp takes place. Age of Abundance led to way more destruction particularly supercap brawls which is what I personally miss. ---
**Author:** ![Boags](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/boags/32/382554_2.png) [@Boags](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Boags)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/542 "2022-10-12T18:09:08Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > That’s on the players tho. No one wants to risk it for the biscuit apparently. Nope ph fc kicked me from fleet because my dred was not suitable ie trig dred. He did not want it on his killmail apparently. Spend all day flying two caps al the way to ge8 to get kicked from fleet for the above. Took my caps home sold them and never flew 1 ph fleet since. Goons are just as bad the ran from every cap fight when we were there. Ge8 keepstar had the potential for a good fight But nope world war boring from both sides ---
**Author:** ![Arya\_Yeshe](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arya_yeshe/32/397211_2.png) [@Arya\_Yeshe](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arya_Yeshe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/543 "2022-10-12T18:14:08Z")
> [@Induce\_Deadline](#): > > From my perspective I see null sec vets rolling high sec alt accounts. I’ve personally spun up 3 high sec accounts for ISK making. I’d much rather be spending the time in null. > > Look at the MER, the economy was more balanced pre-Scarcity / BRM so I don’t think it has achieved what you think it has achieved: That’s one interpretation, but its kinda meh. Another interpretation is a lot of people from whs and null started running Abyss over and over with their skill injected alts, because it was better than ratting in null and it was a new activity. That’s a fact, facts beat interpretations. the BOM and EOM barely changed, that slight change is probably because some players (or alts) left. It’s fine! The ISK just changed from hand to hand… oh wait… is this the reason why null bears are crying about? The ISK is more diffuse now… THAT IS ALL!!! The ones who were holding more ISK and more power are crying… what a shame! ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/544 "2022-10-12T18:18:59Z")
> [@Induce\_Deadline](#): > > Ganking is rare, significantly less chance of being ganked in high compared to being ganked in null by NPSI / WH / random Blops multi boxers / small man gangs in null. It’s an order of magnitude more risky in null. You’ve clearly bought into the memes. You can’t get ganked in anywhere but high 😃 The rest is just PvP bruv 😃 > [@Boags](#): > > Goons are just as bad the ran from every cap fight when we were there. Ge8 keepstar had the potential for a good fight Exactly, it is the players in charge making it boring. No one wants to actually fight. ---
**Author:** ![Shamen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shamen/32/317004_2.png) [@Shamen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shamen)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/545 "2022-10-12T18:19:38Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > No one wants to actually fight. What do you suggest to fix this? ---
**Author:** ![Boags](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/boags/32/382554_2.png) [@Boags](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Boags)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/546 "2022-10-12T18:22:34Z")
Fcs that worry more about fun that killboards ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/547 "2022-10-12T18:23:28Z")
> [@Induce\_Deadline](#): > > From my perspective I see null sec vets rolling high sec alt accounts. Good. At least we can kill them there, because they aren’t able to preemptively dock/tether up the moment a neutral is reported 10 jumps away from them. > [@Induce\_Deadline](#): > > Look at the MER, the economy was more balanced pre-Scarcity / BRM so I don’t think it has achieved what you think it has achieved: > > [[Album] imgur.com ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/5/c/65c32d01b39b6dea0000c53d193c8504a27281e5.jpeg "imgur.com")](https://imgur.com/a/DXRBYvS) You’re looking at the **completely wrong graph** from which to draw your conclusion. > [@Boags](#): > > Nope ph fc kicked me from fleet because my dred was not suitable ie trig dred. He did not want it on his killmail apparently. Spend all day flying two caps al the way to ge8 to get kicked from fleet for the above. Took my caps home sold them and never flew 1 ph fleet since. > Goons are just as bad the ran from every cap fight when we were there. Ge8 keepstar had the potential for a good fight > But nope world war boring from both sides Give high-sec wars a shot (or at least some low-sec piracy). Then you can kill these same people as they move their haulers and marauders around, and collect their tears when they send you hate mail filled with threats to murder your family. > [@Arya\_Yeshe](#): > > We can see it clearly, you can use Destiny for the conversations and sit the other one aside and use the other just to troll Draclav, Lucas Kell and friends. > > This is good! This is my main, and I haven’t posted with any other characters on the forums with the exception of a few recruitment threads on some alts. > [@Shamen](#): > > > [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > > > No one wants to actually fight. > > What do you suggest to fix this? Not giving players a choice works absolute wonders. ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/548 "2022-10-12T18:26:59Z")
> [@Arya\_Yeshe](#): > > Another interpretation is a lot of people from whs and null started running Abyss over and over with their skill injected alts, because it was better than ratting in null and it was a new activity. That’s a fact, facts beat interpretations. Yes agreed, that’s the point I’m making, null players are flocking to high sec for the high reward low risk gameplay which I think is wrong (or leaving). Null sec is better placed for high rewards as you accept more risk. ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 6:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870/549 "2022-10-12T18:28:01Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Good. At least we can kill them there, because they aren’t able to preemptively dock/tether up the moment a neutral is reported 10 jumps away from them. And yet most destruction takes place in null with a lower proportion of the overall pop playing there. Have another go! [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870.md?page=16) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/an-open-and-honest-letter-to-ccp-from-an-alliance-leader/379870.md?page=18)