# \[ARC\] Large and Heavily Damaged Drifter Fleet Encountered in Hive Complex **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [February 17, 2018, 7:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796 "2018-02-17T07:09:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/161 "2018-02-25T22:09:59Z")
Honestly, this is all getting to be a bit of a farce. Shall we get back to more productive topics? ---
**Author:** ![Lasairiona\_Raske](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lasairiona_raske/32/467893_2.png) [@Lasairiona\_Raske](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lasairiona_Raske)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/162 "2018-02-25T22:11:30Z")
Awww, we were having fun, boss. ---
**Author:** ![Teinyhr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teinyhr/32/374406_2.png) [@Teinyhr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teinyhr)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/163 "2018-02-25T22:11:48Z")
> [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > Honestly, this is all getting to be a bit of a farce. Capsuleers piling on another like schoolyard bullies over a difference in perspective? Yeah it is. ---
**Author:** ![Lasairiona\_Raske](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lasairiona_raske/32/467893_2.png) [@Lasairiona\_Raske](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lasairiona_Raske)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/164 "2018-02-25T22:13:22Z")
She stole my outfit. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/165 "2018-02-25T22:13:53Z")
Mhm. In any case, all else aside, another heavily-damaged Drifter fleet has appeared. I’d be _very_ curious to see if we have any leads on what exactly it’s all about, but I suspect we really don’t, unless that swirly-ball-of-probably-plasma is involved. ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/166 "2018-02-25T22:16:18Z")
Amarr Miner structures, sweetie. I know you haven’t stuck your head out of the wormhole you’re cowering in very often, but go try to solo an armed and defended Astrahus with a subcap some day. > [@Jaret\_Victorian](#): > > Mizhara, do you really you compare us to suicide gankers in Uedama? The crew issue is present, but you don’t need even the skeleton crew to literally ready up the weapons and run like hell to escape pods. So how many sacrifices do you consider the cut-off point per dead Drifter then? Yes, I do compare you to the suicide gankers, except those guys don’t pretend to have grand motivations beyond loot. It’s honestly rather interesting to me how defensive _and_ hostile people are getting over some fairly straight criticism and differing viewpoints. It’s _almost_ as if something that has the potential for affecting countless baseliners, is currently costing a lot of lives, is something that shouldn’t be talked about for some reason. Sorry ladies and gentlemen, everything gets to be questioned, not just when it’s _other_ people doing things. ---
**Author:** ![Nomistrav](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomistrav/32/278296_2.png) [@Nomistrav](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomistrav)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/167 "2018-02-25T22:25:06Z")
Does your idiocy know no bounds? The destroyers were fielded with weapons only, and those are operated by capsuleers. You do not need any crew to operate navigational and weapons systems on a capsuleer ship, let alone this hilarious accusation of “costing a lot of lives”. And even if that were true, you must be absolutely daft if you think you’re going to convince me that anyone would sign on to work on a ship that they knew was going to last no more than five minutes. No-one is getting hostile at ‘straight criticism’ and ‘differing viewpoints’. If anything, people are getting hostile at blatant stupidity in an attempt to detract from our cause while doing absolutely nothing themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/168 "2018-02-25T22:27:17Z")
I reiterate. Those who wish a peaceful resolution to the Drifter crisis: make your attempt at diplomacy. I laud your enthusiasm, and look forward to word of the results of your action, for better or worse. All else aside, ARC’s operations will continue as ARC and its assorted patrons, partners, and associates have discussed. ---
**Author:** ![Yoshitaka\_Moromuo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yoshitaka_moromuo/32/66710_2.png) [@Yoshitaka\_Moromuo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Yoshitaka_Moromuo)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/169 "2018-02-25T22:27:39Z")
If I recall correctly, on an earlier observatory mission - some time ago, I’ll add - they would openly aggress any who ventured too close to one of their “unidentified” wormholes. That’s without any type of weapons lock or active engagement. Another event comes to mind where they reportedly destroyed a Zephyr-type light-sail ship - one that cannot be armed whatsoever. I’d class that as openly hostile, just from that. ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/170 "2018-02-25T22:31:20Z")
> [@Nomistrav](#): > > Does your idiocy know no bounds? The destroyers were fielded with weapons only, and those are operated by capsuleers. Are you _seriously_ trying to claim you fly crewless? You lot alone in all of New Eden has found a way for capsuleers to fly combat vessels, crewless. Is there no end to the lengths you’re trying to go to, in order to pretend you have no blood on your hands? Spirits below, this is farcical indeed. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > Those who wish a peaceful resolution to the Drifter crisis: make your attempt at diplomacy. Yeah, I think I’ll continue doing exactly what I’m doing instead. I’m leaving the Drifters alone and so far they’ve left me and my people alone. Seems to work out just fine. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > All else aside, ARC’s operations will continue as ARC and its assorted patrons, partners, and associates have discussed. And the rest of us remain free to question your choices, especially when they put _our_ people at needless risk. You have no more mandate over such matters than any of the rest of us, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/171 "2018-02-25T22:33:23Z")
So far as the crew issue is concerned, these are minimally equipped destroyers with an expected lifespan outside of the hangar measured in minutes. While any sort of protracted flight operation would of course require a standard crew compliment, it’d be a terrible craft indeed if it couldn’t go two minutes without someone tightening bolts, vacuuming carpets, etc. This isn’t to say I’d fly this way often, or ever outside of specific limited engagement scenarios. ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/172 "2018-02-25T22:34:36Z")
So you’re going to pretend it’s crewless, seriously? You are sticking with that nonsense? ---
**Author:** ![Nomistrav](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomistrav/32/278296_2.png) [@Nomistrav](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomistrav)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/173 "2018-02-25T22:35:55Z")
I know this may be hard for you to accept as a Matari, but other races have made great advances in technology that do not require the sheer swaths of manpower that Matari ships do. I would be less concerned with the “nonsense” of crewless ships and be more concerned with the patent non-sense of pretending that the Matari have not loss entire wings to Drifters. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/174 "2018-02-25T22:35:59Z")
If it’s only flying for sixty to 120 seconds? Yes. Yes, I am. The normal compliment of 12 to 14 would be necessary for any sort of duration flight. But I repeat: this wouldn’t be spaceworthy if it couldn’t even go _one minute_ without attention. ---
**Author:** ![Teinyhr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teinyhr/32/374406_2.png) [@Teinyhr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teinyhr)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/175 "2018-02-25T22:41:22Z")
> [@Nomistrav](#): > > No-one is getting hostile at ‘straight criticism’ and ‘differing viewpoints’. If anything, people are getting hostile at blatant stupidity in an attempt to detract from our cause while doing absolutely nothing themselves. Uh, you’re getting visibly pretty upset. Detract from “your cause”? Well sorry, I just want to entertain other ideas and theories, even while yours seems to have tons of support and mine does not, so doesn’t really feel like I’m detracting from anything. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > Those who wish a peaceful resolution to the Drifter crisis: make your attempt at diplomacy. I laud your enthusiasm, and look forward to word of the results of your action, for better or worse. Thank you. Wish your peers would follow your example of being less of a judgemental twat. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > All else aside, ARC’s operations will continue as ARC and its assorted patrons, partners, and associates have discussed. I’d like to concur with Mizhara though, people should be allowed to offer different views and criticism of your corporations actions without the undue hostility we’ve witnessed time and time again as long as we present our case calmly and collected as well. ---
**Author:** ![Nomistrav](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomistrav/32/278296_2.png) [@Nomistrav](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomistrav)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/176 "2018-02-25T22:43:08Z")
> [@Teinyhr](#): > > Uh, you’re getting visibly pretty upset. Detract from “your cause”? Well sorry, I just want to entertain other ideas and theories, even while yours seems to have tons of support and mine does not, so doesn’t really feel like I’m detracting from anything. No-one is stopping you. In fact, we’ve been encouraging it for the duration of this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/177 "2018-02-25T22:44:13Z")
> [@Teinyhr](#): > > I’d like to concur with Mizhara though, people should be allowed to offer different views and criticism of your corporations actions without the undue hostility we’ve witnessed time and time again as long as we present our case calmly and collected as well. With due respect, the hostility is because, for years, the same criticism has been levied by seemingly the same parties, who make no effort to take actions on their concern, nevermind that an effort _was_ made on our part in the past. It gets tiresome, especially ‘entertaining differing views’ sometimes tends to veer into accusations of blood-thirstiness and attempted genocide, again by those who make no effort to seek a peaceful resolution. Essentially, it comes across as armchair spaceship captains yelling from across the room, “You’re doing it wrong!” without ever actually attempting any work themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/178 "2018-02-25T22:50:09Z")
Well then, I guess we see how little faith we can put into ARC’s publishing from this point on, if you’re so lacking in integrity that you’re not even willing to acknowledge the lives you are spending on these operations. Is your conviction in this matter truly so lacking that you can’t accept responsibility for even that blood spent in your pursuits? Our crews die for us and you want to erase this sacrifice as if it doesn’t even happen? Fucksake. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > Essentially, it comes across as armchair spaceship captains yelling from across the room, “You’re doing it wrong!” without ever actually attempting any work themselves. Pretty sure I’ve been putting my money and my ships where my mouth is. As we spoke here, I - unsuccessfully sure enough - engaged combat vessels from _my_ enemies. I just don’t pretend neither my targets nor my own allies or crew cease to exist, to be able to pretend I don’t have blood on my hands. ---
**Author:** ![Makoto\_Priano](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makoto_priano/32/383919_2.png) [@Makoto\_Priano](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makoto_Priano)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/179 "2018-02-25T22:51:19Z")
You’re welcome to believe whatever you like, Ms. Del’thul. ---
**Author:** ![Teinyhr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teinyhr/32/374406_2.png) [@Teinyhr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teinyhr)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2018, 10:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796/180 "2018-02-25T22:53:13Z")
> [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > With due respect, the hostility is because, for years, the same criticism has been levied by the same parties, who make no effort to take actions on their concern, nevermind that an effort was made on our part in the past. > [@Makoto\_Priano](#): > > Essentially, it comes across as armchair spaceship captains yelling from across the room, “You’re doing it wrong!” without ever actually attempting any work themselves. “You’re not doing anything!” The thing is, setting up comm buoys across systems doesn’t have the headline power of “WE BLEW UP TONS OF ■■■■!”, and not having gotten any response doesn’t warrant much fanfare either. Turns out, there’s not a whole lot you can do when you’re trying to actively _not_ aggress someone. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796.md?page=8) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/arc-large-and-heavily-damaged-drifter-fleet-encountered-in-hive-complex/57796.md?page=10)