# Broker Relations **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** official, devblog\ **Created:** [February 24, 2020, 10:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752 "2020-02-24T10:10:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 102
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 3:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2097 "2020-06-12T15:11:12Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > There are items being sold for less than the cost of the materials. Such as…saying something doesn’t make it true… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Unrelated. This is the whole point…I am waiting for you or Tonto to give an example of a manufactured product selling at a loss. How is that not related? LOL… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Your request for specific examples is just childish So asking you to back-up your claim with an example is childish? Ok then…interesting debating tactics… ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 3:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2098 "2020-06-12T15:16:15Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > Such as…saying something doesn’t make it true… I don’t care. Saying it does not happen does not make it not happen either, yet you use that fallacy a lot. On the other side, I have seen it happen. I don’t care about bringing you proof because that’s something that you could easily do by yourself, instead of making BS claims. > [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > This is the whole point…I am waiting for you or Tonto to give an example of a manufactured product selling at a loss. How is that not related? LOL… This is unrelated because it has no relation to what is actually discussed. Nobody has to give you a proof. You did not give a proof yourself of your claims, and still you don’t void your own statement based on that lack of proof. By experience, you are wrong. If you want proof, go search it by yourself. > [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > So asking you to back-up your claim with an example is childish? Ok then…interesting debating tactics… Yes, when you don’t do it for your own claims it definitely is. Especially when you are issuing orders to people who tell you you are wrong about the non existence of events. ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 3:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2099 "2020-06-12T15:20:16Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > I don’t care about bringing you proof because that’s something that you could easily do by yourself LOL… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Nobody has to give you a proof. So everyone is free to make unsubstantiated claims…ya no…that’s not how honest debate works. > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > If you want proof, go search it by yourself. Again, YOU made the claim…not me… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Especially when you are issuing orders to people who tell you you are wrong about the non existence of events. And yet again, you made the claim…not me… ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 3:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2100 "2020-06-12T15:31:03Z")
Why does anyone bother responding to Anderson? ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 3:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2101 "2020-06-12T15:32:48Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > Again, YOU made the claim…not me… Yes, you actually made the claim it does not exist. Which you did not prove. On the other hand, I know you are wrong, so I tell you that you are. Which means, I know your whole argument is wrong (which was based on “we don’t see items being sold for less than the cost of the materials”). Even if I don’t care about what your point actually is. It may be correct outside of your stupid argument. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 4:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2102 "2020-06-12T16:32:34Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > I know you are wrong, so I tell you that you are. > Which means, I know your whole argument is wrong > Even if I don’t care about what your point actually is 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Katana\_Kugisa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/katana_kugisa/32/210901_2.png) [@Katana\_Kugisa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Katana_Kugisa)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 6:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2103 "2020-06-12T18:53:02Z")
Stop wasting your time insulting each other, it makes everyone look worse. Increasing the increments from .01 to a larger fraction is welcome. The tiny numbers penalize human trading. Relist fees, however, are not at all. The lunacy of that change is readily apparent when you look at valuable and desirable items like skill injectors or PLEX. I Large Skill Injector costs around 10 million just to lower the price by a single tick, which means all it takes is one competitor trying to outbid you and a few back and forth bids before you’ve spent 100,000,000 isk just bidding! When the market seeders are destroyed by fees everyone else suffers. The only reason it hasn’t happened yet is most people don’t notice what they’re being charged. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 7:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2104 "2020-06-12T19:05:08Z")
> [@Katana\_Kugisa](#): > > Stop wasting your time insulting each other, it makes everyone look worse. I’m not insulting him. He says that something does can’t be seen, which I already saw, so I tell him he is wrong. Then he asks for proof, without realizing that he is the one who made a claim - but then he keeps repeating he wants proof. At which point I state that this is childish, then he says he did not make a claim in the first place, so I quote him that claim. So he is triple, quadruple wrong, I don’t even count. The funny part is that I may agree on his point, just telling him his argument is stupid ; just as if a kid claims that since he does not see a cat right now, then cats don’t exist. That’s literally the level of logic he is showing. > [@Katana\_Kugisa](#): > > The only reason it hasn’t happened yet is most people don’t notice what they’re being charged. Or just that people have adapted in order to not be charged too much. I still am seeding items. and making profit. ---
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 7:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2105 "2020-06-12T19:24:38Z")
Something something proving negatives something. That’s basically all I am getting out of this thread now. This seriously reads like some people arguing about whether or not Bigfoot exists. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 7:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2106 "2020-06-12T19:37:41Z")
> [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Something something proving negatives something. Well he’s the one claiming that negative. Sad time, when peoples’ argument rely on the non-existence of things that people say they already saw. And then proceed to reverse the burden of proof. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 9:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2107 "2020-06-12T21:11:32Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > Such as…saying something doesn’t make it true… You’re lucky. I thought about you on this one : [![Imgur](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/d/a/6daa8fe288240e556cbfccfe1a5e274b60b88490.png "Screenshot at 23:05:09.png") ](https://imgur.com/2vYANKC) estimated price of the material for 10/20 is 26.5M the SO was placed at 24.07M Buying all materials for 10 RUNS [https://imgur.com/W63AsEn](https://imgur.com/W63AsEn) =\> 25.8M/run Also without the tax. so yes, it happens. Here you have a proof. Now I’m still waiting for your proof that it does not happen, and then we’ll be able to deduce who is the one making up BS that he can’t prove and then claiming that when he is not proved false, that means he is true. ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Remillard](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mark_remillard/32/299147_2.png) [@Mark\_Remillard](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mark_Remillard)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 9:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2108 "2020-06-12T21:11:56Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > This is the whole point…I am waiting for you or Tonto to give an example of a manufactured product selling at a loss. How is that not related? LOL… things being sold at a loss represent a massive percentage of the market… it become common knoweldge at this point. It’s the “The mineral I mine are free” effect. it a big reason i completely avoid Tech 1 Ship hulls. Since you are demanding a specific example… found this one with my third random check: [https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/blueprint/?typeid=603](https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/blueprint/?typeid=603) ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 11:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2109 "2020-06-12T23:23:48Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > Why does anyone bother responding to Anderson? I’m trying to be a softer more gentler forum goer but ya, I’m questioning why I broke my rule about her again… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > I thought about you on this one What is that? I must be missing the name of the item… > [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > I’m still waiting for your proof that it does not happen Again, I never said this so…calling something “BS” that was never said means absolutely nothing… ---
**Author:** ![Archer\_en\_Tilavine](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/archer_en_tilavine/32/461718_2.png) [@Archer\_en\_Tilavine](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Archer_en_Tilavine)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 11:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2110 "2020-06-12T23:33:04Z")
Everything I know about Broker Fees I learned from Seinfeld: > Frank Costanza : Let me understand, you got the hen, the chicken and the rooster. The rooster goes with the chicken. So, who’s having sex with the hen? > > George Costanza : Why don’t we talk about it another time. > > Frank Costanza : But you see my point here? You only hear of a hen, a rooster and a chicken. Something’s missing! > > Mrs. Ross : Something’s missing all right. > > Mr. Ross : They’re all chickens. The rooster has sex with all of them. > > Frank Costanza : That’s perverse. So after closely scrutinizing the conversation above, I have concluded: - 🟢 Runa is right - 🟢 Mkikaden is right - 🟢 Aiko is right, for ■■■■’s sake - 🔴 Anderson is wrong, damn it ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2020, 11:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2111 "2020-06-12T23:35:42Z")
> [@Mark\_Remillard](#): > > found this one with my third random check: Thank you sir…finally somebody ACTUALLY provides an example. You are correct with this one as people are selling it at a loss…Venture is another… I said this: > If that were true then you would see items being sold for less than the cost of the materials when there is little demand…but you never do because that would be stupid as you would just reprocess them yourself. …which in hindsight is incorrect. I should have said “sold for less than the cost of the reprocessed materials” which I eluded to in the next line. Thanks again @Mark_Remillard for a good example… ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2020, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2112 "2020-06-13T09:42:16Z")
> [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > What is that? I must be missing the name of the item… If you did not click on the image, click on it. Otherwise you are just childish again. > [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](#): > > Thank you sir…finally somebody ACTUALLY provides an example. Not like you had searched by yourself. Mister “it does not exist you have to give proof it does”. You are just ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/runa_yamaguchi/32/197532_2.png) [@Runa\_Yamaguchi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Runa_Yamaguchi)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2020, 9:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2113 "2020-06-13T09:44:39Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > You are just ridiculous. Yet here you are…lol… ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2020, 11:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2114 "2020-06-13T11:47:07Z")
> [@Katana\_Kugisa](#): > > Relist fees… the lunacy of that change The relist fees simply discourage trade. If you can’t sell everything in 90 days, without changing the price, relist fees will drive you out of business. No rational person wants to engage in that sort of trade. It’s normal in any market condition for people to adjust prices. Gas stations change their prices every day. Stores have a weekly sale on eggs. In the market, people haggle and negotiate. The era of ‘chaos’ doesn’t seem to be really about chaos, it’s just CCP devs making bad decisions and watching to see how many people get sick of the game. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2020, 12:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2115 "2020-06-13T12:13:13Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > The relist fees simply discourage trade. If you can’t sell everything in 90 days, without changing the price, relist fees will drive you out of business. No it does not discourage trade. It discourages placing orders that won’t be filled in the next 90 days. Sure, you can never ensure they will. But you can ensure some orders won’t. > [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > It’s normal in any market condition for people to adjust prices. Gas stations change their prices every day. Stores have a weekly sale on eggs. In the market, people haggle and negotiate. And you can still do all of that. The only thing I agree, and other people already mentioned this before, is that expiring orders should not require relist fee. After let’s say 30 days the relist fee should be removed. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2020, 1:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752/2116 "2020-06-13T13:25:40Z")
Please don’t talk to me Anderson, it just spams up the forum and I don’t read anything you write. The moment I see your name I just skip ahead to see if any adults are talking. You’ve long since lost all credibility, and I do not even see you as a human being. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752.md?page=101) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/broker-relations/221752.md?page=103)