# CCP hates miners = confirmed **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [February 11, 2020, 3:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941 "2020-02-11T15:04:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 30
**Author:** ![Foggy\_Bernstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/foggy_bernstein/32/407887_2.png) [@Foggy\_Bernstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Foggy_Bernstein)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 4:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/615 "2020-07-31T04:43:12Z")
> [@Ishmael\_Ronuken](#): > > And then it becomes a question of whether or not the groups that make these products can afford to stay in business. Wrong metric. There are thousands of builders with tens of thousands of mining hulls in stock right now. If the entire game changed to what you were proposing happened next week. And if all those builders stopped installing mining hull BPs as soon as this change was announced. There’d still be tens of thousands of hulls on the market that will take literally years to sell due to lack of destruction. You couldn’t give them away, let alone unload them at triple or more the current price. ---
**Author:** ![ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isd_dorrim_barstorlode/32/361083_2.png) [@ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ISD_Dorrim_Barstorlode)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 7:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/656 "2020-07-31T19:44:34Z")
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**Author:** ![ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isd_dorrim_barstorlode/32/361083_2.png) [@ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ISD_Dorrim_Barstorlode)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 7:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/657 "2020-07-31T19:47:08Z")
Removed a large number of off topic posts. Don’t do it again. ---
**Author:** ![ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isd_dorrim_barstorlode/32/361083_2.png) [@ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ISD_Dorrim_Barstorlode)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 7:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/658 "2020-07-31T19:52:43Z")
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**Author:** ![Serene\_Repose](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/serene_repose/32/384960_2.png) [@Serene\_Repose](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Serene_Repose)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 8:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/659 "2020-07-31T20:52:39Z")
CCP has changed the game to favor a minority of players. They lost a large percentage of their paying customers as a result, and moves that are a matter of record were made in the corporate world - still they continue to labor over a misconception. But, that’s another story. Where it is relevant here is when they favor one behavior it’s at the expense of another. When they decided to kiss the booties of gankers, they needed gankees. Yes, miners are sitting ducks. Nevermind their part in the supply chain - those ships gankers love to suicide in and replace ARE made of mined materials. It’s an unfathomable sacrifice to a behaviorally challenged minority who, by the way, find it difficult to pay $$ to do anything. You can see how this thread, for instance, gets reduced to mosquito-bite ad hominem and bogged down in minutia by these same people as they can’t loftily advance an issue, having no issue to advance. They just want to kill disadvantaged pilots, because they’re the risk averse ones since there’s more than enough well-equipped, and well-trained pilots to go after. And, alas, the low hanging fruit for this sort of inane behavior are miners. Each move made to make gankers happy correspondingly took from miners. It IS as though CCP sees miners like the Kaiser’s hunting game, there to herd before the guns of the gankers for their “hunting” pleasure. Yet, we all know it is no challenge to gank miners and gate camp for haulers. I’ve insisted for years enforcing ACTUAL SOVEREIGNTY over their systems…Minmatar/Caldari/Amarr/Gallente, refusing the use of jumpgates and stations in their sovereign systems (as aiding and abetting a criminal) allows the wannabee pirates to gank to their heart’s content, only they just can’t get away with it. You know, like it really happened in the Caribbean. CCP has found it amenable to pretend the Minmatar (for instance) are too lame to muster a navy to go after criminals interdicting their shipping lanes, thus damaging THEIR economy…making gankers the real sovereignty. I’ve said for years this intentional oversight makes the game ridiculous (open for ridicule). But, it’s the truth the EVE pirates don’t really want to _Live the life!_ They’re the risk averse using CCP and the overall mechanics of the game to avoid the consequences of their actions. And, then CCP doesn’t rule its game, the gankers do. So, there you go miners. CCP gave up your game for the benefit of a small minority of bellicose forum posters all who cannot resist checking in on a thread like this - reducing it to fighting over crumbs, dismissing fellow players as invalid and bogging it down with detritus. They can tell management is blowing their way. So, they behave with impunity while other legitimate players they disparagingly call PVE are left to feel apologetic for not quite getting something…whatever it is. I’d like to also add, in a recently closed thread it was falsely claimed by this crowd that PVE only serves PVP and without PVP there would be no PVE…I don’t contribute in any way to PVP by missioning. In a roundabout way I may contribute by marketing…but that’s not directly - and I mention this only to point out how convoluted and twisted these people’s arguments have become. They act with impunity because CCP gives them license to, while others have to be hat in hand because CCP has created that as their social condition - intentionally, or otherwise. So, the OP’s point is spot on, and all the disputers can be numbered in the now well-known ganker’s camp. You can find _real_ PVP in EVE if you weren’t so chicken, and _risk averse._ ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 8:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/660 "2020-07-31T20:58:25Z")
The Procs I sell to people who had theirs blown up say otherwise vOv ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/661 "2020-07-31T21:00:25Z")
most of carebears that talk about “real pvp” don’t have any presence on zkill ![Captura de Tela 2020-07-31 às 17.58.58](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/d/e/dec37dc3b14239d4a546b5a6b1d414428d371781.png) and the "you know all my alts "excuse don’t hold water i said and i will say again , if you are so afraid to bring the char you "actually shot people " to the forum you are a care bear with a capital C ---
**Author:** ![Serene\_Repose](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/serene_repose/32/384960_2.png) [@Serene\_Repose](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Serene_Repose)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/662 "2020-07-31T21:15:16Z")
You say that as if it’s a _bad_ thing. Oh…we’re supposed to automatically think YOU’RE the one doing it right… _here’s an example of what I said earlier_ ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/663 "2020-07-31T21:17:22Z")
> [@Serene\_Repose](#): > > You say that as if it’s a _bad_ thing. it is how the F you guys know about pvp wen you don’t do it? maybe… just maybe … you guys are with the wrong impression about the subject ? i dont go around talking about "real brain surgery " ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/664 "2020-07-31T21:19:43Z")
Oh god, another text wall by someone who just _doesn’t get_ that without ■■■■ getting blown up, all industry loses meaning anyway. > [@Serene\_Repose](#): > > I don’t contribute in any way to PVP by missioning. In a roundabout way I may contribute by marketing…but that’s not directly - and I mention this only to point out how convoluted and twisted these people’s arguments have become. Yeah you do, dum-dum. Every time you undock, you expose yourself to ganking, or to being baited by having your cans looted, or your mobile structures shot. Just because it hasn’t happened to you yet, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/665 "2020-07-31T21:23:18Z")
and btw the new arenas that "ALL PLAYERS WOULD LIKE " suuuuuuuuuuuuuccck bring back cruiser 1v1 that actually have a scene and actually people who play it and i will forgive you CCP ![Captura de Tela 2020-07-31 às 18.18.02](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/c/9/c95518be3da041dd2d6ca6dbb65a3480ae76b889.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/666 "2020-07-31T21:29:14Z")
We swear will will do some PvP right after we just make a little bit more ISK in order to be able to buy some PvP ships and modules! ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/667 "2020-07-31T21:35:48Z")
> [@Serene\_Repose](#): > > CCP has changed the game to favor a minority of players. They lost a large percentage of their paying customers as a result, Which minority would that be? If it’s people who PvP as per the commonly accepted definition (which is not the full definition), CCP has always catered to that demographic, hell CCP’s origin is in that demographic. > Each move made to make gankers happy correspondingly took from miners What moves have CCP made to make gankers happy? > I’d like to also add, in a recently closed thread it was falsely claimed by this crowd that PVE only serves PVP and without PVP there would be no PVE…I don’t contribute in any way to PVP by missioning. That’s not a false claim, and certainly not from the point of view of CCP, who consider pretty much every activity that exposes you to other players to be PvP. Also, you almost certainly do contribute to PvP by missioning, loot and salvage is generally sold on the market, which is definitely PvP; and then there’s the shinies that you get from LP, the ones that PvP players buy. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/668 "2020-07-31T21:40:10Z")
> [@Serene\_Repose](#): > > CCP has found it amenable to pretend the Minmatar (for instance) are too lame to muster a navy to go after criminals interdicting their shipping lanes, thus damaging THEIR economy…making gankers the real sovereignty. I’ve said for years this intentional oversight makes the game ridiculous (open for ridicule). > > But, it’s the truth the EVE pirates don’t really want to _Live the life!_ They’re the risk averse using CCP and the overall mechanics of the game to avoid the consequences of their actions. And, then CCP doesn’t rule its game, the gankers do. I’m really don’t see where you are coming from. First, the Minmatar do muster a navy - their faction police - which go infallibly after criminals in their space. They hunt and explode low security status capsuleers making incursions into their sovereign space. Criminals can’t fly anything but small, fast ships, and they are too powerful to really fight, unlike the regular faction navy which you can possibly take on. I think it is wrong to denigrate their tireless efforts to keep Minmatar space clear of criminals. And as for those lovable highsec pirates themselves? The vast majority I’ve met are of the fun-lovin’ criminal sort, looking to have an adventure, ideally one that ends up with some sweet and valuable booty in their hanger at the end of it. They use the legal and intended mechanics of the game to outwit and outplay other players and take their stuff, something completely and explicitly intended by the game design. They suffer plenty of consequences and costs for their choices imposed on them by the game mechanics and the NPCs, and the game opens them up to have even more inflicted by the other players. All working as intended. These folk aren’t looking for a ‘good fight’ with an equal or prepared opponent; they just want to take your stuff. And Eve has always, since the very beginning, been designed so you are at risk to the other players out there in space. There is always room to quibble about balance or fun or some aspect of the flavour of the game, but I honestly can’t believe there are still people who can’t seem to accept that piracy is a fundamental feature, not a bug of Eve, some _seventeen years_ after the game was released. Even more, I am constantly amazed by those that claim they can’t see any fun in playing a video game as a swashbuckling space pirate, making a living off the backs of others! So no, CCP doesn’t hate miners. If anything, they pandered and overfed miners for too long causing serious issues in the economy that still need attention. But they have always been a target, and always will be, as that is how Eve is suppose to work. They are put out there as possible content in exchange for the resources they get to spawn into the universe. That’s just the deal we all accept when we undock, and everyone - pirates and CCP alike - enjoy when players are out there in space offering themselves up as a potential meal. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/669 "2020-07-31T21:51:51Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > These folk aren’t looking for a ‘good fight’ loved your post i just like to reiterate that NO care bear would fight a "good fight " they just say that, if eve had a button “good fight” to press and "fight a good fight " only the usual pvp dudes would press it and btw nothing agains people that dont like pvp, mr @Iceacid_Frostpacker is a miner and a respectable member of eves community were is he? i don’t know … probably mining ice . You know what he is not doing ? QQing on the forum like a baby ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/670 "2020-07-31T21:55:25Z")
> [@tutucox\_Khamsi](#): > > i just like to reiterate that NO care bear would fight a "good fight " I’d go down swinging (and missing), if someone actually managed to catch me in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2020, 9:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/671 "2020-07-31T21:56:46Z")
Yeah, in fact I think the real anti-PvP people dont know how to industry in EvE properly, so they need it made easier. Wow, someone is actually jealous of me. Im… stunned ---
**Author:** ![Foggy\_Bernstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/foggy_bernstein/32/407887_2.png) [@Foggy\_Bernstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Foggy_Bernstein)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2020, 12:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/672 "2020-08-01T00:48:13Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Yeah, in fact I think the real anti-PvP people dont know how to industry in EvE It’s pretty obvious that PVP players don’t have a clue how industry works either. Most of them buy PLEX to sell for ISK to buy these gank ships that miraculously appear on the market. Traders and builders are the only people that have a clue how industry works. Because if they don’t, they are soon broke and running missions for bounties. ---
**Author:** ![Serene\_Repose](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/serene_repose/32/384960_2.png) [@Serene\_Repose](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Serene_Repose)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2020, 12:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/673 "2020-08-01T00:54:44Z")
See? It’s like taking candy from a baby. They swarm to the post like hogs to the corn at feeding time. (Oh, by the way, I have pvp-ed. ["…understand pvp…", what a riot.] I put in 7 years in an ACTUAL pvp game - BF2 in the Cyber Atthletic League [CAL] and Team Warfare League [TWL], ladies.) ---
**Author:** ![Foggy\_Bernstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/foggy_bernstein/32/407887_2.png) [@Foggy\_Bernstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Foggy_Bernstein)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2020, 12:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941/674 "2020-08-01T00:58:57Z")
> [@Serene\_Repose](#): > > They swarm to the post like hogs to the corn at feeding time There’s nothing else to do while sitting at a gate for twelve hours a day. Jerking each other off in the forum is what keeps them sane. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941.md?page=29) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ccp-hates-miners-confirmed/218941.md?page=31)