# Change how tether works in highsec for suspects and outlaws **URL:** \ **Category:** Assembly Hall\ **Created:** [April 18, 2021, 12:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440 "2021-04-18T12:46:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 12:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/1 "2021-04-18T12:46:22Z")
When suspect or outlaw, anyone is free to engage you while you are in space . This is not possible while tethered and in space (unless the pilot is AFK so it can be bumped out of tether range or the structure owner denies docking rights), therefore it invalidates such timer and security status. Tethering in highsec for suspects and outlaws should be changed or penalties/drawbacks applied to structure/structure owners who safely harbor them . ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 2:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/2 "2021-04-18T14:07:47Z")
When _undocked_, anyone is free to engage you while you are in space . This is not possible while tethered and in space (unless the pilot is AFK so it can be bumped out of tether range or the structure owner denies docking rights), therefore it invalidates _the competitive nature of EVE ship gameplay_. Tethering in _space_ for _anyone_ shouldn’t be possible. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 2:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/3 "2021-04-18T14:50:37Z")
Why not? What does your security status or suspect status have to do with the tethering mechanic? The owner is deciding who gets to tether, not CONCORD so if you don’t like it, then ask the owner to take them off the ACL list, or declare war on them and make them! Besides, what would that do? They would just dock up then like they do with regular stations. Do you think they will just sit there and let you shoot them? Should suspects and outlaws not be allowed to dock? Does docking “invalidate” timers and suspect status? ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/4 "2021-04-18T15:22:51Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > What does your security status or suspect status have to do with the tethering mechanic? I have already explained it in my post . If you cannot connect words , put them in the context that I described and do some logical thinking , there’s nothing that I can do to help you. > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > They would just dock up then like they do with regular stations. Yes. That is the point , if they want to be safe as outlaws or suspects . As suspect or outlaw, you shouldn’t be 100% safe **while in space**! Players should be able to engage in combat with you. > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > then ask the owner to take them off the ACL list, or declare war on them and make them! When you go to a doctor with an infection , what is it that you prefer ? Treatment with antibiotics or amputation ? Stop wasting my time to clarify things that you seem to not understand . > The platform for players to bring topics to the attention of the CSM. > > In this forum, any EVE player can raise an issue for debate. > > The best and most supported of these issue threads are picked up by the CSM for debate. Are you CSM ? No. Have a good day ! ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/5 "2021-04-18T15:26:31Z")
It wouldn’t change anything. Gankers adapt. There have been dozens of changes like this that have been requested and granted over the years. It is called “One More Nerf.” The problem is that the victims are unable to comprehend the dedication gankers have. ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 3:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/6 "2021-04-18T15:31:53Z")
This is not a stealth “nerf ganking thread” . For what I care all highsec can turn into 90% suicide gankers , I really don’t care . As a matter of fact it’s more content , so make it happen ! This is about a stupid mechanic that we have, which Gerard Amatin described it very well : > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > it invalidates _the competitive nature of EVE ship gameplay_. It applies not only to outlaws or suspects , but for outlaws and suspects it blatantly invalidates what suspect timer and outlaw status means while being in space. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 3:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/7 "2021-04-18T15:47:45Z")
> [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > I have already explained it in my post . If you cannot connect words , put them in the context that I described and do some logical thinking , there’s nothing that I can do to help you. Please indulge me then as I am still not following. The tethering mechanic is something an Upwell structure provides to ships on the ACL defined by the owner. It has nothing to do with CONCORD flags. Why shouldn’t a player get to decide who they give protection to? I mean, maybe you’d have a point if these were CONCORD stations, but they aren’t. If an owner wants to provide safe harbour to pirates and thieves why shouldn’t they be able to? I mean, it’s not like you can’t shoot their station if it bothers you that much. > [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > Yes. That is the point , if they want to be safe as outlaws or suspects . > As suspect or outlaw, you shouldn’t be 100% safe **while in space**! Players should be able to engage in combat with you. Again I am confused. If other players can be 100% safe in space, why can’t these players? And it is pretty arguable whether they are even “in space”. Like they literally cannot do anything meaningful without the tether turning off. There really is no safety here unless they just sit there doing nothing. If you implemented this they would just sit in station instead of under tether while they are taking a break from the game. I see no point to changing this. > [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > Stop wasting my time to clarify things that you seem to not understand . Thanks in advance for taking the time to clarify to me your rather bizarre request. ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 4:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/8 "2021-04-18T16:06:03Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > If an owner wants to provide safe harbour to pirates and thieves why shouldn’t they be able to? Because I already told you this for the 2nd time , here I’m going to tell you for the 3rd time , maybe the 3rd time is the lucky one … It invalidates what suspect timer means and outlaw status while being in space. I think your problem is that you don’t understand what those mean ?! Secondly , if the owner would like to harbor outlaws and thieves , that should come with a penalty then . > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > The tethering mechanic is something an Upwell structure provides to ships on the ACL defined by the owner. It has nothing to do with CONCORD flags. It has to do because the suspect timer means nothing while in space and tethered . Because you simply cannot attack a suspect in that context. > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > Again I am confused. If other players can be 100% safe in space, why can’t these players? They can’t because they have outlaw status or a suspect timer active in space and on top of that safe. Read about what those mean. > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > they would just sit in station instead of under teacher tether As it should be . Not in space with suspect timer or outlaw status and safe. At this point I am beginning to think you posted just to troll here. Preventively you go to the ignore list. > [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > I see no point to changing this. Does not matter to me. ---
**Author:** ![Oriki\_Ahvilen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/oriki_ahvilen/32/395043_2.png) [@Oriki\_Ahvilen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Oriki_Ahvilen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 4:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/9 "2021-04-18T16:25:59Z")
I agree with you on this one. This game also needs a complete overhaul of player owned stations . The structure spawn cancer is still real. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 5:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/10 "2021-04-18T17:28:09Z")
> [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > It invalidates what suspect timer means and outlaw status while being in space. I think your problem is that you don’t understand what those mean ?! I don’t see how. I mean tethers were suppose to provide the same functionality as POS shields by making a protective space where you could sit in space but only while you were safely inside. Tether does the same - it provides a breathing space but as soon as you do anything tether drops. > [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > It has to do because the suspect timer means nothing while in space and tethered . Because you simply cannot attack a suspect in that context. Working as intended? You can’t attack anyone who is tethered. I am still very confused why this analogue for docking up should be different based on your security status or a suspect flag. If you don’t want them to tether, point them before they do. Otherwise, it’s just the same as docking, which they can also just do. > [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > Does not matter to me. You are rather rude. Well, I tried. I have no clue what you are going on about. It seems to me that you just want CCP to waste a bunch of resources to make changes that would do nothing to the game and not make any sense in context of the lore. Maybe you think this will somehow tilt the game in your favour, but I am honestly at a loss to see how. Maybe the CSM have more insight into what you are saying. I’ll leave them to try to decipher what you are asking for. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 6:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/11 "2021-04-18T18:03:18Z")
This is an interesting idea. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 6:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/12 "2021-04-18T18:23:19Z")
Quit trolling! ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 6:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/13 "2021-04-18T18:27:59Z")
\<3.\<3 ---
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 6:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/14 "2021-04-18T18:55:08Z")
> [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > Are you CSM ? > > No. > > Have a good day ! Did you miss the part where it says ‘most supported’? Other players absolutely can challenge your idea. It’s really no different from PF&I. I agree with @Black_Pedro that _Crimewatch mechanics_ should not interfere with _Player-owned Upwell Structure mechanics_. Your argument makes more sense applied to NPC station services because Crimewatch is an NPC mechanic; there is no lore reason for this to impact the services capsuleers can offer each other. ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 7:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/15 "2021-04-18T19:28:02Z")
> [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Did you miss the part where it says ‘most supported’? No. > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Other players absolutely can challenge your idea. It’s really no different from PF&I. Yes, everyone can freely engage in the conversation. Doesn’t mean that I care about what they have to say on the other hand, considering most of them have no clue about what they are talking about and just post on these forms trying to look smart and make an impression or just to troll. > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Your argument makes more sense applied to NPC station services because Crimewatch is an NPC mechanic; NPC mechanics have nothing to do with a player going suspect or choosing to be an outlaw . > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > there is no lore reason for this to impact the services capsuleers can offer each other. Lore has nothing to do with this thread and what we are talking in here . Your fixation is on NPC and lore and we are talking about the inability for players to interact while in space under suspect timer and/or outlaw status because of a broken illogical mechanic. ---
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 7:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/16 "2021-04-18T19:31:50Z")
> [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > NPC mechanics have nothing to do with a player going suspect or choosing to be an outlaw . Outlaw and suspect are entirely NPC-related - as they dictate whether or not _Crimewatch_ applies, which are NPC mechanics - whether or not the NPC police force blows you up for shooting someone. Outlaw and suspect have far less meaning in low sec, and zero meaning in null sec, because the NPCs care progressively leas about capsuleer activities in those regions. You are trying to expand the Crimewatch system to apply to Upwells, while ignoring that Upwells aren’t run by the NPCs who manage Crimewatch. ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 7:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/17 "2021-04-18T19:35:07Z")
A player engaging in combat with an outlaw or a suspect has nothing to to with NPC crimewatch. I had enough of stupid for tonight . I feel like I’ve lost some IQ points replying to you. If you don’t know what context is , go for a walk. ---
**Author:** ![Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mkikaden_tiragen/32/243913_2.png) [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mkikaden_Tiragen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 8:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/18 "2021-04-18T20:14:49Z")
> [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](#): > > A player engaging in combat with an outlaw or a suspect has nothing to to with NPC crimewatch. What do you think Suspect and Outlaw statuses are? They are literally part of the Crimewatch system, and only apply to Empire space. Being flagged Suspect, or holding an Outlaw security status, is entirely about being a legal target in Empire space - which determines whether _NPCs retaliate for attacking these players_. You cannot divorce these features from the Crimewatch system. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/19 "2021-04-18T20:37:58Z")
> [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > while ignoring that Upwells aren’t run by the NPCs who manage Crimewatch. try to dock with a criminal timer ? ---
**Author:** ![Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/astelon_bheskagor/32/360222_2.png) [@Astelon\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Astelon_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2021, 8:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440/20 "2021-04-18T20:41:00Z")
Have you read the title ? It’s about highsec first and this: > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Outlaw and suspect have far less meaning in low sec, and zero meaning in null sec is B R A I N F A R T. > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > Being flagged Suspect, or holding an Outlaw security status, is entirely about being a legal target in Empire space Unless you are tethered . Then you are defeating and evading the Crimewatch system . > [@Mkikaden\_Tiragen](#): > > which determines whether _NPCs retaliate for attacking these players_. I am not talking about NPCs to retaliate and kill those players . What NPCs have to do if I instapop an outlaw , before they arrive there to kill it ? Also I don’t think that you know the difference between an outlaw and criminal timer . Read about them. But I can’t instapop (instakill) an outlaw before faction police arrives to kill it if he is in space tethered , can’t I ? Read the original post and the replies. [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/change-how-tether-works-in-highsec-for-suspects-and-outlaws/306440.md?page=2)