# Chaos Era Continues - Cyno Update **URL:** \ **Category:** Upcoming Features & Changes\ **Tags:** null-sec, low-sec, pvp\ **Created:** [August 14, 2019, 4:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197 "2019-08-14T16:46:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 117
**Author:** ![Ellison\_Onizuka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ellison_onizuka/32/314780_2.png) [@Ellison\_Onizuka](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ellison_Onizuka)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 4:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2398 "2019-08-30T04:05:27Z")
With the up coming changes for cynos any guess work on what is jumping in will be removed. If its and industrial you know that its a JF. I don’t really feel like this is good for the game and I think it will make JFs easy targets. There will be no concerns for a fleet being bridged or a dread or carrier coming into the cyno. Anyway what is everyone else’s thoughts of the single ship type cyno. ---
**Author:** ![Compo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/compo/32/167680_2.png) [@Compo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Compo)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 4:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2399 "2019-08-30T04:22:28Z")
![Book](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/9/e/9eea8d02bfe01bd241ba3150e21d6517a7b2bc3f.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Theron\_Larkis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theron_larkis/32/170573_2.png) [@Theron\_Larkis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Theron_Larkis)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 5:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2401 "2019-08-30T05:46:51Z")
“butbutbut this makes it more difficult, surely that’s an unrelated side effect CCP didn’t think about so I’ll make another thread to explain it to them. So they can fix that”. Yeah, no. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2403 "2019-08-30T08:14:29Z")
> [@Sgt\_Ocker](#): > > is also hard to replace as each one is 20K m3 packaged. When I was transporting T1 haulers (via minerals and BPC) each was ~650m3. But go with your 20K, if you like it. All competent JF pilots have a good laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2404 "2019-08-30T08:25:52Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > When I was transporting T1 haulers (via minerals and BPC) each was ~650m3. But go with your 20K, if you like it. All competent JF pilots have a good laugh. Have fun building something in a system, station or structure without manufacturing service. Have fun getting the materials for ship, cyno and fittings (which increases your volume a lot) plus LO to a location, build the things, then move the ship with cyno to where you actually need it and then get intercepted. Rinse and repeat. Yes, JF pilots will laugh at you. With comments like these it’s no wonder that CCP can get away with poor game design competence every single time. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2405 "2019-08-30T08:39:27Z")
> [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](#): > > Have fun building something in a system, station or structure without manufacturing service. Then don’t, do it where there is a manufacturing service … simple, right? 😉 We can go on and on, I don’t see a big problem with the changes. Just a nice challenge to overcome I see solutions all over the place. You do see only problems, because of what? Lack of flexibility, knowledge, willing to adapt I presume. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2406 "2019-08-30T08:45:23Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > Then don’t, do it where there is a manufacturing service … simple, right? 😉 In your simple mind, certainly. But for that simple mind many other things are also simple. For instance picking things up that are in a given location without any possibility to build a cyno ship there. > [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > You do see only problems, because of what? Lack of flexibility, knowledge, willing to adapt I presume. No, I see problems because of not thought through, unreasonable and clearly drug-usage related development approaches. What CCP has planned is not a challenge, it’s an utter waste of time for all intends and purposes. I am flexible enough to have lots of cyno locations prestocked, I am knowledgeable enough to know how to use cloak-MWD with a T1 hauler. But I do not see any reason why I adapting to pure idiocy from CCP? That’s a really hard call. There is absolutely zero gains from these changes for JF pilots. Zero. Nothing. In contrast, it causes nothing but more burden for an already underpaid and underappreciated service. And CCP thinks this a good thing because they cannot think anything through. But again, why would they have to if they have yessayers like you. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2407 "2019-08-30T08:48:31Z")
> [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](#): > > In contrast, it causes nothing but more burden for an already underpaid and underappreciated service. Maybe it kicks out people like you from the business leaving more for the others and make it profitable again? ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2408 "2019-08-30T08:50:24Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > Maybe it kicks out people like you from the business leaving more for the others and make it profitable again? Hardly. But I hope it will kick you in the rear wherever you go with your T1 haulers to light cynos. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2409 "2019-08-30T08:51:19Z")
Unlikely, I will be the one killing your cynos, and maybe helping with restock. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 8:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2410 "2019-08-30T08:52:15Z")
Only in your pipe dreams. Though, people like you will probably also like this change because they finally get the reward they crave so much for their intense PVP: killmarks for shooting a stationary target. Thinking about it, this has been a long standing meme request in the forums as well. I guess that ticks another item on the Meme Era development list. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 9:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2411 "2019-08-30T09:48:00Z")
> [@Tipa\_Riot](#): > > Maybe it kicks out people like you from the business leaving more for the others and make it profitable again? I’m actually looking into getting rid of my JF, if for no reason than paying those 5 extra subs per month to a game that clearly no longer wants me to play, seems a little silly. CCP Rise made it clear during his TiS, smaller groups are nothing but collateral damage in the Era of Chaos. Not feeling very loyal to CCP right now with their current attitude of Fuk over as many long term players as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 10:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2412 "2019-08-30T10:34:15Z")
> [@Sgt\_Ocker](#): > > Not feeling very loyal to CCP right now with their current attitude of Fuk over as many long term players as possible. Nor should you. And online character numbers finally start to reflect the opinion of people on CCP’s development approach. ---
**Author:** ![Staq](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/staq/32/236552_2.png) [@Staq](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Staq)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 1:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2413 "2019-08-30T13:28:36Z")
Skill Extractors on “Sale” now… well there’s your answer. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Pink](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fuzzy_pink/32/186496_2.png) [@Fuzzy\_Pink](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fuzzy_Pink)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 1:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2414 "2019-08-30T13:58:43Z")
I’m not wild about this change. I just bought a jump freighter a month ago and am figuring out how to use it. First I used disposable corvettes on low-skill pilots. After the first proposed change I thought about it for a while and decided that covert cynos would be cool. I’d have to use a more expensive ship, but it wouldn’t certainly die like the corvettes did. I spent some valuable training to get my cyno alts into bombers/covert cynos. So now not only is that training time wasted, but now I have to use a more expensive, more cumbersome ship that will certainly die. I know the details on the industrial cyno are not set. Will it show as a beacon that anyone can warp to? My suggestions are: either implement the industrial cyno in such a way the losing the cyno ship is not a forgone conclusion or allow us to put the cyno on cheaper, smaller ships. Putting them on corvettes was stupid I agree, but restricting them to T1 industrials is too far the other way. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 2:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2415 "2019-08-30T14:00:27Z")
> [@shaun\_27](#): > > Be interesting to see what the duration is on industrial cyno. 10 mins seems a bit steep its a shame they changed their mind on covert opts cyno. It’s 10 minutes. ---
**Author:** ![EOH\_SandRock](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/eoh_sandrock/32/423933_2.png) [@EOH\_SandRock](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/EOH_SandRock)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 2:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2416 "2019-08-30T14:50:02Z")
Industrial Cynosural Field Generators can be fit by Tech I Industrial Ships, Blockade Runners, and Deep Space Transports If this was an add on it would be fine with the covop cyno. but removing it from covop is an issue. If there can only be 1 option for it than stick with covop cyno over only using an industrial. Though both would be more ideal, for a static cheaper cyno that will certainly die in places like low sec the industrial is fine; for everywhere else a covop would be better. If the issue is sp for the cyno and not cost just drop from lvl 5 to lvl 4 on skill requirement. I think a lot of the un-happy people with cyno changes is coming from lack of ship options. For combat there is 2 types recon and black op battleship. So it would not be a stretch to have 2 for logistics covop and industrial. where logistics live and die on ability to move. ---
**Author:** ![Hillbert\_Alexis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hillbert_alexis/32/263334_2.png) [@Hillbert\_Alexis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Hillbert_Alexis)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 3:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2417 "2019-08-30T15:00:01Z")
Not everyone has access to refit structures and/or manufacturing services… plus you need reprocessing unless you are hauling minerals. It’s an even larger logistic nightmare for most everyone to get someone to come over, turn on a service, wait some hours/few days and then. So to use your method, the character needs roles to handle citadel fittings, needs to bring roughly 15k m3 of minerals + bpcs (for 25 runs) and a service mod to each citadel? Madness I hunt for jump freighters and this change is direct pandering to low skilled hunters. So much so it’s insulting. Now there’s a beacon AND a killmail that shows without question where a freighter operates out of. This change only matters in lowsec areas anyway, no JF dies in null outside of user error or disconnection. If we had the option to use indy cyno or covert or normal cyno, none of this would matter. Risk vs reward. Instead we get screw you not just PVE players, but logistic players directly and follows it with half assed coverups for pvp pandering. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 3:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2418 "2019-08-30T15:07:52Z")
You know there are NPC stations in lowsec, you don’t always need a citadel with services. Also I expect people to stock up the markets there with hauler hulls. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2019, 3:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197/2419 "2019-08-30T15:44:41Z")
> [@Hillbert\_Alexis](#): > > This change only matters in lowsec areas anyway, no JF dies in null outside of user error or disconnection. > > If we had the option to use indy cyno or covert or normal cyno, none of this would matter. > Risk vs reward. > Instead we get screw you not just PVE players, but logistic players directly and follows it with half assed coverups for pvp pandering. Come now, this is the problem: Jump Freighters can’t die at all, at least when they are using their jump drive to move about. They are literally 100% safe unless the player makes a mistake. At this level of safety, one might legitimately ask why they are even in the game at all if there is no game play around them? I get that adding some risk to the freighter itself might be a tricky game design problem to solve and one that impacts on many other game systems, but at least CCP can change gameplay around the JF cyno ship easily and with less risk. In that respect, while using T1 haulers might raise a small logistical problem, the cost is still barely noticeable - like less than 0.1% of the jump freighter. I think the headfake in the communication from CCP with the change from covert to a new industrial cyno could have been handled better, but this is probably a much better solution in the end. The small additional overhead adds some gameplay and cost to the cynos where your choices, actions, and knowledge might again separate good JF pilots from bad JF pilots a bit, certainly more than the current situation. And like everything in the Chaos Era, it can always be reverted if it proves not to work well. And as Tipa said, I am sure intrepid entrepreneurs will make a business of seeding stations with ships to service this market, creating content and fuelling interactions in the sandbox. Change is hard people, but this one is going to work out just fine. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197.md?page=116) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chaos-era-continues-cyno-update/182197.md?page=118)