# Chronicles of a liberal holder part 1 **URL:** \ **Category:** Intergalactic Summit\ **Created:** [October 25, 2017, 9:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191 "2017-10-25T21:01:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lasairiona\_Raske](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lasairiona_raske/32/467893_2.png) [@Lasairiona\_Raske](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lasairiona_Raske)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 11:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/21 "2017-10-27T11:40:41Z")
_sigh_ And most people are smart enough to keep themselves to themselves when it comes to topics like this. Seen this before. An Amarr defending the way he treats his slaves. Can we please have something more original? ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 11:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/22 "2017-10-27T11:57:57Z")
Ah, another dishonest fuckknuckle rewriting the dictionaries to suit himself. Slave: Person who is the legal property of another. Forced to obey. This isn’t, and never will be the same or even similar to addictions, working a job, servitude to people or causes, drives or motivations. There is no “my” definition or “your” definition, there is _the_ definition of the word and you deciding to take a gods-be-damned hatchet to it does not change what that definition is. Is it just me or are capsuleer quality for all the nations deteriorating significantly? ---
**Author:** ![Valerie\_Valate](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/valerie_valate/32/386231_2.png) [@Valerie\_Valate](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Valerie_Valate)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 12:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/23 "2017-10-27T12:03:45Z")
> [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](#): > > Is it just me or are capsuleer quality for all the nations deteriorating significantly? Don’t romanticize the past. There were just as many fools then as there are today. Possibly not as visible though. Probably the Jovians are behind this. 👽 ---
**Author:** ![Halcyon\_Ember](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/halcyon_ember/32/131702_2.png) [@Halcyon\_Ember](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Halcyon_Ember)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 12:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/24 "2017-10-27T12:17:00Z")
Dark Times ---
**Author:** ![Ignus\_Veritas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ignus_veritas/32/33173_2.png) [@Ignus\_Veritas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ignus_Veritas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 12:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/25 "2017-10-27T12:19:15Z")
Lasairiona Raske I see merit to your words. Slavery is clearly not a very popular subject outside of Amarr communication canals. I felt I might get some support from those of other nations for wanting to improve the living conditions for slaves throughout the Empire. I see now that I was wrong and shall speak no more of the subject after this. As for you Mizhara Del’thul. What is the purpose of your insults? I have not been educated in such a… direct manner of communicating. I am however schooled in “reading between the lines”. Are you suggestion that by "the"definition of slavery, anyone can force others to obey aslong as they don’t register them? they would then not be legal property and thus fall outside of “the” definition of slaves as presented by you. Well enough on the matter. Sometimes I find it is best to agree to disagree. Since you are all capsuleers I consider you to be the most succesful people in New Eden and I seek your comradery not your hatred. Fly safe! ---
**Author:** ![Tannia\_Ambrye](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tannia_ambrye/32/410653_2.png) [@Tannia\_Ambrye](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tannia_Ambrye)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 1:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/26 "2017-10-27T13:44:03Z")
> [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](#): > > Ah, another dishonest fuckknuckle rewriting the dictionaries to suit himself. That’s because equivocation is fun. Amirite? This is usually done so they can shift between the accepted use of a term and their own definition in the middle of an argument to make it seem like they’re one and the same. I’m glad he provided us his definition on his own at least and he did simply try to slip it in unnoticed. Usually I have to press my interlocutor to give their definition of the terms they’re using. ---
**Author:** ![Tannia\_Ambrye](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tannia_ambrye/32/410653_2.png) [@Tannia\_Ambrye](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tannia_Ambrye)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 1:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/27 "2017-10-27T13:54:23Z")
I appreciate your providing your definition of slavery, but even if accept it a valid, it doesn’t justify slavery in Amarr. Tu quoque is not a valid defense. Of course, I don’t accept your definition of slavery. If how ever you want to talk about worker’s and civil rights and how those in power seek more power at the expense of these rights, then that’s a separate,albeit legitimate discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Ignus\_Veritas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ignus_veritas/32/33173_2.png) [@Ignus\_Veritas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ignus_Veritas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 2:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/28 "2017-10-27T14:08:52Z")
As promised I will lay the subject to rest. No pun intended. Let us talk about worker’s and civil rights instead. What is your view on these matters Tannia Ambrye? ---
**Author:** ![Ignus\_Veritas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ignus_veritas/32/33173_2.png) [@Ignus\_Veritas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ignus_Veritas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 2:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/29 "2017-10-27T14:47:14Z")
Chronicles of a liberal holder part 2 YC 119, Deepari, Amarr somewhere in the Claysson system, These are the chronicles of Ignus Veritas. The capsuleer “community” if it can be called that. Is not what I had expected it to be. As a matter of fact that goes for most of the non-capsuleers I,ve met aswell. I allways believed all but those from Amarr space where savages. Under Amarr rule they would have better lives then they ever could outside of it. Now I am not so sure anymore. Conversing with “heathens” has brought me a lot of confusion. It is clear to me now that the greater part of New Eden considers the Amarr theology as fraudulent. I am forced by logic to give the opinion of the masses serious consideration. I allready had an unorthodox view on Amarr society. Now I ponder, could we truly have been so wrong about the will of the divine? My love for the Empire has not suffered. Amarr IS holy. After all It has brought peace and prosperity to the masses for a very, very long time. If part of Amarr is sick and twisted then I will seek to heal her. It would seem God sends me on this path. Whilst I flew through space as captain of the salvaging Coercer I mentioned earlier a capsuleer donated me enough ISK to buy a cruiser class vessel. I have taken this as a Sign. I have selected a new and bigger crew, all of them are well paid for the risk they take in flying with me. They are also all willing to die for the Empire. In light of my recent doubts I have chosen an Arbiter class drone boat. It lacks the charm of holy light but enemy fire directed at the drones is enemy fire that doesn’t kill my crew. Who knew such things might be important for more then economical reasons? ---
**Author:** ![Mitara\_Newelle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mitara_newelle/32/384431_2.png) [@Mitara\_Newelle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mitara_Newelle)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 4:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/30 "2017-10-27T16:37:30Z")
> [@Ignus\_Veritas](#): > > Deepari, Amarr somewhere in the Claysson system … Would an astrocartographer care to try and explain this? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/31 "2017-10-27T16:44:42Z")
Maybe Claysson is the name of one of the planets, and it has a large system of moons he got lost in. ---
**Author:** ![Aria\_Jenneth](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aria_jenneth/32/469792_2.png) [@Aria\_Jenneth](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aria_Jenneth)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 5:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/32 "2017-10-27T17:10:41Z")
Could be local names, my lady? I mean, it’s only in the last couple hundred years my own culture learned our system’s star was … well, just another star. We definitely don’t call our own homeworld “Saisio III.” ---
**Author:** ![Ignus\_Veritas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ignus_veritas/32/33173_2.png) [@Ignus\_Veritas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ignus_Veritas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 6:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/33 "2017-10-27T18:03:26Z")
Ah, I see I made an error wich led to some confusion. Maybe I really shouldn’t have tried to interface with my drones whilst pilotting and updating my chronicles simultaneously. Then again I suppose the bleeding eyes kind of gave that away allready. Everything’s fine now thanks for pointing out my error. ---
**Author:** ![Maria\_Daphiti](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/maria_daphiti/32/322573_2.png) [@Maria\_Daphiti](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Maria_Daphiti)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 6:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/34 "2017-10-27T18:10:48Z")
> Blockquote > My views on what should happen to Holy Amarr can be considered unorthodox. You can imagine my joy to live under the reign of Empress Catiz Tash-Murkon, long may she rule! Are you implying Empress Catiz is unorthodox? > [@Ignus\_Veritas](#): > > Before I died I had a long walk with my chamberlain Arbjan. He chooses to no longer use his Minmatar family name. 15 standard years ago Arbjan was a street thief from Krusual descent who got caught trying to steal fresh water on Mishi I.V. As you might know fresh water is both rare and extremely valuable in those regions. Death by dehydration is what awaited him. Suffice it to say that I intervened. So, umm… this guy is a slave right? > [@Ignus\_Veritas](#): > > During my walk with Arbjan we discussed the management of my various holdings. I was allready certain of my discission to become a capsuleer and was basicly transferring all my power and obligations. You should know that Arbjan has had many opportunities to kill me and take my wealth. I had arranged it so because I believe any man is only as strong as the community that supports him. Arbjan never once knicked me with the traditional minmatar razor he used to shave me with everyday. Even though he knew I had documents made up to grand him exemption from punishment should such an event occur. His loyalty is without question. If Arbjan feels he has obligations to the minmatar then he probably thinks he serves them best by serving me. Do you, umm, know the late Lord Arzad Hamri? This sorta reminds me of him… except maybe worse? > [@Ignus\_Veritas](#): > > To optimize the efficiency of my slaves I have tried to adopt some aspects of Caldari slave keeping. Ergo: waving isk on a stick whilst riding on the back of the slave. I have tried to combine this with some Gallentean tricks on succesful slavery: all my slaves have acces to adult entertainment materials so that they can relieve some stress and percieve their circumstances as acceptable. Not only are you confused, you are a heretic! ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/35 "2017-10-27T18:28:02Z")
> [@Maria\_Daphiti](#): > > Are you implying Empress Catriz is unorthodox? I’ll go ahead an imply Empress Kittens is unorthodox. She’s about the _least_ orthodox kitten I’ve ever seen! No ball of yarn? No chasing laser pointers… what gives?! ---
**Author:** ![Vaari](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vaari/32/373419_2.png) [@Vaari](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vaari)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2017, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/36 "2017-10-28T08:44:21Z")
I dare to suggest your chamberlain has transferred from minmatar to ammatar. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/4/1/41ec4921cbaca7a6f9ea556e7cc20018461eae5e.png) [@system](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2018, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/chronicles-of-a-liberal-holder-part-1/34191/37 "2018-01-26T08:44:33Z")
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