# Concerning Direct Enlistment, Faction Warfare, and Empire Standings **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 20, 2023, 10:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874 "2023-03-20T22:54:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 5:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/41 "2023-03-23T05:45:04Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > Also, while the standings guides are useful, you have to acknowledge that following them is: > > 1. A _major_ grindy hassle that takes a lot of time and effort > 2. Can only be done _once_ (if I understand things correctly) Cosmos/Event/Career agents are one time deals but yes. The only sustainable method is via the epic arcs in the long run, but as others have said you can juggle FW allegiance and storymode missions with great difficulty, but in the long run this isn’t sustainable. Using the faction arcs you can calculate how much standing you will lose, how long it will take you to lose it, how much you can recover, and how often. To do these epic arcs you need to both: a) maintain standings above -5 for the faction and b) maintain standings above +5 for either the agent, corporation, or faction. The exception is the SoE arc which has less stringent requirements. The SoE arc is what makes repairing one at a time possible, because you can double dip on the factions arc and the SoE arc. Over time that adds up if you’re otherwise careful. It’s like have an equation with defined variables verses a function riddled with multiple ‘solve for x’ variables which compounds in difficulty each time you complete it. I don’t mind redoing all the arcs regularly, it’s good money. What I don’t like is how quickly the math breaks down if you’re damaging two factions at once rather than one. ---
**Author:** ![Alexander\_Minto\_Hughes](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alexander_minto_hughes/32/511046_2.png) [@Alexander\_Minto\_Hughes](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alexander_Minto_Hughes)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 7:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/42 "2023-03-23T07:10:41Z")
Already did it once. I can do it again with ease ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 8:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/43 "2023-03-23T08:39:34Z")
> [@Nascent3ch0](#): > > To do these epic arcs you need to both: a) maintain standings above -5 for the faction and b) maintain standings above +5 for either the agent, corporation, or faction. For access to the level 4 Epic Arcs, all 3 standings - Agent, Corp and Faction - need to be above -2.00 standing along with +5.00 or higher standing with either the starting Agent, his Corp or the Faction. Your standing is only checked by the starting Agent, no other Agents in the Arc does a standings check. About the only way to get negative standing with the starting Agent is to fail his mission which is basically just travel to another Agent. So in reality all you really need is +5.00 or higher standing with the Corp and maintain -1.99 or higher Faction standing for access. ---
**Author:** ![Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/geo_eclipse_oksaras/32/500781_2.png) [@Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 9:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/44 "2023-03-23T09:21:48Z")
Exactly, but the one thing OP and several others have been upset about is that FW is regulated by unmodified standings, which the social skills wont matter. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 9:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/45 "2023-03-23T09:57:29Z")
At first I thought this thread was about not being able to repair Faction standings after doing FW… then I thought it was about not being able to join FW due to having bad standings with the chosen Faction. So now I have no idea what this thread is about… 😐 ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 10:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/46 "2023-03-23T10:38:58Z")
It’s about people looking for more PvP options, not for pve requirements. Some people aren’t interested in the standard “do your quest grind” MMO paradigm, it’s why they’re (still) playing EVE. ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 10:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/47 "2023-03-23T10:50:35Z")
> [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > it’s why they’re (still) playing EVE. For now. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 11:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/48 "2023-03-23T11:57:25Z")
It’s about the exact opposite of this. It’s about how to PvE and PvP on one character. You’re in the wrong place. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/49 "2023-03-23T13:04:24Z")
Then DMC was right and you’re just crying about the consequences of your own choices. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/50 "2023-03-23T13:08:39Z")
I am genuinely impressed by how edgy you are and wish I could be more like you. Will you teach me your wit and insight? \>.\> ^.^ \<.\< ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/51 "2023-03-23T13:09:35Z")
Isn’t it -5 when you become restricted to level 1 agents? ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/52 "2023-03-23T13:13:00Z")
In this case it’s the derived standings that are a problem, then how they are calculated. I just think it doesn’t make sense for two factions to penalize you for your actions against one when they just made a big deal about the traditional faction alliances breaking down. I’ve yet to hear a compelling reason for why it’s this way, other then the argument advanced by others that it’s CCP’s profit margin this services, not the players or the game. In other words the same old story whenever multiboxing is involved. ---
**Author:** ![Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/geo_eclipse_oksaras/32/500781_2.png) [@Geo\_Eclipse\_Oksaras](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/53 "2023-03-23T13:15:37Z")
@CCP_Dopamine or @CCP_Swift could answer that most likely @CCP_Delegate_Zero too ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/54 "2023-03-23T13:17:35Z")
It’s very simple: people want to do FW because it’s, generally, more solo and small scale PvP have a valid point when questioning the necessity of the arbitrary standing loss& requirements, which realistically can only be solved with a grind. “Why am I forced to pve if I want to do pvp” is a reasonable question given that FW is getting a massive overhaul. Since that (apparently) isn’t your issue we have to conclude it’s just a self imposed “I want all my numbers to go up”. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/55 "2023-03-23T13:18:00Z")
Hopefully if they (@CCP_Dopamine and @CCP_Swift) did we’d get more then ‘impactful choices rarara’ because the system being set up this way is anything but meaningfully impactful. It’s an entirely artificial barrier to entry. There are loads of other ways standings could be handled in this regard that make way more sense. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/56 "2023-03-23T13:19:38Z")
Just want to be able to make informed choices so I have as many options as possible without getting on the alt and alt account merrygoround. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/57 "2023-03-23T13:22:39Z")
You can’t, not really, unless you commit your character to it and/or love pve grind. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/58 "2023-03-23T13:26:57Z")
That’s what I’ve gathered from the previous replies. Personally, I’d find the repair grind manageable for one faction. Two is just too much, which is the part about this that’s an artificial barrier for entry. Where are the people calling for the players fighting for the Minmatar and Gallente Militia to lose docking access at Jita in service to immersion and realism? Nowhere, which means it really isn’t about impactful choices. It’s seemingly about giving CCP more money (in the form of additional subs, however they come) to pay the toll to avoid the system design. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/59 "2023-03-23T13:29:30Z")
You gain standing with 2 factions, not one. If you’re really anal you could even alternate between the two to level at the same pace. Not being welcome in space that belongs to the opposite faction while part of FW is completely fine. The issue is that it still has repercussions once you leave FW. ---
**Author:** ![Nascent3ch0](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nascent3ch0/32/374213_2.png) [@Nascent3ch0](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nascent3ch0)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2023, 1:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874/60 "2023-03-23T13:33:21Z")
Epics arcs have zero derived standings, good or bad, my dear. I don’t know what you’re not understanding, if you damage two (via FW interaction) faster than you can repair two (via epic arcs) then you’d have to either go the alt route or the shuffling allegiances route. I haven’t worked out the math entirely for the allegiances route, but it doesn’t look sustainable over the long term, since eventually you’d be forced to either choose not to participate in FW or loose too much standings to have access to the arcs you need to fix them. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/concerning-direct-enlistment-faction-warfare-and-empire-standings/399874.md?page=4)