# Criminals and gank failures **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [October 31, 2021, 7:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769 "2021-10-31T07:15:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 4:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/405 "2021-12-05T16:01:41Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > all you are is a F1 monkey They said they haul. So… Using cloak/mwd makes us F1 monkeys now? You do know that only works if someone is telling them to do it, right? For someone who claims not to gank, you sure have a bee in your bonnet about defending it. What happened to that cast iron gank defense you had btw? Did it fail? ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 6:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/406 "2021-12-05T18:52:50Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > That isn’t the ganker’s fault, nor does it speak to their skill level. It is the fault of the target. I could deploy every trick at my disposal, and I now have quite a few, and still get ganked. For example, mining as far from the warp in point as possible is futile if the ganker has himself saved a warp in point some way from the belt warp in point. It would not be hard for gankers to set that up…but in my observation most don’t. Likewise, d-scan really only tells me that someone is within 14.3 AU. They could be lurking outside one of the stations within that range. But there’s no guarantee that if I go to the third station 26 AU away there won’t be gankers lurking there. There is nothing that makes one 100% safe. Thus it simply cannot _always_ be the ‘fault’ of the ganked if they do get ganked. Thus far I have never been ganked while mining, as I am extremely situationally aware, but I am sure the first time is inevitable…as no two situations are ever the same. ---
**Author:** ![Etch\_Masuka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/etch_masuka/32/468743_2.png) [@Etch\_Masuka](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Etch_Masuka)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 7:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/407 "2021-12-05T19:00:25Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Likewise, d-scan really only tells me that someone is within 14.3 AU. They could be lurking outside one of the stations within that range. But there’s no guarantee that if I go to the third station 26 AU away there won’t be gankers lurking there What you can do in this situation if local is busy and you suspect gankers are around is warp to a moon closer to that station and Dscan from there. It’s an extra step but worth it if you have concerns. ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 7:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/408 "2021-12-05T19:04:25Z")
> [@Etch\_Masuka](#): > > What you can do in this situation if local is busy and you suspect gankers are around is warp to a moon closer to that station and Dscan from there. It’s an extra step but worth it if you have concerns. Indeed…I do just that, or warp to 100km from the station ( much safer to do in a Venture ) and get ready to get the hell out if I spot anything. Another great trick, for getting out of stations in a hurry, is to know which asteroid belts are directly in line with the station exit point. Even in a Proc, one then goes to warp quite quickly. A great little trick for checking stations…create a saved spot 2000 km from the station. Warp in to 100km…check who is there…warp out to 2000km…and then into the station if nobody is lurking ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 10:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/409 "2021-12-05T22:18:56Z")
You should learn what groups are around that may gank you , learn to watch for there scouts it’s how we try and trap them or catch them moving . Try and mine in a group , more eyes looking around the better . > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > A great little trick for checking stations…create a saved spot 2000 km from the station. Warp in to 100km…check who is there…warp out to 2000km…and then into the station if nobody is lurking If anyone is lurking move systems , eve has loads of systems . ---
**Author:** ![Aaaarrgg](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaaarrgg/32/395089_2.png) [@Aaaarrgg](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaaarrgg)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/410 "2021-12-05T22:19:06Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Another great trick, for getting out of stations in a hurry, is to know which asteroid belts are directly in line with the station exit point. Even in a Proc, one then goes to warp quite quickly. insta undocks are a good thing to have in any station you use a lot, best to make your own rather than warp to a celestial that maybe a bit off ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 12:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/411 "2021-12-06T00:26:33Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > They said they haul. > > So… Using cloak/mwd makes us F1 monkeys now? You do know that only works if someone is telling them to do it, right? > > For someone who claims not to gank, you sure have a bee in your bonnet about defending it. > > What happened to that cast iron gank defense you had btw? Did it fail? They went on to say they also supposedly do null warfare and have done PvP 😃 Nope. The cast iron defense is still in effect. In fact CCP almost banned peeps over it cause it works so good 😃 That dude in question is saying PvP is easy and if believed, all they’ve done is F1 monkey so yea of course its easy. They’ve never done small gang and never done the hard work of hunting a player. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > I could deploy every trick at my disposal, and I now have quite a few, and still get ganked. For example, mining as far from the warp in point as possible is futile if the ganker has himself saved a warp in point some way from the belt warp in point. It would not be hard for gankers to set that up…but in my observation most don’t. > > Likewise, d-scan really only tells me that someone is within 14.3 AU. They could be lurking outside one of the stations within that range. But there’s no guarantee that if I go to the third station 26 AU away there won’t be gankers lurking there. > > There is nothing that makes one 100% safe. Thus it simply cannot _always_ be the ‘fault’ of the ganked if they do get ganked. Thus far I have never been ganked while mining, as I am extremely situationally aware, but I am sure the first time is inevitable…as no two situations are ever the same. Actually in high sec if you are aware, you will most likely never get ganked. Which is why you haven’t. The window of engagement is very small and if they miss and you make them miss you are fine. They wouldn’t gank you on the station. Then there’s guns silly. What you are allegedly starting to find out is that in high sec, if you follow standard operating procedures you are fine. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Indeed…I do just that, or warp to 100km from the station ( much safer to do in a Venture ) and get ready to get the hell out if I spot anything. Another great trick, for getting out of stations in a hurry, is to know which asteroid belts are directly in line with the station exit point. Even in a Proc, one then goes to warp quite quickly. > > A great little trick for checking stations…create a saved spot 2000 km from the station. Warp in to 100km…check who is there…warp out to 2000km…and then into the station if nobody is lurking Yep. See? You admit further that you only get ganked if you are not good at the game. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 12:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/412 "2021-12-06T00:27:36Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Sure, tactics can _lower_ the risk…but they can never ever eliminate it completely. And in fact it is often the gankers who have the sense of a potato, as hunting someone…especially miners…really _isn’t_ all that hard. > > For me, sure there’s d-scan, Local, yada yada…but **the** #1 rule of ganker avoidance is to not be predictable. The #2 rule is to use d-scan to determine whether there’s anyone waiting outside any station you might flee to. In fact, far more important than a ‘safe spot’ is a spot where you can determine that for several stations and choose one to dock in. And if the gankers hang around…just log in an alt in a different system and carry on mining 🙂 No one ever said eliminate it completely? But you have already admitted that if you follow the ways and means, ganking isn’t an issue. Ergo, the people getting ganked are bad at the game. Ergo, it is completely the target’s fault, in accordance with the gamall vegur 😃 ---
**Author:** ![safira\_jomita](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/safira_jomita/32/405219_2.png) [@safira\_jomita](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/safira_jomita)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 2:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/413 "2021-12-06T02:01:45Z")
> [@Aaaarrgg](#): > > insta undocks are a good thing to have in any station you use a lot, best to make your own rather than warp to a celestial that maybe a bit off I learned that lesson the hard way, lost a BR full of juicy T2 stuff xD ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/414 "2021-12-06T07:13:09Z")
Maybe if people could report ganker activity here too, Useful info Which ganker group . Where . What system. What ships. Fleet size. And the eve time they are active. Gankers like @Aaaarrgg don’t really need a report as he travels from point a to b killing what he can . @Cargo_Bandit group can be on line a lot , the customs agents guys down odin way , now they don’t gank a lot and pick target carefully, only going for very lucrative targets , meaning they are hard to fight as it’s boring just waiting 1/2 a day for them to gank . And please report the gankers sitting at gates and any victims names you see them kill. So much killboard hiding is going on these days , we need victims names to get the killrights. Zkill has changed of late and now gankers can hide kills , I think if you get killed by concord and break the law it should be public knowledge and ccp should make this info available in some way . Maybe though concord agents . ---
**Author:** ![Aaaarrgg](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aaaarrgg/32/395089_2.png) [@Aaaarrgg](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aaaarrgg)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/415 "2021-12-06T07:22:49Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > Maybe if people could report ganker activity here too, > > Useful info. _Aaaarrgg_ > > Which ganker group . CODE. > > Where . _Highsec_ > > What system. _all of them_ > > What ships. _Thrasher_ > > Fleet size. _one_ > > And the eve time they are active. _evenings_ … ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/416 "2021-12-06T07:29:18Z")
Thxs Aaaarrgg , and yes by all means to other gankers self report too ---
**Author:** ![Kylanti\_Hendar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kylanti_hendar/32/385538_2.png) [@Kylanti\_Hendar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kylanti_Hendar)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/417 "2021-12-06T07:35:49Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > Zkill has changed of late and now gankers can hide kills This is not true, zkillboard only has access to kills that either the attacker with the final blow or the victim either uploaded or either player had registered their EVE api. This has not changed. Most likely they have removed their api from zkillboard to prevent you using it as intel. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/418 "2021-12-06T07:44:28Z")
> [@Kylanti\_Hendar](#): > > Most likely they have removed their api from zkillboard to prevent you using it as intel. Well that’s a change, it never used to be hard to track gankers and victims, one ganker I’ve been hunting only their pod losses that showing and I know each pod has a tornado linked to it . All I know is that zkill is being manipulated. ---
**Author:** ![Kylanti\_Hendar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kylanti_hendar/32/385538_2.png) [@Kylanti\_Hendar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kylanti_Hendar)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/419 "2021-12-06T07:55:02Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > Well that’s a change, it never used to be hard to track gankers and victims Which would explain why they have done so. I would imagine most high sec PvE folk won’t have their api linked, so it is easy to hide as a ganker. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 8:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/420 "2021-12-06T08:04:04Z")
Yes your right and I think our campaign of collecting killrights has made some gankers hide stuff more ---
**Author:** ![Kylanti\_Hendar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kylanti_hendar/32/385538_2.png) [@Kylanti\_Hendar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kylanti_Hendar)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 8:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/421 "2021-12-06T08:07:29Z")
Thinking about it, there was a change to zkillboard - it started marking kills as ganks. This might also have had an effect as it made gank kills more visible. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 8:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/422 "2021-12-06T08:49:43Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > They went on to say they also supposedly do null warfare Yeah but thats easily ignored as theres no such thing. In a small gang, does everyone do equal amounts of hunting? ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 9:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/423 "2021-12-06T09:39:01Z")
Depends yea. Sometimes you scatter in order to cover multiple points to secure the target. It isn’t that I’m pro or anti ganking. Its that its a valid playstyle and should be supported. There are a plethora of tools to avoid ganks in high sec. I would venture to say if you practice the ways and means, it could be upwards of 90% chance of getting away. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2021, 9:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/424 "2021-12-06T09:56:50Z")
Thats what I tell em too, but then I get told ganking is too easy/hard and that somehow makes my hauling untrue to them. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769.md?page=20) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769.md?page=22)