# Criminals and gank failures **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [October 31, 2021, 7:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769 "2021-10-31T07:15:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 54
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 12:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1077 "2022-02-10T00:35:31Z")
> [@Aiko Danuja](#): > > The antigankers are mostly a bunch of bitterbear losers, salty about the time they were ganked years ago, and they have no idea what they are doing and nobody wants to join them Not one of our members fits that criteria, not sure who your talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 12:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1078 "2022-02-10T00:37:28Z")
Nobody wants to join you, because nobody wants to waste their time defending AFK nullsec freighters. Even the nullsec alliances can’t be bothered to antigank. New bros will have more fun, learn more, and make more isk by ganking - whereas antiganking is a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1079 "2022-02-10T00:56:15Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > This means you have to actively recruit on the forums, discord and ingame via all means available. Then offering the new aspirants training, skillbooks, ships. They can fly a tackle-breaking Maulus or a FastTackler in a few days. They can learn how to scout, probe, the aggro mechanics, how to set up their overview etc. etc… but you have to actually train them. For newbies, such training sessions are highly valuable and keep them entertained. If they even end up on a killmail with their Maulus, Crucifier, Griffin or Slasher, great! Lead them to Lowsec, go Beltrat in Aridia in a Frigfleet for an evening and explain them the different game mechanics there, you can even fly L4 Missions in a RR-Frigfleet earning them money while learning how to remote-rep and setting up their watchlist if they are a logi. There are a thousand ways to start, but complaining on the boards will achieve nothing. In our corp we do all this , training ops once or twice a week, we teach fast tackle and all the above mentioned, I’m the only one who regularly post on the C&P forums as a means to bring attention to the fact that some people do fight back , I try and highlight our successes and I’m happy to talk about our failures. Often people get our threats locked. The same tactic as they use to intimidate pilots in space they use here . Look at Aiko’s last post to me here. We have people doing recruitment, training, people who look for killrights and even our own ganker training , last Friday’s op was fun and we found a fun way to practice. Most of us are like you with not a massive amount of time but we try and we organise as best we can . ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 1:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1080 "2022-02-10T01:15:38Z")
All antigankers offer newbros is “Come help us defend AFK nullsec freighter pilots who have more isk than you, but they won’t pay you anything for help!” Once newbro antigankers figure out what antiganking is all about, it’s no surprise that they stop showing up for fleets. Wow, another AFK almost saved! ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 1:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1081 "2022-02-10T01:49:03Z")
> [@Githany Red](#): > > In our corp we do all this , training ops once or twice a week, we teach fast tackle and all the above mentioned This isn’t how you win fights, Githany; it’s how you have a “fun skirmish” in RvB. You’re mocking yourself as a group by doing this. Your efforts are doing more harm than good to your members because they keep them ignorant of _actual_ EVE combat (note that I am not saying **“real PvP,”** which is a different (and fallacious) concept). ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 3:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1082 "2022-02-10T03:29:43Z")
> [@Hazen Koraka](#): > > I don’t think there’s anything mysterious about what the gankers do. What they do is troll and be toxic and get threads closed due to the standard CCP Spiel with the ruleset. Often it is because the hardworking ISDs have had enough of toxic threads that makes their game forums non-community based and more like a nest of toxicity, non-adult behaviour and childish rants. Uh, its usually the AG peeps who break forum rules on purpose LOL. > [@Hazen Koraka](#): > > I see you read what I just typed and behaved exactly as expected, thank you. LOL, she’s sharing her opinion just as you are. You’re slandering a whole playstyle with no proof. > [@Githany Red](#): > > I do know what you mean but what we do is reactive not proactive , people can’t sit in uedama all day waiting and as have happened in the past we form large fleets that can stop them they simply pack up . Oh there’s a way. > [@Githany Red](#): > > Also one aspect you’re missing completely, the subversive actions the gankers have taken part in , people have been in the past afraid to speak out or take action . When I started this I was warned and indeed felt alone but very slowly got to know some solo members that did the same as I . > Many corps don’t take part in this activity because of the repercussions it can have . Many players are afraid to speak out. Even streamers keep me at arms length because of my negative association with gankers . People often say oh it’s you who fights the gankers and don’t want to know. LOL wut, who are these cowards? Imagine being afraid in a vidya game ROFL. > [@Githany Red](#): > > I’m lucky I found a corp to play eve with who are happy to speak the truth about gankers and try to stop them You wouldn’t really do what it takes tho. > [@Hazen Koraka](#): > > You are being unsavoury 😛 🍿 How? Its RP bruv. > [@Dracvlad](#): > > The fear of being exposed and their mains being targeted is very real for most of the victims… So they are cowards. Got it 😃 > [@Dracvlad](#): > > They counter the counters, and they have a fall back counter that is difficult to interdict because it costs too much for AG to do so. Also if he took the time to observe this Saturday, Kusion was faking the gate and switching it around because we had about 30+ AG in Uedama. Yea, so counter the counter. Its almost like you gotta play the game and think? Amazing 😃 > [@Syzygium](#): > > I just did some solo killing for test purposes. I am one of these “familiy dads” playing 90% solo in this game a few hours every now and then. Neither have the contacts nor time to “set something up”. Just pointing out what is from my observations the problem with AntiGanking. Its not the mechanics, its the people. The problem is caused by highly organized and active players, it can only be fought by highly and active players. Bittervetting is pointless here. Sigh. Preach it brother. Preach it loud. > [@Dracvlad](#): > > You tell me that you saved two Marauders, but what I did was enable them to warp out and not get any where near dying. Because the point never even applied to them, Jason Kusion and his Caracal suicide point went from 153 km locking range to 6.7 km locking range. Tell me again that I was ineffective? LOL wut, he did the same. He didn’t die. See? This is my case in point. Your ego can’t handle and you crap on other potential AGs 😃 You drive them away better than the gankers do 😃 @Githany_Red this your king? This your dude you sacrificed everything for? ROFL. > [@Dracvlad](#): > > Githany pointed out the issues here as did I. You did how long? two days, and you barely scratched the surface of anything. You could not see why the Celestis was effective. LOL, he was saving peeps. Why you crapping on him? The jealousy is real ROFL. The cele ain’t it bro. > [@Syzygium](#): > > I personally tend to believe DPS is more nasty for them. As much as possible (Oracle, Talos, Naga, Tornado) for the first 5 ships, then adding remoterep, then adding ewar. Yep. You are correct. I came to the same realization. I just use a tix or talos to melt. It saves them easy. Hull tank them just in case they turn on you. You gotta realize Drac doesn’t really PvP, he copies others tactics and attempts to use them without understanding them. He thought an MTU was a mobile depot 😃 > [@Syzygium](#): > > I can totally respect if you a re not able to do that yourself like I am unable to do it for RL reasons. At our age (I am 40+) we simply might not have the time being a “Leader” of an active corporation. Someone from the young folks must emerge and say “ok, I am willing to put 20 hours a week in building up a counterpart to the Gankers” and then after some months of effort there can be results. But until this happens, nothing will change. And thats not CCP or the mechanics or the gankers to blame for. Sigh. Someone finally gets it. I feel seen 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/510263_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 3:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1083 "2022-02-10T03:32:41Z")
> [@Githany Red](#): > > In our corp we do all this Well, I can’t judge that. What I can judge is the public available information. Your Corp has 238 Members. TwoHundredThirtyEight. On your Killboard “Activity Last 7 Days” I find barely 3-5 players who do _anything_ at all. The most active ships are 4 frigs and 1 T1 cruiser. That shall not be an insult, its just neutral observation. From a corp this size that claims (roleplay wise) to want to be “The Police” I’d expect hitsquads with a core of 5+ veterans in Cruisers, HACs, Recons, supported by the rookies you currently train in FastTacklers and EwarFrigs (until they can fly the better stuff and learned the basic mechanics). I barely see kills in Uedama or Sivala where most ganks happen, where are you at all? Why not train your newbs directly there? Nothing bad can happen, in the worst case they lose their 2 million frig and you replace it instantly and explain to them what went wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Dyvinex\_Ssasen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyvinex_ssasen/32/303752_2.png) [@Dyvinex\_Ssasen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyvinex_Ssasen)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 3:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1084 "2022-02-10T03:48:24Z")
Hisec is way too scary for me. I blame the gankers! Were it not for them I could play EVE the way it’s meant to be played! AFK with as many bling modules as possible PvEing in hisec space. Because of Aiko and her ilk I am too afraid to do anything but live in Syndicate and try to scam passerby in PF-346 with a game of ASCII cups. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1085 "2022-02-10T07:19:12Z")
> [@Gix Firebrand](#): > > . I personally tend to believe DPS is more nasty for them. As much as possible (Oracle, Talos, Naga, Tornado) for the first 5 ships, then adding remoterep, then adding ewar. This is true we use oracle and tornado to good effect we have a nice Talos fleet that works very well and a group of Ew ships . Even our Armageddon fleet worked well for a time but they counter it by not ganking . Been doing a lot of remote repping lately but the best are mixed fleets like you said . Our Armageddon fleet sits gathering dust we engaged with it once not through lack of trying. Ganking has changed for us over the past 6 months, Uedama now has days in our tz where no ganks take place , just a group of alpha’s strike Gankers sitting at gates for hours on end . It’s only recently that ganking has started up again with large fleets , if we show up in any numbers they don’t gank. As for our corp number , we do have core group , people come and go but we will never kick them, people join us with ALTs because of reasons I’ve mentioned before but is this not like any group in eve , active members fluctuate. We do have a clear out now and then . Just going back to Uedama, I played for 4 evening’s in a row last week, not one large gank fleet why I was on , why other members were off doing their own things. I can’t ask people to sit with me doing that , in the past when we had multiple gank groups we could always find fleets to counter. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1086 "2022-02-10T07:29:19Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > I barely see kills in Uedama or Sivala where most ganks happen, where are you at all? Why not train your newbs directly there? The large gank fleets are not around for us to do that right now , even the alpha gankers leave the gate if we show up , worried we might have KR on them . ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/510263_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1087 "2022-02-10T07:38:18Z")
ok, thanks for the answer, I didn’t mean to insult or belittle you, just asked myself why (in the late EU/TZ at last) I see lots of gankfleets but no “Police” . I had set your corp lightblue for a while, to check if I can spot people in local or in the intel-channels, but never ever saw one 🙂 ) ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1088 "2022-02-10T07:41:08Z")
> [@Githany Red](#): > > even the alpha gankers leave the gate if we show up Well, just forsake your carebear CONCORD protection, by setting yourself yellow flashy (you can loot an object someone else jettisoned) and then I’m sure the gankers will be happy to play with you on a more even playing field. It honestly sounds like hiding behind CONCORD is really making it hard for you to find content - have you considered just moving to lowsec? Or perhaps you should try the null tutorial? Antigankers are crying because they hide behind an automated defense system that automatically and almost instantly vaporizes their opponents, and all they have to do is click on targets, but they are frustrated with trying to get the clicks in time, and why won’t anyone just sit around and wait to get clicked on? Jeez! It’s almost like maybe you should increase the difficulty of your game, in order to find better content (but you will need to do more clicks). ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1089 "2022-02-10T07:49:12Z")
I gave you a like because at the end you did look at the issues. On Saturday I went to Uedama with one character because my alliance mate with the Osprey blob was active in Uedama and asked if anyone was interested, he was repping, escorting and identifying possible targets while I was trying to get there to remove that initial tackle if we got the right gate. After I saved that Vargur they setup three tackle, one of which had used tags to negate it, but they also went AFK. I agree with the DPS, but the first issue is that they are very good at n+1, also they will throw ships at AG to remove them. This is not a whine, it is a statement of fact. The issue with DPS is of course lock time and ROF, I think a Tornado with split guns is good but that is a ROF of 10.57 seconds and in something that takes at most 22 seconds you have to get the right gate, you have to lock as soon as you can and you have to fire. It is pure removal of DPS, while repping negates that DPS. There are various ways to do this. > [@Syzygium](#): > > As said, I neither have the time nor even the goal to set up such a thing. This and what you wrote afterwards was what earned you my like, because you understood the issue and went through it. Respect to you for it. > [@Syzygium](#): > > but complaining on the boards will achieve nothing. The gankers complain that I complain, I just merely point out the balance issues which are CCP’s issues. Githany is explaining why this is hard to do as Gankers just don’t show up or go AFK, so we end up with a lot of bored people. The gankers just turn up and do it, AG don’t have timers and set times, they have to react and as you said most of us have RL or we have other things that we do in Eve. Taking Dracvlad to Uedama put me behind on some production runs…, though others had some AG alts in place. Anyway when I made the suggestion that you organise it, it was not a personal attack, but was said to show the issues. o7 for having a go in Uedama and respect for thinking this through. PS I should however point out, while I know of two high level multi-boxers that AG, one of who is inactive, most AG have one or two accounts. Most gankers can run their own gank fleets with no interaction with others so can starts and stop when they feel like it. It is important to note this when comparing the two. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1090 "2022-02-10T07:49:18Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > ok, thanks for the answer, I didn’t mean to insult or belittle you, just asked myself why (in the late EU/TZ at last) I see lots of gankfleets but no “Police” . I had set your corp lightblue for a while, No insult taken , most of what you say is correct ---
**Author:** ![Donatien\_Alphonse\_Francois](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/donatien_alphonse_francois/32/305419_2.png) [@Donatien\_Alphonse\_Francois](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Donatien_Alphonse_Francois)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1091 "2022-02-10T07:53:27Z")
@Dracvlad @Githany_Red @Syzygium Look, just move to the tutorial zone, (“nullsec”), and then you might learn how to play EVE. Just make sure you don’t end up as an F1 monkey like most eve players. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1092 "2022-02-10T07:55:10Z")
Nullsec is pretty safe. You can just bubblewrap yourself inside a keepstar. No reason to sit in Uedama crying daily for over a decade. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1093 "2022-02-10T07:55:44Z")
Nice try at being insulting…, your ignorance is my bliss. ---
**Author:** ![Donatien\_Alphonse\_Francois](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/donatien_alphonse_francois/32/305419_2.png) [@Donatien\_Alphonse\_Francois](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Donatien_Alphonse_Francois)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1094 "2022-02-10T07:58:47Z")
I’m entirely serious. Nullsec has a lot fewer restrictions than highsec and the vast majority of the time you’re living under a cap umbrella if you have even the slightest ability to make friends and not be a turbo autist. Nullsec is the real tutorial zone. Stop fighting your social betters in a game you’ll never win and join the hordes of F1 monkeys in null, you’ll have more fun. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 7:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1095 "2022-02-10T07:59:45Z")
Been there and done it several times, I am looking at a Vagabond with 18 killmarks from fast response fleets in Catch when I was in Tactical Supremacy for two years. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2022, 8:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769/1097 "2022-02-10T08:01:30Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > Been there and done it several times It’s the tutorial zone - and you appear to need remedial training. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769.md?page=53) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/criminals-and-gank-failures/334769.md?page=55)