# Cruisers now almost useless, thanks to Navy Destroyers **URL:** \ **Category:** PvP Ships & Modules\ **Created:** [November 9, 2022, 9:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673 "2022-11-09T09:01:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Verlyn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/verlyn/32/435163_2.png) [@Verlyn](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Verlyn)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 9:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/1 "2022-11-09T09:01:51Z")
Just look at the recent stats on killboards. A couple Arty Navy Thrashers easily welping a 1600mm plated Omen in as little as 10-15 seconds. Can’t say I never liked the idea of adding more dps to destroyers, but, here we are … ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 9:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/2 "2022-11-09T09:17:17Z")
Balance was never a forte of CCP. But as a silver-lining: You can expect a lot of salty tears in a few months when CCP inevitably nerfs these destroyers into the ground. Or buffs cruisers so that they overpower any BC, and then they buff BC so that they overpower BS and so on… Vicious power creep circle. ---
**Author:** ![zazzmatazz\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zazzmatazz_xu/32/451037_2.png) [@zazzmatazz\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zazzmatazz_Xu)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 11:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/3 "2022-11-09T11:19:11Z")
It will probably be something that works out like the introduction of Titans, eventually the game will be saturated with them. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 2:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/4 "2022-11-09T14:19:46Z")
Yet another buff to highsec suicide ganking! ---
**Author:** ![Verlyn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/verlyn/32/435163_2.png) [@Verlyn](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Verlyn)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 2:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/5 "2022-11-09T14:59:16Z")
lol Yeah … ---
**Author:** ![elitatwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elitatwo/32/373473_2.png) [@elitatwo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/elitatwo)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 4:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/6 "2022-11-09T16:38:36Z")
> [@Verlyn](#): > > A couple Arty Navy Thrashers easily welping a 1600mm plated Omen in as little as 10-15 seconds. And what is the difference to last weekend? That’s right, only the new acquired confirmation bias. Fantasy merely mirrors the truth: Here is a regular thrasher, doing 1800 alpha with quake and requires one gyro to get an alpha of 1800: ![trasher_arty-fit](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/1/e/4/1e46408c986c44ed33205b4ce3c912fb9298d297.jpeg) Now, let’s put the navy one also in the simulator and take a closer look: ![nany-trasher_arty-fit](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/2/0/4/204d5f8a90f70a2456a4876aca187cac1e2a8463.jpeg) Oh, what is going on? First, the damage bonus of the navy version is slightly smaller and you also have one less gun, but in return you still won’t get 1800 alpha with the new boat, however, it is close enough. You see, the thrasher could already do just that. But since most people go with doing what everyone else is doing, no one was flying them until yesterday. Now the confirmation bias goes as follows, the arty thrasher is op. Please nerf the minmatar. No one did see that is was op for 49405830957305 years, while everyone was busy, parroting everyone else. It is still not the ship’s fault, reading the fitting screen is difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Anthony\_FatTony\_Amico](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anthony_fattony_amico/32/391106_2.png) [@Anthony\_FatTony\_Amico](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anthony_FatTony_Amico)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 9:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/7 "2022-11-09T21:24:18Z")
Has any game actually gotten balance right? Dota 2 is also infamous for the new hero addition then 1-2 weeks later it’s nerfed in line. It’s the same thing here. CCP will tweak the new ships as they see the meta pan out. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 9:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/8 "2022-11-09T21:35:40Z")
If they do get a good balance the playerbase complains and complains because they are bored with “the current meta” ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 9:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/9 "2022-11-09T21:46:00Z")
Yennoe this is why we actually said we don’t need new ships. But should 1 cruiser also be able to take out 2 ships, even if smaller? Also, you haven’t factored in pilot skill. Maybe the omen is just bad at the game 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ancantes\_Auge\_Dunier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ancantes_auge_dunier/32/323591_2.png) [@Ancantes\_Auge\_Dunier](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ancantes_Auge_Dunier)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2022, 2:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/10 "2022-11-10T02:12:13Z")
we used 8 arty trashers to delete stuff on gate for a loong time … im dont get what your getting those are simply small tornadoes dont get cauch on close range or they will kill you. If you are stupid enought to get to close range to the destroyer then its a same as burning into 8 catalists what you think is going to happen? Even 8 corms can snipe cruishers preaty quicly … im dont see any game breaking stuff is same as allways was. Dont get close snipe them from range and rewarp if necesary… ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2022, 7:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/11 "2022-11-10T07:12:10Z")
Last night 4 Thrasher Fleets and a Scythe Fleet warped in on us in a Plex, we were 4 Caracal Navy Issues. After reading this thread I thought we were totally done for but was pleasantly surprised to see us successfully blow up all but one Thrasher (successfully ran) and the Scythe. No losses. 🤔 Ok, not that surprised. ---
**Author:** ![Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nujenif_talvanen/32/433113_2.png) [@Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nujenif_Talvanen)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 9:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/12 "2022-11-11T09:19:58Z")
Not really, in my opinion, simply due to cost-damage ratio. ---
**Author:** ![Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nujenif_talvanen/32/433113_2.png) [@Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nujenif_Talvanen)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 9:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/13 "2022-11-11T09:22:19Z")
Thrasher gets a decent damage bonus. Fleet Trash gets a hefty ROF bonus. Look at that saucy damage disparity. ---
**Author:** ![Verlyn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/verlyn/32/435163_2.png) [@Verlyn](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Verlyn)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/14 "2022-11-11T12:53:39Z")
Rate of fire matters in this case, not just dps… If you’re specced in an active rep cruiser, you are simply quite Fckd, even against one Thrasher fleet + 1 frig … And we’re talking fully HG Askelpian spec, with dual active rep cruiser. Still dead, reps and HP do not keep up with current ThrasfherFleet arty ROF. ---
**Author:** ![Oskar\_Milde](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/oskar_milde/32/396309_2.png) [@Oskar\_Milde](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Oskar_Milde)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 4:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/15 "2022-11-11T16:40:34Z")
Sounds like a skill issue to me, tbqh ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/16 "2022-11-11T18:06:45Z")
> [@Verlyn](#): > > If you’re specced in an active rep cruiser, you are simply quite Fckd, even against one Thrasher fleet + 1 frig … Um. You’ll notice you said fleet right? So in other words what you’re fighting like 4v1? Of course you are going to die LOL. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 6:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/17 "2022-11-11T18:23:55Z")
It would be an interesting PvP arena format. You can bring any cruiser and you have to beat 4 destroyers, all teamed up against you. ---
**Author:** ![Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nujenif_talvanen/32/433113_2.png) [@Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nujenif_Talvanen)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 11:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/18 "2022-11-11T23:40:05Z")
not a fleet of thrashers, but a Thrasher Fleet _Issue_. I bet I can kill a Fleet Trash + frigate (non-pirate, hopefully :/) with a dual rep Rupture. If the frigate is a Garmur or Cruor or Succubus or Worm I think I would lose. A slicer or other sitey ship would also be bad for me. That is why I run Stabbers, because they have a smokin’ hot falloff bonus AND dual small neuts. ---
**Author:** ![Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nujenif_talvanen/32/433113_2.png) [@Nujenif\_Talvanen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nujenif_Talvanen)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2022, 11:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/19 "2022-11-11T23:42:18Z")
I would bring a NOsprey, RLMLs with dual prop and an XLASB. If pirate ships are allowed, I choose the Gila. For obvious reasons. If limited to T1 stuff, I would probably pick an Omen. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2022, 12:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673/20 "2022-11-12T00:02:52Z")
> [@Nujenif\_Talvanen](#): > > not a fleet of thrashers, but a Thrasher Fleet _Issue_. > > I bet I can kill a Fleet Trash + frigate (non-pirate, hopefully :/) with a dual rep Rupture. > If the frigate is a Garmur or Cruor or Succubus or Worm I think I would lose. A slicer or other sitey ship would also be bad for me. That is why I run Stabbers, because they have a smokin’ hot falloff bonus AND dual small neuts. Depends, her vernacular was quite unclear. As you say, its a skill issue. She’s mad cause she got blapped. [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/cruisers-now-almost-useless-thanks-to-navy-destroyers/383673.md?page=2)