# CSM 15 - All You Need to Know **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** official, devblog, csm\ **Created:** [April 21, 2020, 7:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548 "2020-04-21T19:36:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 11:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/50 "2020-04-21T23:12:11Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > > The CSM brings focused and structured feedback from the community to CCP and represents their views and interests. > > ‘the community’ is a singular communal noun, not a plural. ‘its’ (as last year’s had) was correct, ‘their’ is incorrect. This is a common error, and often crops up when considering the difference between ‘people’, and ‘a people’. The former references people in general, where the latter references a collective, like a nation. There’s also an unclear antecedent in that sentence - “represents their views and interests” - whose views and interests? The communities or CCPs? Law review PTSD kicking in. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 11:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/51 "2020-04-21T23:24:47Z")
Nerd 😉 tbh, replacing **community** with **Eve communities** would probably be a decent idea. Because there are multiple, with minimal contact points. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2020, 11:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/52 "2020-04-21T23:48:39Z")
This is true. ---
**Author:** ![Rosewalker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rosewalker/32/471476_2.png) [@Rosewalker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rosewalker)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/53 "2020-04-22T00:01:50Z")
Mike, I’ve voted for you every time you’ve run. But with the rules they way they are now, it would take a miracle for you to win. ---
**Author:** ![Xenuria](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xenuria/32/264531_2.png) [@Xenuria](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xenuria)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/54 "2020-04-22T00:06:37Z")
This should be interesting… ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/55 "2020-04-22T00:08:36Z")
But will it make sense? 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/56 "2020-04-22T00:09:00Z")
@CCP_Dopamine You guys have missed the biggest request from last CSM: A minimum of 1 CSM per area of the game: High Sec CSM Low Sec CSM Worm Hole CSM Null Sec CSM Low sec was not represented last time and it became clear why a Low sec representative is needed, this can be seen in the recent low sec changes. Some of the changes where good/healthy (removing null sec alt fw mission runners) but it doesn’t make people excited to move to low and try out FW. It’s like low-sec is the slums of eve atm and no one wants to represent it. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/57 "2020-04-22T00:30:17Z")
> [@Ember\_Fireheart](#): > > Low sec was not represented last time and it became clear why a Low sec representative is needed, this can be seen in the recent low sec changes. > > Some of the changes where good/healthy (removing null sec alt fw mission runners) but it doesn’t make people excited to move to low and try out FW. It’s like low-sec is the slums of eve atm and no one wants to represent it. It’s very hard for high sec and low sec to get somebody elected. In the end, the make up of the CSM is based on two things - who runs and who votes. CCP can’t really mandate one slot for each type if only because everybody’s EVE experience is so varied it’s hard to say “this person is a lowsec guy” or “this person is a highsec guy.” It’s up to the voters to figure this out. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/58 "2020-04-22T00:32:13Z")
But that is just catering to the majority, voting in itself is a flawed system. Having 1 representative from each Sector at least gives every area in eve a fighting chance, otherwise its way to easy for the game to fall out of balance. It’s like if the world decided to make a world council where 1 person from each country would represent the world and then after it was created decided to make all the people in the world vote for each candidate. Which would lead to the highest populations having the most control and eventually we are all speaking Chinese. I understand that some people are varied sure, but everyone has a part of eve they love the most and that love decide’s where their passion lies which leads to bias. From the last CSM its easy to see that 7 of them have a bias for nullsec 1 has a bias for Wormholes the other 2 are bit mixed but none of them have a passion for low and will not fight for it and that in itself is a problem the CSM is meant to to represent the entire community if there is a section missing then there is a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/59 "2020-04-22T00:45:08Z")
And how, pray tell, do you determine what area that CSM candidate is from? And how do you suggest managing the voting for it, so it’s not gamed to hell and back. I’ll wait for your response. Because I’ve yet to see _anyone_ come up with something which will work. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/60 "2020-04-22T00:46:09Z")
You can see from a person’s history, where they spend all their time what they do. If someone makes a post about how they love low and have great ideas for it and will change it but their corp history is all the null sec blocks then that wouldn’t make any sense. I would suggest CCP does the exact same thing except the last few places 8 / 9 / 10 can be used to fill in any missing area’s. ---
**Author:** ![Insidious\_Sainthood](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/insidious_sainthood/32/383447_2.png) [@Insidious\_Sainthood](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Insidious_Sainthood)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/61 "2020-04-22T00:50:10Z")
FWIW I’m going on the record as a low sec guy. KB will confirm this statement. ---
**Author:** ![Australian\_Excellence](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/australian_excellence/32/367782_2.png) [@Australian\_Excellence](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Australian_Excellence)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/62 "2020-04-22T00:51:14Z")
> [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > CCP can’t really mandate one slot for each type if only because everybody’s EVE experience is so varied it’s hard to say “this person is a lowsec guy” or “this person is a highsec guy.” Sure they can. Not everyone is going to stay almost exclusively in one region, but there is lots of players who do, who are easy to look at and say yeah hes a lowsec guy. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/63 "2020-04-22T00:51:17Z")
Congratulations. You just handed Aryth the highsec slot. After all, where do you think the Arch market manipulator spends his time? And you’ve not actually covered the voting. Because the current system wouldn’t handle it. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/64 "2020-04-22T00:51:37Z")
Aryth is a null sec guy everyone knows this, I have never run into him while pvping in FW space have not seen him roaming around ever there and been playing since 2007. And this is me with 0.00001 of eve info CCP has all the info and can pull up all their metrics and can easily tell its not rocket science. And I can confirm that Insidious has a passion for low sec in the exact same way because I have seen him tons of times he has been there forever. ---
**Author:** ![Caskas\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/caskas_amatin/32/413473_2.png) [@Caskas\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Caskas_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/65 "2020-04-22T00:53:30Z")
You get my vote. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/66 "2020-04-22T00:54:58Z")
> [@Ember\_Fireheart](#): > > where they spend all their time what they do. So now you’re throwing in value judgements as well. Not just paying attention to where someone spends their time, and what they do. Of course, Aryth is easy to identify as a Nullsec person. But there are _plenty_ of people who would self identify as nullsec based, when they have a lot of highsec characters. People who don’t have that easy to identify flag. My point is, this is never as simple as people make out. It’s not something which has been ignored. I’ve talked about this at length. But there isn’t a _good_ solutions. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/67 "2020-04-22T00:55:58Z")
> [@Australian\_Excellence](#): > > Sure they can. Not everyone is going to stay almost exclusively in one region, but there is lots of players who do, who are easy to look at and say yeah hes a lowsec guy. Two of the current CSM members, both of whom are senior leadership in Goons, were flagged by CCP as being “high sec predominate players” because their main accounts spent significant amounts of time in highsec, primarily in one system that was used as a jump off point for nullsec roams into Catch. They weren’t really highsec players, by any stretch of the imagination, but that’s what the data showed. It’s not foolproof. Let the players convince the voters what they do and know. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/68 "2020-04-22T00:56:20Z")
You make a fair point but there are some candidates that its just so obvious where their passion belongs because they are well known in that field. But I get that it would be hard for CCP to go and choose between the real guys and the guys that might be pretending. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_Ronuken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/steve_ronuken/32/373894_2.png) [@Steve\_Ronuken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Steve_Ronuken)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 1:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/69 "2020-04-22T01:00:00Z")
Could you imagine the accusations of bias? Don’t get me wrong, I think it’d be a good thing to have some slots. I just don’t see a viable route for it. And the voting, yet to see an option which isn’t incredibly game-able. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548.md?page=4)