# CSM 15 - All You Need to Know **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** official, devblog, csm\ **Created:** [April 21, 2020, 7:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548 "2020-04-21T19:36:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 7:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/155 "2020-04-22T19:49:25Z")
> [@Gowa\_Hyasyoda](#): > > They should be taking feedback from all players The overwhelming majority of players don’t know much about the game. Why should CCP take advice from people who don’t know anything? ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 7:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/157 "2020-04-22T19:56:40Z")
> [@Scoots\_Choco](#): > > The overwhelming majority of players don’t know much about the game. > Why should CCP take advice from people who don’t know anything? This is an extremely good point! This is an 11 yr old toon, yet I hardly know anything outside “my” gameplay. I am not qualified to comment on null, or things I don’t know anything about. I still think toons like this should get to vote though… ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/158 "2020-04-22T20:00:42Z")
> [@Gowa\_Hyasyoda](#): > > Maybe because they are the majority of players actually “playing” the game There is a reason why almost every game out there takes into consideration the “best” players in order to run balance passes. League of Legends, Hearthstone, R6Seige, Apex Legends, even Starcraft. That’s because these are highly skilled and knowledgeable players WHO HAVE FIGURED OUT THE GAME. They are the ones who understand the ramifications of certain balance patches. They are the ones who are making the guides on how to figure out the game. They are the ones teaching other players. I would rather listen to feedback from people who know what they’re talking about, instead of garbage. There’s a lot of garbage, and most of them aren’t even playing the game optimally, OR EVEN KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING. Why would i ask for some highsec scrub who can’t even fit a Battleship correctly about how the resistance and +10% base health would impact them? They don’t even know the game they’re playing themselves. You see all the REEEEE-ing and crying about the Resistance nerf in the last thread? Guess what, all of that crying ended up being wrong and the game is still find. PvE hasn’t been completely destroyed, and the game hasn’t died. That’s why CCP shouldn’t listen to garbage. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/159 "2020-04-22T20:03:18Z")
Yea I will say that the most recent changes to eve are fantastic with the resource scarcity and the push for more bloody battles, so the current CSM must have helped in some way. Stagnation is the only death sentence so I’m all for heavy change in Eve. ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/160 "2020-04-22T20:06:32Z")
Actually, I would think that reading their own forums helped more. From what I’ve read over the yrs, CCP does not listen the the CSM all that much. ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/162 "2020-04-22T20:33:46Z")
> [@Gowa\_Hyasyoda](#): > > Yeah well that garbage majority of players who don’t know everything about the game are the majority of people engaged with the game. I stopped here because you’re missing the point. ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/164 "2020-04-22T20:45:54Z")
> [@Gowa\_Hyasyoda](#): > > It begins to make you wonder in these big alliances how much of their leadership still play for fun and challenge competing with their adversaries and how many of them are secretly doing it simply to line their pockets and everyone else is a mind slave to their own goals. They don’t. They play like they live rl"." Everyone seems to forget CCP is up against a team of players who have more time/talent, etc than their ever going to have against the player base their up against. It’s not their fault. If your the CEO of a rl co and you come to play the game, then just naturally, your going to organize those you come into contact with. There are what, about 120 employees at CCP? Match that against the, I would give Goons double that number of talented people at their disposal to break the game. And that sadly is why we need Goons/Code. To get CCP to do a better job with what they have and not to cave, kneejerk, etc. but balance the game. Good luck… ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/166 "2020-04-22T20:49:40Z")
They only want to stop some bots. i.e. Whales? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 8:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/168 "2020-04-22T20:59:17Z")
Do you and Lucas use the same tin-foil supplier? ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/169 "2020-04-22T21:03:46Z")
Do you mean “tin-foil hat” supplier? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/170 "2020-04-22T21:15:40Z")
Frankly, I think they’re _eating_ it at this point. If someone is cheating, they should be banned. If someone is using exploits, that’s cheating. If someone is playing the game according to the rules CCP has made—rules which have caused us plenty of irritation along the way, and which we have had to put effort into adapting to—then that is neither cheating, nor using exploits. It’s just playing by the rules. If people don’t like that we’ve got 1000+ titans and god knows how many supercarriers? Great! **We’d rather not.** But the rules CCP’s established over the years make having them a strategic necessity. And given the political environment, that necessity is ‘have not just the most, but literally every single one you can get’. Make them not necessary, we’ll be thrilled. **DELETE THEM** , we’ll be freaking _giddy_. It’s not like our CSMs haven’t been telling this to CCP since CSM 6. He wants to see us have less wealth? **So do we.** We’d love to have less wealth because more things are blowing up! That’s the best way you reduce wealth in EVE: make things go boom. But major wars right now _aren’t worth the effort_. They’re just not. We’re not going to tell our enemies ‘you need to make it easier for us to attack you’ any more than we’d expect them to tell that to us. We fully expect our enemies to be making it as hard as they can for us to come and blow them up. That, too, is part of the game, by the rules CCP has made. But until the rules make _actually_ fighting a major war viable… everyone’s just going to keep on stockpiling weapons and stuffing the war chest, in anticipation of the day when they _are_. ---
**Author:** ![Dubowitz\_Syndrome](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dubowitz_syndrome/32/179687_2.png) [@Dubowitz\_Syndrome](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dubowitz_Syndrome)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/171 "2020-04-22T21:28:08Z")
They and the derivatives can be used as a gender neutral pronoun in a singular form. I.e. someone left their book on the table. Since we don’t know the gender of someone we use their. This has been done since the 14th century. It is not wrong. You could have googled this instead of being pretentious. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/172 "2020-04-22T21:30:08Z")
For individual nouns, yes. For collective singular nouns, no. This is because collectives aren’t treated as _beings_, but as _constructs_, ie: inanimate in and of themselves. ‘They’ and the derivatives thereof _as singulars_ denote inherent awareness. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/174 "2020-04-22T21:37:14Z")
No, ‘human beings’ is a plural term. The collectives would be ‘humanity’ or ‘humankind’, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/175 "2020-04-22T21:38:07Z")
Yea not sure why it sounded right in my head for a bit. ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/177 "2020-04-22T21:50:04Z")
Piss off Goons enough and the game might dry up? you never know… 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Ember\_Fireheart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ember_fireheart/32/278556_2.png) [@Ember\_Fireheart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ember_Fireheart)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/178 "2020-04-22T21:51:36Z")
You making it sound like they are providing tons of content… ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 9:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/179 "2020-04-22T21:54:11Z")
No, just tons of revenue! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 10:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/181 "2020-04-22T22:10:01Z")
What did you expect? It’s just human nature… ---
**Author:** ![MB\_ThePhotographer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mb_thephotographer/32/373722_2.png) [@MB\_ThePhotographer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MB_ThePhotographer)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2020, 10:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548/182 "2020-04-22T22:14:30Z")
Which brings up another good point! CCP is outnumbered in a fight against human nature! Good luck to them… [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548.md?page=7) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-15-all-you-need-to-know/234548.md?page=9)