# CSM Vote Result confusion **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [June 14, 2020, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954 "2020-06-14T12:53:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/forum_posting_alt/32/254303_2.png) [@Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Forum_Posting_Alt)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/223 "2020-06-18T17:08:00Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > I’ll bet that if we asked Brisc about this over a beer he would agree with us. He just can’t do so in this venue, for everybody to see and quote. Not very likely, most politicians are similarly deluded and incapable of thinking otherwise… this one is absolutely not an exception ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/224 "2020-06-18T17:08:28Z")
Hmm. I’ve never met a real politician. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/225 "2020-06-18T17:09:16Z")
Its for the best. ---
**Author:** ![Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/forum_posting_alt/32/254303_2.png) [@Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Forum_Posting_Alt)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/226 "2020-06-18T17:09:53Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Hmm. I’ve never met a real politician. I have - lots, far far too many ---
**Author:** ![Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jonah_gravenstein/32/386819_2.png) [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jonah_Gravenstein)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/227 "2020-06-18T17:10:27Z")
If you do and they shake your hand, and then say good morning or good afternoon, check your watch. - to check the time - to check that you still have a watch. :evil: ---
**Author:** ![Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/forum_posting_alt/32/254303_2.png) [@Forum\_Posting\_Alt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Forum_Posting_Alt)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/228 "2020-06-18T17:11:16Z")
> [@Jonah\_Gravenstein](#): > > If you do and they shake your hand and say good morning or good afternoon, check your watch. > > - to check the time > - to check that you still have a watch. Then wash your hands - sound advice even pre-covid ---
**Author:** ![Foggy\_Bernstein](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/foggy_bernstein/32/407887_2.png) [@Foggy\_Bernstein](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Foggy_Bernstein)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/229 "2020-06-18T17:11:31Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > Hmm. I’ve never met a real politician. They’re like flat earthers, They only talk to the unbelievers at conventions and the like. The rest of the time they huddle together basking in the warm glow of their own corruption. ---
**Author:** ![Rekindle](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rekindle/32/382332_2.png) [@Rekindle](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rekindle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/230 "2020-06-18T17:52:32Z")
> [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > There’s almost nobody here, and certainly nobody in this thread, who has the education, training, and real world experience that I do on this topic. Dude you are so fcking full of yourself its amazing. Why bother coming to a forum to have discourse ? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/231 "2020-06-18T18:03:56Z")
Like any politician, he cant take either criticsim, or the fear that we may realise their profession is as useless as a hairdresser. ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/232 "2020-06-18T18:13:31Z")
What did hairdressers ever do to you? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/233 "2020-06-18T18:13:48Z")
Cut my hair? Ok, hairdressers might be slightly more useful than politicians. It was a kind of a Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy reference, but I figured no one would know what a Telephone Sanatiser was ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/234 "2020-06-18T18:14:07Z")
Not useless then. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/235 "2020-06-18T18:16:46Z")
Society wont exactly grind to a halt if my hair gets longer though. I should have said Chefs ---
**Author:** ![Xeux](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xeux/32/428022_2.png) [@Xeux](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xeux)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/236 "2020-06-18T18:17:20Z")
Politicians, by the very act of showing up to work, make the world a worse place. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/237 "2020-06-18T18:40:46Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Of course. Its the context where laws are changed to suit yourselves and every day is you get paid even though most of the year you arent in session. I think the proles know exactly the difference between political context and reality. This doesn’t happen often, at least not in the United States. Whether you’re in session or not, you’re still representing the people who elected you and it’s a 24/7 job. You never get a break or a vacation from it. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > I can see why you think that is how it should work, but given what you have said, Im suprised the concept of Party Whips has totally escaped you. Party whips almost always provide those who have legitimate issues with specific legislation with a pass on voting against the party if they have to in order to get reelected. Unless it comes down to a squeaker vote on a key priority. In those situations there are other ways that folks can use, including matched pairs, to make sure they aren’t screwing their team and their constituents if there’s no way to reconcile the two. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Because the system isnt designed to actual solve problems. Or is it? It’s very hard to solve a “problem” with a single law. Most of the biggest problems that get people angry enough to run can’t be solved easily. And even if someone runs on a specific issue and that’s their biggest problem, they now have adopted a whole host of other stuff that has to get done that they have to be aware of. Single issue candidates make, in my opinion, bad elected officials. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > You see, if you actually were right, and politics existed for the population’s or society’s benefit, even though we are apparently according to you too uneducated to understand it, then people who were qualified in actual subjects that are objectibly quantifiable would be in charge of those things. > > Health Ministers are almost always not Doctors or Nurses. > > I mean, you went to law school, right? I can see how in Subjective Land that qualifies you to decide whether a needed aqueduct should go through a site of scientific or historic interest, the rights and wrongs of that. > > Not really the case in reality though. > > Yet it happens every day. Yes, because the decisions are political ones - what gets the resources, how the resources are obtained, etc. It’s different in the UK where every cabinet minister is a member of Parliament - that’s not the case here, and typically you have a hard time getting a political appointee confirmed if they don’t have some kind of practical experience in the area they’re supposed to be in charge of. > [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Oh yeah and this. Yeah thats a super mechanism. Remove the actual choice from the majority forthwith. Cant have indecision slowing down the coronation. It’s typically the other way around - a small handful of people hold the keys to the job, and you need to kiss those folks asses or they’ll take the job away from you. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/238 "2020-06-18T18:42:06Z")
> [@Foggy\_Bernstein](#): > > As your very livelihood depends on you believing that, I’ll accept that you actually think you are being sincere in that belief. It’s pretty easy to be willfully blind to the big picture when you live in such a small bubble. My livelihood doesn’t depend on me believing that - I could agree with you and I’d still get paid. I just think that it’s amusing that, in politics, experience is a bad thing, and the people who actually do the work daily apparently know less about it than folks who don’t. In no other profession does that happen. It’s amusing. ---
**Author:** ![Magnus\_Carta](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/magnus_carta/32/210653_2.png) [@Magnus\_Carta](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Magnus_Carta)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/239 "2020-06-18T18:42:43Z")
You realize that there’s very little point in a discussion with a career politician? Normal people communicate and discuss to exchange ideas and perhaps convince the other of your ideas. It’s not that a career politician doesn’t understand your pov, perhaps he even agrees with you on that point but he’s never going to admit it. Partly because it doesn’t benefit him and partly because he enjoys the talking, scheming and deflecting. The only way you’re ever going to convince one if it’s a direct and obvious advantage to him personally while he’s able to get away with it. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/240 "2020-06-18T18:44:05Z")
> [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](#): > > The majority of people must be wrong about politics I guess. You and your ilk should perhaps try to figure out why almost nobody trusts their representatives in politics. The funny part of all of those surveys is if you ask “do you trust your political party” the numbers are always high. And if they ask “do you trust your member of Congress/Senator” the numbers are typically higher than the whole, and they’re even higher if it’s a person of the same party as you. The moral of the story is that nobody trusts the institution, and they all want to throw somebody else’s bums out. They like their bums, and their party. Which is why it’s possible for incumbents to keep getting reelected, even if 17% of people trust government. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/241 "2020-06-18T18:45:17Z")
> [@Xeux](#): > > I’ll bet that if we asked Brisc about this over a beer he would agree with us. He just can’t do so in this venue, for everybody to see and quote. Politician answer: “If you’re buying, I’ll agree with anything you say.” Real answer: “Hopefully you’ll learn something over the beer and both of us come away with a new perspective.” > [@Magnus\_Carta](#): > > You realize that there’s very little point in a discussion with a career politician? Normal people communicate and discuss to exchange ideas and perhaps convince the other of your ideas. > > It’s not that a career politician doesn’t understand your pov, perhaps he even agrees with you on that point but he’s never going to admit it. Partly because it doesn’t benefit him and partly because he enjoys the talking, scheming and deflecting. > > The only way you’re ever going to convince one if it’s a direct and obvious advantage to him personally while he’s able to get away with it. Hi, I’m an actual person with an actual name, and I’m more than willing to change my mind if somebody presents a well thought out argument. ---
**Author:** ![Brisc\_Rubal](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/brisc_rubal/32/374307_2.png) [@Brisc\_Rubal](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Brisc_Rubal)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954/242 "2020-06-18T18:46:25Z")
> [@Rekindle](#): > > Dude you are so fcking full of yourself its amazing. Why bother coming to a forum to have discourse ? This isn’t me being full of myself. This is me being honest. I’m sorry if that offends you, but it doesn’t make it less true. I came here to respond to the original question as to why Innominate got elected, and I’ve been here ever since. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/csm-vote-result-confusion/248954.md?page=12)