# \[December\] UPDATED: Jump Fuel and Jump Fatigue Cap changes **URL:** \ **Category:** Upcoming Features & Changes\ **Created:** [November 16, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710 "2017-11-16T14:33:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Sakido\_Cain](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sakido_cain/32/38139_2.png) [@Sakido\_Cain](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sakido_Cain)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/269 "2017-11-16T18:20:30Z")
> [@Alex\_Eltax](#): > > I understand what your saying, but your missing the point, Goons (and fair play to them) have scaled up Rorqual use and defence to a fine art form. Yes other groups can defend them but not on the huge scale the Imperium can do (eg Titans and Supers). Looking at the MER backs this up, everyone else is being left behind. Now yes you can argue that thats their own fault, but if CCP had balanced the Rorqual properly in the first place, say for example using the fighter mechanics of carriers instead of the drone ui or made the drones not as expensive perhaps smaller, less organised groups may have a chance of competing. Sarcasm aside for a sec. You are 100% wrong. There is nothing we do in Delve that _ANY_ other group can’t do, just as well, or even better. It is shocking to me that everyone in Eve thinks there is something special we are doing in Delve, but the simple secret is… here it comes… We work together as a team. I know this is an amazing idea, but that’s it, that’s the big secret. ---
**Author:** ![Pittsburgh2989](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/pittsburgh2989/32/246746_2.png) [@Pittsburgh2989](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Pittsburgh2989)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/270 "2017-11-16T18:21:10Z")
Honestly whoever at CCP is coming up with this crap should have been fired instead of the countless other people. Just leave it at half fuel size and reduce aids. This actually was a good change at lifeblood don’t screw it up a month later Fozzie… You fail to realize that you will not stop power projection in any way. The rich get richer and the poor can’t afford to fly them. Just fix citadels and make them consume more not penalize capitals. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/271 "2017-11-16T18:22:15Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > The implication being that no matter how much I login I can’t just go start a supercap brawl. Then you need to get better at starting trouble. Escalation from subcapitals is a thing. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/272 "2017-11-16T18:22:59Z")
Lol using image macros like a redditor. > [@Querns](#): > > The term you’re looking for is “bluetral.” No it isn’t. Most of the MBC was straight blue. IIRC for most of the war it was only Horde that maintained “bluetral” standings. The only ex-MBC member Horde is bluetral with now is GotG. > [@Querns](#): > > The term you’re looking for is “bluetral.” I understand that half a decade of narrative naming blues as the devil of Eve has left y’all fundamentally unable to engage in setting of standings without engaging in grand theater to maintain a thin veneer of independence, but let’s not kid ourselves. Ah damn Querns almost had an honest conversation before hopping back on script and railing against the PL boogeyman while talking to someone in a newbie alliance. ---
**Author:** ![Betrayer\_of\_Hope](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/betrayer_of_hope/32/145972_2.png) [@Betrayer\_of\_Hope](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Betrayer_of_Hope)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/273 "2017-11-16T18:25:16Z")
I believe the concern here is economics. CCP is concerned that with the removal of POS mechanics and towers comes a great decrease in demand for fuel blocks, a primary source of ice product consumption. They are not wrong to worry about the situation, but this solution to increase demand is absurd. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/274 "2017-11-16T18:25:31Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Then you need to get better at starting trouble. Escalation from subcapitals is a thing. Not when the major blocs are more than a full days jump range of each others supercaps. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/275 "2017-11-16T18:25:48Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Uh apart from the fact that the average 4-man corp would not have enough alts to gather all the resources and produce all the items needed for “local production” so now get to eat increased JF fuel costs. Nonsense. My 4-player altcorp can produce more than enough isotopes in highsec to fuel our flotilla of JFs if need be. After all, ‘all the resources and items needed’ for fueling your JFs is… using the freighters that correspond to the ice you have locally. Live in Deklein? Use rheas and go melt some ice. Part of a small group in GW or Curse? Get a Nomad. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/276 "2017-11-16T18:27:12Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Ah damn Querns almost had an honest conversation before hopping back on script and railing against the PL boogeyman while talking to someone in a newbie alliance. You think the “blues = bad” thing is limited to PL? It’s endemic to nearly every group in this game outside the Imperium. ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Eltax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alex_eltax/32/18530_2.png) [@Alex\_Eltax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alex_Eltax)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/277 "2017-11-16T18:28:12Z")
No offence here, but I been on roams to your space and had supers and titans dropped on subcaps. Outside of PL, NC or the drone Russians, who else can escalate like that? ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/278 "2017-11-16T18:28:59Z")
> [@Alex\_Eltax](#): > > No offence here, but I been on roams to your space and had supers and titans dropped on subcaps. Outside of PL, NC or the drone Russians, who else can escalate like that? Anyone with supers and titans can do that. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/279 "2017-11-16T18:29:23Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > “Auxiliaries” is the proper word, here. “Engineering” might work, but a “tender” is specifically a refueling vessel. ‘Tenders’ actually carry more than fuel, including spare parts and mechanical supplies for enacting emergency repairs and patches. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Eltax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alex_eltax/32/18530_2.png) [@Alex\_Eltax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alex_Eltax)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/280 "2017-11-16T18:29:39Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > Anyone with supers and titans can do that. On the scale you guys can? ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/281 "2017-11-16T18:30:16Z")
> [@Alex\_Eltax](#): > > On the scale you guys can? Considering the scale of the average supercap response is only a handful of guys who are hanging out and bored, yes, nearly anyone. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/282 "2017-11-16T18:31:24Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Nonsense. My 4-player altcorp can produce more than enough isotopes in highsec to fuel our flotilla of JFs if need be. After all, ‘all the resources and items needed’ for fueling your JFs is… using the freighters that correspond to the ice you have locally. Live in Deklein? Use rheas and go melt some ice. Part of a small group in GW or Curse? Get a Nomad. My comment wasn’t about “local production”, not fueling JFs. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/283 "2017-11-16T18:34:51Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > For how much you goons pretend to hate reddit you sure do post there a lot. Yeah, I sure do. 5 times in the last 2 months, wow. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/284 "2017-11-16T18:35:42Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > You think the “blues = bad” thing is limited to PL? It’s endemic to nearly every group in this game outside the Imperium. No it isn’t, alliances are nothing more than a way to simplify corp standings. And even the Imperium has bluetrals (Legacy) for content so you can’t even rail about that being bad. Everybody wants enough blues/bluetrals so their space isn’t at risk while still having enough content to keep their members entertained. ---
**Author:** ![Praxis\_Wen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/praxis_wen/32/25193_2.png) [@Praxis\_Wen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Praxis_Wen)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/285 "2017-11-16T18:36:22Z")
i almost never comment but this by far has to be weirdest move from ccp. why would you change something that all content providers are happy with to “stimulate the ice market” this wont lead to a overall healthier game it will lead to people sitting in their cap umbrella and never moving at least now people move their caps a few jumps for content now its just gonna be people holding their moon goo empires. good job ccp your screwing up all the good you have done over the past year 10/10 ---
**Author:** ![Rankor\_Sarn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rankor_sarn/32/395123_2.png) [@Rankor\_Sarn](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rankor_Sarn)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/286 "2017-11-16T18:37:19Z")
lets be honest a new bro dose it once then never again ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/287 "2017-11-16T18:37:41Z")
> [@Orontes\_Ovasi](#): > > Aren’t you the guy that hates pvping No, he’s a guy who hates showing up on killboards. I generally hate showing up on killboards, too—I fly Logistics. If I’m on a killboard, that means I died or I was carrying the wrong drone for my job. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 6:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/288 "2017-11-16T18:38:38Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Everybody wants enough blues/bluetrals so their space isn’t at risk while still having enough content to keep their members entertained. So, nerf diplomacy? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710.md?page=13) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710.md?page=15)