# \[December\] UPDATED: Jump Fuel and Jump Fatigue Cap changes **URL:** \ **Category:** Upcoming Features & Changes\ **Created:** [November 16, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710 "2017-11-16T14:33:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ll_kuray_ll/32/22667_2.png) [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ll_Kuray_ll)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/390 "2017-11-16T20:33:18Z")
You’re such an arsehole Fozzie. > Increase the economic friction associated with capital ship deployments and jump freighter hauling How? You’ve ripped the arse out of capital ship deployment by introducing jump fatigue followed the recent cap changes. > Stimulate the ice product markets which would otherwise suffer from lower starbase usage Fozzie, you could earn yourself a few points here and stimulate the ice product market by consuming ice to reduce jump fatigued. > Improve the balance of ice product consumption (increased isotope and liquid ozone consumption relative to heavy water consumption) Look to the point above. > Easier trade of high value reacted intermediate materials for T2 production (with the goal of nullsec regions being largely self-sufficient by volume but encouraging trade of lower-volume goods) Wake the F-up, everything gets transported to JITA. > Somewhat reducing the pain that can be caused by heavy jump drive usage and high stacked jump fatigue values Read point above about consuming ice products to reduce jump fatigue. Seriously how are you still a designer at CCP, all you’ve done is piss off large amounts of people and this is another one, half-arsed change because of changes to moon goo that a large portion of gamers didn’t want but you still thrust it upon us. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/391 "2017-11-16T20:34:58Z")
> [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](#): > > Wake the F-up, everything gets transported to JITA. 1DQ1-A being the third largest market in Eve says otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/392 "2017-11-16T20:35:09Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Uh huh, and Goons have some brilliant minds and very obviously have the best industrial system of that size in the game. To be fair, the statements ‘we suck at this’ and ‘Goons [. . .] have the best industrial system of that size in the game’ aren’t actually mutually exclusive. It just indicates that even if we’re the best in the game at this, we still feel like we suck and could be doing it much, much better. It also says something about what we think of everyone _else’s_ industrial operations… > [@theRaptor](#): > > Arrendis backed it up and he seems like a cool dude. What am I being accused of backing up here? Don’t drag me into ‘who mentioned/referred to/hinted at PL’ first, the answer’s pretty obviously you by mentioning you’re in Horde. I mean, that’s just a no-brainer. Which is a good way of describing the two of you arguing over who brought PL into this, too. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/393 "2017-11-16T20:36:12Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > How could this possibly be? We were effortlessly destroyed in 2016 'cause your leadership actually tried to out bore the MBC and found it didn’t work that time. > [@Querns](#): > > and the two times we’ve tried to do military things outside of Delve have ended in spectacular failure. How could those groups possibly be afraid of us still? Well I was in every Hakonen fight except one and the sheer weight of goons meant things could have gone very wrong very quickly. And that was with the entire North united to fight you. And you with no supercap fleet. Goons size and organisation with a PL tier FC team is pure nightmare fuel. ---
**Author:** ![Vaporize](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vaporize/32/35642_2.png) [@Vaporize](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vaporize)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/394 "2017-11-16T20:36:47Z")
@CCP_Fozzie You 100% correct the mechanics are terrible for the player base. ---
**Author:** ![ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ll_kuray_ll/32/22667_2.png) [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ll_Kuray_ll)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/395 "2017-11-16T20:37:10Z")
Dear Goon, the game doesn’t just evolve around you. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/396 "2017-11-16T20:38:11Z")
> [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](#): > > Dear Goon, the game doesn’t just evolve around you. The screeching in this thread says otherwise. Anyway, it’s the only proof for which I’m personally familiar. Needs must, y’know? ---
**Author:** ![Sakido\_Cain](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sakido_cain/32/38139_2.png) [@Sakido\_Cain](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sakido_Cain)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/397 "2017-11-16T20:38:54Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Pffft, I remember when the krabs ran all the null alliances and whined about having to pay tax for people to protect them. Dude, you just said earlier how you have been playing for less than 5 years. Querns comment is about them being treated like crap for over 10 years. So if you can’t comment about one thing from more than 5 years ago, how are you knowledgeable on this? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/398 "2017-11-16T20:39:01Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > If sieging up a rorqual wasn’t hugely dangerous without a massive response fleet on hand then … absolutely everyone would do it even more than we already are, which would cause massive devaluations of basically everything except ice products, and even more complaints from everyone about how much money we’re making. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/399 "2017-11-16T20:39:37Z")
> [@theRaptor](#): > > Well I was in every Hakonen fight except one and the sheer weight of goons meant things could have gone very wrong very quickly. And that was with the entire North united to fight you. And you with no supercap fleet. Are you sure? Every Hakonen fight was a pure rout on our side. We got fu​cking destroyed. Have a little more confidence in yourselves. ---
**Author:** ![Frostys\_Virpio](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/frostys_virpio/32/12703_2.png) [@Frostys\_Virpio](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Frostys_Virpio)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/400 "2017-11-16T20:40:46Z")
That doctrine tho… ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/401 "2017-11-16T20:42:34Z")
> [@Nasar\_Vyron](#): > > This could have been solved by reducing all fuel bays rather than doubling usage which increases constant demand rather than the one-off demand of being able to hold twice as much (current). Fuel bay size does nothing to demand. It only affects how often you have to refuel. So no, reducing fuel bays would not have solved the need to prop up ice mining. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/402 "2017-11-16T20:43:50Z")
> [@Sakido\_Cain](#): > > Dude, you just said earlier how you have been playing for less than 5 years. I played 2004-2006, a month or so in 2009 and 2011, then from early 2016. ---
**Author:** ![Nasar\_Vyron](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nasar_vyron/32/264128_2.png) [@Nasar\_Vyron](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nasar_Vyron)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/403 "2017-11-16T20:44:31Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Fuel bay size does nothing to demand. It only affects how often you have to refuel. So no, reducing fuel bays would not have solved the need to prop up ice mining. It would have solved the halving of the size of isotopes. And I don’t feel, as well as obviously many others here in this very thread, that throwing the need for increased usage onto cap pilots was the correct choice. They should have, and still should, tie that entirely to citadels and reactions - the original large consumers of what is now produced in excess. ---
**Author:** ![ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ll_kuray_ll/32/22667_2.png) [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ll_Kuray_ll)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/404 "2017-11-16T20:44:58Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > Anyway, it’s the only proof for which I’m personally familiar. Exactly,not everyone is a goon and as many concentrated players in one location as your do, I get it, round of applause. Now take a look around. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/405 "2017-11-16T20:45:49Z")
> [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](#): > > Exactly,not everyone is a goon and as many concentrated players in one location as your do, I get it, round of applause. Now take a look around. How can you say everything gets transported to Jita when we’re, on the net level, forcefully doing the opposite? When you say “every,” you have to include people who you think are subhuman (like Goons.) ---
**Author:** ![Frostys\_Virpio](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/frostys_virpio/32/12703_2.png) [@Frostys\_Virpio](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Frostys_Virpio)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/406 "2017-11-16T20:46:37Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > you have to include people who you think are subhuman (like Goons.) We’re in our own league so we don’t count. ---
**Author:** ![theRaptor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theraptor/32/240185_2.png) [@theRaptor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/theRaptor)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/407 "2017-11-16T20:48:01Z")
> [@Querns](#): > > Are you sure? Every Hakonen fight was a pure rout on our side. We got fu​cking destroyed. Have a little more confidence in yourselves. Due to bad doctrine choices and some poor FCing. Those phoons were much more effective in Hakonen 2 then Hakonen 1 for example as your FCs remembered what a “firewall” was. I also fought in the Perimeter battle for our trade Fortizar where we literally couldn’t kill goons faster then you could reship. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/408 "2017-11-16T20:48:32Z")
> [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](#): > > Fozzie, you could earn yourself a few points here and stimulate the ice product market by consuming ice to reduce jump fatigued. Now that’s got some potential. Maybe have an ‘Enriched Isotope’ product that’s bulkier but halves fatigue. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2017, 8:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710/409 "2017-11-16T20:49:25Z")
> [@ll\_Kuray\_ll](#): > > Dear Goon, the game doesn’t just evolve around you. Well if you’re going to say “EVERYTHING” then maybe you should, you know, mean “EVERYTHING” and not “the stuff I buy”. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710.md?page=19) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/december-updated-jump-fuel-and-jump-fatigue-cap-changes/39710.md?page=21)