# Dev Blog: A closer look at the CSM 13 voting numbers **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Created:** [June 15, 2018, 6:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221 "2018-06-15T18:41:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Emmy\_Chelien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emmy_chelien/32/354594_2.png) [@Emmy\_Chelien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emmy_Chelien)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 7:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/61 "2018-06-16T07:20:20Z")
My agenda when running for this CSM was to abolish the NDA to prevent more abuse of insider information. Guess what? They “could not find” my application. Also CCP Guard told me that he would probably have rejected my application based on my pitch. ---
**Author:** ![Caldari\_citizen\_177158](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/caldari_citizen_177158/32/79544_2.png) [@Caldari\_citizen\_177158](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Caldari_citizen_177158)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 7:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/62 "2018-06-16T07:28:36Z")
You allow vote manipulation (buying of votes), block ballots forced on large alliances +1 pilots who dont read/understand anything that practically decides the entire outcome of CSM elections. Yeah CCP have been doing extremely badly development wise, and when they fired their entire community team etc. And to top it off, CSM should be renamed GSM, G as in Goon. CCP had already lost all of my trust, but i was wrong because i just felt even more let down and apparently i lost the last f\*ck i had to give as well. Rip EVE. ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 8:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/63 "2018-06-16T08:50:52Z")
> [@Kachiko\_Sama](#): > > Voters, on initially loading the voting page are presented with the candidates in a random order, as is correct procedure. How many people just voted for people in the order presented to them? It somewhere said that people should make a list of preference, but since there are not many people who have real life experience with Single Transferable Vote election systems, there is room for a lot of misunderstanding. > [@Sylvia\_Kildare](#): > > Dishearten the “enemy” and rake in the votes from your smaller portion of the population that’s more engaged in voting… good thing there’s no gerrymandering in EVE CSM elections, I guess? Well… if there’s a way, they’ll find it. Just like in real life the groups who were elected a number of times start to feel that they are owed the power. Listen to most politicians talk about voters - for politicians (most) it is about convincing them, not helping them express their wishes in the best way to vote for delegates who will execute the will of the people. Such groups hate that democracy means they could be replaced, they hate that in the end the people have the power, that it was the people who enforced a delegate political system, by throwing down tyranny in the past. That’s why they try to exclude people from voting, misinform or dishearten others, try to make the people feel as if it is a nice gesture that they may cast a vote, but nothing more. That being said, I don’t see that Goons generally did something wrong when it came to CSM elections. They just used the opportunity the best they could and that’s not something you should hold against them. The Judge paying for votes should not be allowed however. This clearly constitutes an exchange of in-game money for real-life goods, just like in the more elaborate RMT schemes that people have been banned for in the past. ---
**Author:** ![Celine\_Lafisques](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/celine_lafisques/32/65927_2.png) [@Celine\_Lafisques](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Celine_Lafisques)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 9:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/64 "2018-06-16T09:08:07Z")
It’s really “great” to see all those CSm’s with ties to the “Goones” 😠 ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 9:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/65 "2018-06-16T09:14:28Z")
There should be a few basic rules for CSM elections: 1. A minimum amount of votes for the elections to even count. ~30k is too low 2. Buying votes should be illegal. Ban the sellers of votes, exclude candidates from CSM 3. Voting should be strongly encouraged using the Launcher or in-game means ---
**Author:** ![unimatrix0030](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/unimatrix0030/32/146357_2.png) [@unimatrix0030](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/unimatrix0030)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 9:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/66 "2018-06-16T09:21:19Z")
No significant drop in voters and no wh csm? A clear proof that CCP killed wh’s! ---
**Author:** ![CCP\_Guard](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ccp_guard/32/16499_2.png) [@CCP\_Guard](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/CCP_Guard)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 11:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/67 "2018-06-16T11:02:21Z")
Please share the evidence you base your accusations on. I’d be very interested in seeing it. ---
**Author:** ![Nomy\_Noya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nomy_noya/32/79580_2.png) [@Nomy\_Noya](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nomy_Noya)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 11:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/68 "2018-06-16T11:02:58Z")
Two of the people I voted for made it. Apart from that: the biggest organised group got the most members in, not really a surprise. I’m certainly not a fan but if one doesn’t like it then start doing something about it. Until then, deal with it. ---
**Author:** ![Whitehound](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/whitehound/32/59604_2.png) [@Whitehound](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Whitehound)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 11:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/69 "2018-06-16T11:30:13Z")
> [@Emmy\_Chelien](#): > > Also CCP Guard told me that he would probably have rejected my application based on my pitch. If you go in there as if you’re their new boss … You’re supposed to work with them, not against them, and you’re supposed to represent the players and not a personal self-interest. You then don’t walk into a hair dresser’s shop and apply for a job by saying “Hello, I’m a butcher and I wish to apply for the open position. I want to turn your shop into a bakery!” You’re interpretation of what the role entails needs to meet their criterias, not yours. ---
**Author:** ![Emmy\_Chelien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emmy_chelien/32/354594_2.png) [@Emmy\_Chelien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emmy_Chelien)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 11:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/70 "2018-06-16T11:33:54Z")
> [@Dev Blog: A closer look at the CSM 13 voting numbers](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/61): > > My agenda when running for this CSM was to abolish the NDA to prevent more abuse of insider information. Guess what? They “could not find” my application. Also CCP Guard told me that he would probably have rejected my application based on my pitch. ---
**Author:** ![Korsura\_Muziba](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/korsura_muziba/32/79586_2.png) [@Korsura\_Muziba](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Korsura_Muziba)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 11:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/71 "2018-06-16T11:39:23Z")
The GSM is No Surprise this is something that happens GSM after GSM, or hasn’t anyone noticed that there’s always atleast 3 goons or there pets from Bastion on CSM This is something that hasn’t changed in atleast the last like 8 years. I think the only year a CSM hasn’t Been a GSM was the year After Mittani Was drunk as a skunk and did his nasty business in front of a live stream, Then cried about being thrown under a bus. Shame CCP didn’t leave him under that ban bus he never should have been allowed back but Its goons when they want something they get it cause if not they cry Unsub till they do get it. ---
**Author:** ![Alana\_Packham](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/alana_packham/32/68845_2.png) [@Alana\_Packham](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Alana_Packham)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 12:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/72 "2018-06-16T12:28:32Z")
For 99% of the people in the game the CSM’s are pointless and worthless. and that is the only thing I can say without swearing ---
**Author:** ![Emmy\_Chelien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/emmy_chelien/32/354594_2.png) [@Emmy\_Chelien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Emmy_Chelien)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 12:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/73 "2018-06-16T12:42:00Z")
I’m not complaining - it’s their game and they make the rules. I just want to make sure nobody is under the impression that it is otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Tan\_ul\_Renek](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tan_ul_renek/32/79600_2.png) [@Tan\_ul\_Renek](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tan_ul_Renek)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 1:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/74 "2018-06-16T13:05:01Z")
Its nice to know that everyone elected didn’t have anything to stand on other than “vote for me” ---
**Author:** ![Meerclaw](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/meerclaw/32/249402_2.png) [@Meerclaw](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Meerclaw)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 1:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/75 "2018-06-16T13:21:56Z")
lol @ the Goonocracy this election is a farce ---
**Author:** ![Lorelei\_Ierendi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lorelei_ierendi/32/190833_2.png) [@Lorelei\_Ierendi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lorelei_Ierendi)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 1:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/76 "2018-06-16T13:49:02Z")
> [@Meerclaw](#): > > lol @ the Goonocracy > > this election is a farce This is election is the state of the game. The election is only a “farce” because not enough people vote to make it significant. Of course the big blocks that get all their members voting have an advantage. I guess it is down to a question of what CCP @CCP_Guard want the CSM to be. With \<30k votes and only really the bigger blocks determining things… what is their plan? Noone knows. Like I have said before… I got an EMAIL on all my accounts reminding me that the sale of Multiple Training Certificates was ending… but there was no information / EMAIL about the CSM… not even one. I guess there you can see the priorities! 😕 Gone are the days when CCP fly the chief goon to iceland for an emergency meeting about monocles. One of the problems is that the player base does not understand the CSM and what it is or what it can do. at least 95% of the people I talked to whilst running were expecting me to promise to be able to get CCP to do or change something. And that is not what it is. I would love for “none of the above” to be an option in the elections. As long as people are encouraged to actually vote… and be active. ---
**Author:** ![Propaghandii](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/propaghandii/32/79529_2.png) [@Propaghandii](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Propaghandii)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 2:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/77 "2018-06-16T14:04:21Z")
[https://forums-archive.eveonline.com/topic/124145/](https://forums-archive.eveonline.com/topic/124145/) This has you actively censoring Aryth for “ethnic stereotype slurs”. Further in the thread he defends his use of it. ---
**Author:** ![Binary\_Sunset](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/binary_sunset/32/317650_2.png) [@Binary\_Sunset](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Binary_Sunset)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 2:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/78 "2018-06-16T14:04:23Z")
Congratulations to the CSM representatives. I myself was going to vote this year, but EVE mail with buying votes quickly changed my mind yet again. Golf clap at this farce of a management. ---
**Author:** ![Yiole\_Gionglao](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yiole_gionglao/32/374866_2.png) [@Yiole\_Gionglao](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Yiole_Gionglao)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 2:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/79 "2018-06-16T14:05:33Z")
Well to be honest, adding a “none of the above” candidate would not make much sense since its votes would be transferred to other candidates. CCP’s chosen STV algorythm doesn’t allows to vote against candidates. They would need to add a separate, non-electable option to vote blank as long as no candidate was voted. But even then it would be a weak option, as, what does mean if a player votes to say he didn’t vote any of 47 candidates? What’s the message? It would be more effective a survey about shutting down the CSM. CCP could step forward and say what do they expect from the CSM, and then players would be allowed to vote in favor or against. Then maybe we could put an end to this charade that only interests 1 in 10 players… and maybe with the savings hire a few full time community relations developers to bridge the gaps between customers and CCP employees and CCP direction. ---
**Author:** ![Lorelei\_Ierendi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lorelei_ierendi/32/190833_2.png) [@Lorelei\_Ierendi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lorelei_Ierendi)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2018, 2:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221/80 "2018-06-16T14:12:44Z")
> [@Yiole\_Gionglao](#): > > Well to be honest, adding a “none of the above” candidate would not make much sense since its votes would be transferred to other candidates. First let me be clear. I am not advocating voting for nothing and noone. It would however be interesting, and an interesting statistic metric, if eve players had a chance to register their active “not voting” rather than just coming to the forums. Statistical proof as it were. But you are wrong. Noone is forced to vote for more than one candidate. If that one candidate were “none of the above” then there would later be no votes to be passed on. And even if there were votes passing on, @CCP_Guard would still have the numbers to show them what the players think… if the CSM has anything to do with what players think. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/dev-blog-a-closer-look-at-the-csm-13-voting-numbers/83221.md?page=5)