# Devblog: Updates to Sales Taxes & Brokers Fees **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** feedback, official, devblog\ **Created:** [July 29, 2019, 4:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876 "2019-07-29T16:28:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/451 "2019-07-30T05:37:04Z")
> [@Ahuraa](#): > > Could someone plz explain to me how this will effect the hub markets and station traders. The immediate intention to this appears to be: there is too much ISK flowing into the game, and not enough flowing out of it. This means that the value of ISK itself is reduced, when compared to the value of things that get bought with ISK, specifically PLEX, and things that can only originate with PLEX, like SKINs and Injectors. If there is less ISK, people will have less ISK to spend, which places a downward pressure on prices, curbing inflation. Combined with the Blackout’s hit on ratting bounties through suspected (because unlike CCP, I don’t have the data to make credible accusations) botters, the overall _intention_ here appears to be reducing prices, making the speed at which newly-created ISK cycles through and gets removed from the economy get _faster_, and giving players a healthier economic environment to interact in. CCP’s clearly _hoping_ the majority of the burden here will be felt by the big volume traders, but that ignores the way flat taxes work wrt economic strata. And no, this is not CCP attempting to get rid of the TTT keepstar in Perimeter. If they wanted to, there’s a number of things they could very easily. In fact, this seems to be intended to move _more_ economic activity out of the indestructible stations. Hilmar’s once more been on his decades-old ‘everything in space should be destructible’ train… so those NPC stations might not necessarily last _too_ much longer. Who knows? Era of Chaos, and all, right? > [@Alex\_Coutant](#): > > This unpredictability is bad for business planning. Do I have a representative who votes on taxes? Aryth is a finance guy, and he generally tends to try to steer CCP toward sustainable market models. But that doesn’t mean they asked the CSM about this. ---
**Author:** ![Luscius\_Uta](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/luscius_uta/32/385796_2.png) [@Luscius\_Uta](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Luscius_Uta)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/452 "2019-07-30T05:39:11Z")
This is great change. EVE has player driver economy, so it’s only logical that they trade in player-build stations. Now if CCP could do something to make NPC corp tax end up in player hands as well. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/453 "2019-07-30T05:39:29Z")
> [@Makshima\_Shogo](#): > > I’m glad people like you will be brave in enough to stick in null even after all asset safety is gone from the game o7. > [@](#): > > “A thousand titans are our asset safety.” > -The Mittani Cuz he’s right. Before asset safety becomes a thing we’re worried about, someone’s gotta be able to come into our primary staging system and credibly threaten the structures there. ---
**Author:** ![Makshima\_Shogo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/makshima_shogo/32/247769_2.png) [@Makshima\_Shogo](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Makshima_Shogo)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/454 "2019-07-30T05:47:03Z")
I think its an attempt to try curve isk devaluation, if there are more facets then it will counter act a lot of the isk coming into the game from null sec bounties. The stronger isk is, the less plex will cost and the easier it’ll be for players to farm for plex. Not everyone will use citadels because when asset safety disappears then there is a possibility that the owner of the citadel can remove docking access and everything inside then becomes the property of the null group that owns it, especially if they un-anchor it and all the loot gets dropped in can’s, imagine all Jita stuff went to perimeter and test anchored lol, they would completely decimate high sec and then they would own everything. So yea some people will still station trade and that isk will then get removed from the game making the isk currency stronger. ---
**Author:** ![Rammel\_Kas](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rammel_kas/32/511912_2.png) [@Rammel\_Kas](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rammel_Kas)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/455 "2019-07-30T06:18:46Z")
For motivation please read transcriptions of the recent Talking in Stations podcast with CCP Hilmar, Falcon and others. I hear Suitonia put a TLDR version up on /r/eve recently that unlike the rest of that place was not an intentional bad or troll post. CCP Hilmar also gave similar responses to a question at the EVE Down Under developer AMA panel. ---
**Author:** ![Jeffalk\_Senta](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeffalk_senta/32/146128_2.png) [@Jeffalk\_Senta](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeffalk_Senta)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/456 "2019-07-30T06:32:23Z")
I have to admit I’m impressed. You honestly think you can keep this level of stupid up every week? Aliens will be visiting our solar system just to stare at the universal centre of stupid soon. Nobody can doubt the removal of asset safety is coming soon but be interesting to see how much stupid you have in you. ---
**Author:** ![Planet\_Keeper](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/planet_keeper/32/151634_2.png) [@Planet\_Keeper](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Planet_Keeper)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/457 "2019-07-30T07:00:06Z")
If this the first step of Master plan to destroy the market and force everyone to use contracts instead - fix the Contract UI first. Currently the contract UI is so pathetic! Iin order to find something usefull - you have to traverse through every single contract. Here is a tip: Make Contract UI simillar to market - will definately have more impact on all players. i.e. Fitted ships will have demand over nonfitted and being less in price will lower the amount of isk on the market Another question that bothers me mostly - the “double” taxation bug in planetary for both import and export. Made dozen of bug reports that were closed without reply! Are there any plans to fix it? ---
**Author:** ![Nelye](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nelye/32/151635_2.png) [@Nelye](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nelye)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/458 "2019-07-30T07:13:08Z")
Yeah, isk-sinks are one thing, but more or less doubling the margin on the marked will really disrupt a lot fo trades and people into industry (once again). It seems CCP it forces traders to move to player-made stations to retain their profits, and that means less security. The big traders will not care since they’ve been sat up in their own station for some time, medium traders will be forced to take drastic actions or stop all together, small/new traders will be discouraged from trading, so it is just like making taxes higher in real life, not hitting the ones that profit most (IRL people with money in a tax haven) but hitting everyone else. This does not seem like a good solution ---
**Author:** ![Nelye](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nelye/32/151635_2.png) [@Nelye](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nelye)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/459 "2019-07-30T07:17:54Z")
You still pay % of what you sell, so 10% of 1.000.000 10 times, is the same as 10% of 10.000.000 once… They keep wanting us to buy more PLEX, and then wonder how so many players all of a sudden has a surplus of ISK… the game should not REQUIRE you to buy extra isk to make it worth your while, that is what EA is doing with micro-transactions, and it is a cancer in games ---
**Author:** ![Senior\_Beavis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/senior_beavis/32/169662_2.png) [@Senior\_Beavis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Senior_Beavis)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:27am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/460 "2019-07-30T07:27:57Z")
Looks like the next phase of CCP transitioning from AGILE to TCAW (throw crap at wall) development. Lookin good guysy!! ---
**Author:** ![Zummel\_Utama](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zummel_utama/32/151640_2.png) [@Zummel\_Utama](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zummel_Utama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/461 "2019-07-30T07:40:10Z")
Ok, more taxes. But as CCP want to take it to the lore stuff with that of “your taxes help protect bla, bla bla”. OK. Lets talk about taxes and null. Does does taxes allow concord to defend poeple there? NOPE. Can’t place weapons on gates like in low, WTF we don’t even have local beacuse “they routers were overheating” So, what are does taxes for then? You want to place isk sinks? ok. You want to make harder for many pilots? ok. You think you have too many players and want they go elsewhere? ok. BUT, please, use better excuses ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Steak](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ms_steak/32/168834_2.png) [@Ms\_Steak](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ms_Steak)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/462 "2019-07-30T07:45:39Z")
> [@Luscius\_Uta](#): > > Now if CCP could do something to make NPC corp tax end up in player hands as well. Create your own corp or join one. Done. You cannot be wardecced until you have a structure anchored. > [@Arrendis](#): > > But that doesn’t mean they asked the CSM about this. The answer that i got in another thread from Steve (although logical and i might just imagining things) hints that they were fully aware of the upcoming change and were just waiting for an announcement. Edit: now that @CCP_Falcon woke up 👋 and merged threads to make it even more confusing (CHAOS!) that Steve’s reply is now just a little bit lower than this one. ---
**Author:** ![Merior](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merior/32/443882_2.png) [@Merior](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merior)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/463 "2019-07-30T07:50:50Z")
Look at your asset value, calculate how much it would depreciate by if CCP grab an extra cut if you sell. Then ask yourself what gain you get. We know, however, that rather than address the issue of Alphas departing as fast as they join CCP prefer to use all measures to force us to get out our credit cards to survive. That’s CCP’s contribution and it’s up to us to find ways of cutting CCP out of trades. Oh and ask yourself what is going to happen to the markets when all these stocks of materials start getting dumped. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/464 "2019-07-30T07:54:08Z")
> [@Merior](#): > > Look at your asset value, calculate how much it would depreciate by if CCP grab an extra cut if you sell … Then add the covercharge to account for the new cost. Oh look Ive already fixed my loss. > [@Merior](#): > > ask yourself what is going to happen to the markets when all these stocks of materials start getting dumped Me and other opportunistas will buy those mats. ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 1:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/465 "2019-07-29T13:40:09Z")
> **[r/Eve - \[Game World News\] BREAKING: CONCORD Assembly Passes Tax and Brokerage...](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/cjanzz/game_world_news_breaking_concord_assembly_passes/)** > > 0 votes and 31 comments so far on Reddit The owners of the trading cartel in highsec will like this change. Looks like CCP again helps the big players to secure their dominance. Hint: the more balanced change would have been to divert a minimum broker fee also in citadel trade. But guess what? This would take development effort instead of changing a number in the database. In general everybody in RL economics knows what a high Tobin tax leads to … dry up markets, black markets, people seeking alternatives … anyone has a good channel for arranging big sales contracts? ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Steak](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ms_steak/32/168834_2.png) [@Ms\_Steak](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ms_Steak)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 1:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/466 "2019-07-29T13:56:18Z")
So, in order to combat lower ISK sink that resulted from emerging market hubs in Upwel Structures CCP decided to roll NPC broker’s fee into sales tax AND increase NPC broker’s fee (to promote more markets in Upwel structures?)… P.S. Why link reddit thread and not the article itself: [https://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/world-news/concord-assembly-passes-tax-and-brokerage-increases-to-bolster-new-eden-defense-fund/](https://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/world-news/concord-assembly-passes-tax-and-brokerage-increases-to-bolster-new-eden-defense-fund/) ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/467 "2019-07-29T14:03:03Z")
Will this wipe a lot of margins out in PLEX trading? ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/468 "2019-07-29T14:11:07Z")
Don’t think so, the spread will increase and TTT will just hike the broker fee and make more money than ever, because people have even more incentive to go there. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Steak](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ms_steak/32/168834_2.png) [@Ms\_Steak](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ms_Steak)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 2:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/469 "2019-07-29T14:14:02Z")
> [@Tax and broker fee increase to 5% (base) incoming](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tax-and-broker-fee-increase-to-5-base-incoming/178852/4): > > because people have even more incentive to go there. or grind standings for NPC corps and factions holding current trade hubs, although the effect is diminished. Whats more puzzling is that information is hidden in lore article and there is no official announcement for it (yet?). @CCP_Falcon If this change goes live as is, what will happen to these skills? - [Accounting](https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Skills:Trade#Accounting) - reduces the transaction tax rate by 10% per level from 2% to 1% at level 5. Accounting is not an Alpha skill, so by increasing the base tax to 5% that means that Alphas (and just new players) wont be able to compete on many market positions that had tight margins as is. - [Broker Relations](https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Skills:Trade#Broker_Relations) – reduces the broker fee collected on market orders in NPC stations by subtracting a flat 0.1% per level from 3% to 2.5% at level 5. This fee can also be affected by standings between the trader and the corporation that owns the station. Broker Relations has a completely different problem - it doesnt scale with increase of base (from 3% to 5%). This is also the problem with NPC corp/faction standings they are not balanced around 5% base broker fee: _BaseFee%-(0.1%\*BrokerRelationsLevel)-(0.03%\*FactionStanding)-(0.02%\*CorpStanding)_ **before** you could get down to 2% (with max everything) - thats a 33% reduction of the fee **after** you will only be able to get to 4% (with max everything) - with ungodly faction standing grind requirement you get only 20% reduction of fee. ---
**Author:** ![Sordina](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sordina/32/148069_2.png) [@Sordina](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sordina)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 2:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/470 "2019-07-29T14:36:01Z")
> [@Tax and broker fee increase to 5% (base) incoming](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/tax-and-broker-fee-increase-to-5-base-incoming/178852/5): > > Whats more puzzling is that information is hidden in lore article and there is no official announcement for it And probable it will never come. Chaos era means, chaos. As low information as possible. https://player.twitch.tv/?video=v459168301&parent=forums.eveonline.com&autoplay=false [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876.md?page=22) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876.md?page=24)