# Devblog: Updates to Sales Taxes & Brokers Fees **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** feedback, official, devblog\ **Created:** [July 29, 2019, 4:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876 "2019-07-29T16:28:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/62 "2019-07-29T17:20:10Z")
> [@AMARR\_KUNNNI](#): > > so if a ship dies it transfer to another player when has that happened? and why am I only finding out about it now? 🙃 When a ship dies, the minerals it’s made of disappears. The ISK it was worth was already transferred to whoever it was purchased from. The isk spent on replacing it also goes to another player, not an NPC. ---
**Author:** ![Once\_Bitten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/once_bitten/32/52691_2.png) [@Once\_Bitten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Once_Bitten)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/63 "2019-07-29T17:20:47Z")
How do taxes defend eve? Last i checked Eve players defend Eve. Making the game more costly to play for smaller groups reduces your subs because not everyone wants to be a pawn in some big meta gaming alliance that is run by a select few who rake in the isk on thier player base. As is you have wars, ganks, market monopolies and bots that have to be competed with . Blackout was a step in the right direction to deter null sec botting but the tax increase is only a deterent to the high sec player base that have to grind 3x and more just to stay afloat. Check Jita undock if you think high sec is safe and groups killstats like Code, Pirat, and others that contribute to high sec tax rates on your new player base and ask yourself why new subs quit after a few months. (hint hint:: those groups are are null sec based greifers that don’t appreciate some competition by others that have to do more grinding.) ---
**Author:** ![ITTigerClawIK](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ittigerclawik/32/369258_2.png) [@ITTigerClawIK](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ITTigerClawIK)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/64 "2019-07-29T17:21:48Z")
But what is the purpose or main goal of these changes. For the most part there is an explanation of the intended goal and purpose of changes being made made but this is just a straight up “we are increasing taxes across the board. That is all” ---
**Author:** ![Kilostream](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kilostream/32/343423_2.png) [@Kilostream](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kilostream)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/65 "2019-07-29T17:23:14Z")
As others have said, I’d be more ready to form an opinion if I knew what these changes were designed to achieve. Any chance of some comment on why you’re making these changes and what you hope we will do as a result? Do you want people to keep trading in Jita? move to Perimeter instead? Strip ourselves naked, paint ourselves purple and jump up and down on a harpy hull singing confusing changes are here again? What, in a nutshell, is the problem this is supposed to fix?! ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Steak](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ms_steak/32/168834_2.png) [@Ms\_Steak](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ms_Steak)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/66 "2019-07-29T17:24:50Z")
> [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](#): > > When a ship dies, the minerals it’s made of disappears. The ISK it was worth was already transferred to whoever it was purchased from. The isk spent on replacing it also goes to another player, not an NPC. You forgot the part where insurance payout adds ISK to the economy. ---
**Author:** ![Ciryc\_Lagrej](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ciryc_lagrej/32/375359_2.png) [@Ciryc\_Lagrej](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ciryc_Lagrej)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/67 "2019-07-29T17:26:23Z")
Depending on insurance, that is actually an isk faucet and is not an isk sink at all. In fact Asset safety itself is an isk sink, it would be better to just increase the cost of asset safety. Also removing asset safety is an awful idea and shouldnt be done as its not an issue. ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/68 "2019-07-29T17:26:30Z")
Very true, my apologies. If anything, fleet fights of any kind would be an isk faucet of sorts. Either way, that guy kind of got his cart before the horse. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Steak](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ms_steak/32/168834_2.png) [@Ms\_Steak](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ms_Steak)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/69 "2019-07-29T17:26:36Z")
> [@Kilostream](#): > > What, in a nutshell, is the problem this is supposed to fix?! Isk inflation. ---
**Author:** ![Wedge\_Yamamoto](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wedge_yamamoto/32/151462_2.png) [@Wedge\_Yamamoto](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wedge_Yamamoto)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/70 "2019-07-29T17:28:01Z")
This is the WORST IDEA EVER. It is just a gift to TEST because it will just force more trade through Perimeter. They already make too much money which they just use to blow up all the competition so they can raise rates to 0.5%. Are they using that money to defend highsec? I don’t see any TEST fleets camping Uedama and Niarja blowing up gankers. TEST could offer convoy service for freighters traveling between TEST-owned trade hubs, including webbers for fast align and lots of destroyers for anti-ganking. TEST could offer player-owned gates for shorter transits bypassing bottlenecks. If TEST wants to take over for CONCORD and make highsec safer, then great, let them charge higher rates. But, they are not doing that, they are just looting highsec to make nullsec a blue doughnut full of nullbears and bots. On the other hand, maybe the big problem is highsec is doesn’t have enough risk for TEST. Maybe CCP should make it easier to blow up keepstars in high sec and get rid of asset safety for player owned structures in highsec. That way, there is a real risk to using a POS to sell your stuff because it might get blown up before your stuff sells and then you lose all your stuff. Also, that will increase the incentive to blow up more POS market hubs. How about having the Triglavs or sleepers try to take out TTT and see if TEST can defend it against thousands of Sleeper BS. Make them earn the right to be the sole Forge market hub. Even better, how about a competition. Let any alliance that wants to participate register in the competition to be the sole market hub in Forge can anchor one hub and it will be invulnerable to any attacks except by NPCs and then the NPCs will show up and start attacking all registered hubs at the start of the competition in slowly escalating attacks until all hubs are destroyed but one and that alliance that can defend their hub the longest earns the right to be the sole trading hub in Forge for one year. I don’t know what CCP’s long range vision is for the future of highsec and I definitely don’t know how this move is supposed to get us there. All I can see is this is just a big giveaway to TEST. If you want to give them money, just put a trillion ISK in their corporate wallet, blow up TTT and leave highsec alone until you come up with a better plan to make life in highsec more interesting for people that actually live and work there (80% capsuleers in New Eden) than just a honeypot for the blue doughnut (which is 15% of New Eden and half of those are bots). ---
**Author:** ![Tipa\_Riot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tipa_riot/32/443513_2.png) [@Tipa\_Riot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tipa_Riot)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/71 "2019-07-29T17:29:09Z")
> [@ITTigerClawIK](#): > > But what is the purpose or main goal of these changes. For the most part there is an explanation of the intended goal and purpose of changes being made made but this is just a straight up “we are increasing taxes **across the board**. That is all” Not across the board. They don’t increase NPC broker fees for citadels and corp contracts. Which is a big advantage for the blue donut and highsec market cartel. So if people want to keep competitive they have to pay or join the cartel. THIS is the purpose, feed the goons. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/72 "2019-07-29T17:29:40Z")
The larger picture is very clear if you look at this change in a positive way for long term omega players. The change will mostly effect new players who are yet to reach level 5 in accounting. If you haven’t and don’t wish to feel this change, it might be time to skill into that. Also Alpha players it sort of takes a slice out of your profits which I can not comment on that pain you might be feeling when reading these tax changes. ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Quaan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lucas_quaan/32/372581_2.png) [@Lucas\_Quaan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lucas_Quaan)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/73 "2019-07-29T17:30:08Z")
Have you considered raising the minimum broker fee from 100 ISK too? ---
**Author:** ![Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mizhara_del_thul/32/486150_2.png) [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mizhara_Del_thul)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/74 "2019-07-29T17:30:15Z")
I don’t know. The sink in taxes might just be countered by further migration to trade citadels. That it also affects the traders who’ve spent time training for trade much less than the newer or more casual folk doesn’t seem like it’s very aimed at isk sinking in the end. Might be a further push towards getting players out of NPC stations/corps and into citadels and corps? I’m genuinely a bit unsure what their game is here. I don’t _mind_ so much as I’m just curious. ---
**Author:** ![Querns](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/querns/32/157529_2.png) [@Querns](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Querns)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/75 "2019-07-29T17:32:15Z")
> [@Mizhara\_Del\_thul](#): > > You’re going to have to qualify and back up such a claim, I’m afraid. I have ran my own little industry empires over the years, I’ve done a bit of carrier/super ratting, and so on and so forth. Most ways to earn isk in Eve, I’ve given a whirl. Hell, for funsies I once made a brand new char with no sp or isk, and turned the initial 5k into a Bill in less than a month, just because a blogpost talked about the “challenge.” Player skill doesn’t really come into play when it comes to earning ISK in Eve. Mostly, it’s just drudgery, chores, luck or already being wealthy enough that you can just manipulate or invest into further wealth. > > Thing is though, some of us value our time. With an hour of overtime at work, I make several hundred percent more, if not thousand+, turning that dosh into plex into isk, than any in-game activity can ever get close to. Basically, the only reason I bother doing industry or trade is because it’s kind of fun sometimes. Doing it for the isk? Meh. > > Nah, you’re just objectively wrong here. PLEXing for ISK is not inherently an impulsive act. It’s simply a shortcut used by those who have disposable income they can use on a hobby, getting to the _fun_ bits rather than mindlessly drudge in the various isk mines of New Eden. Sure. I’ve spent the last nine years teaching our guys precisely how to play the game such that they don’t have to resort to such base actions. There’s no time grind involved, just a little bit of knowledge and some periodic maintenance work. It’s something you absolutely grow out of as you play if you’re playing the game anywhere even moderately adjacent to correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Malcolm\_Arzadar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/malcolm_arzadar/32/139122_2.png) [@Malcolm\_Arzadar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Malcolm_Arzadar)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/77 "2019-07-29T17:36:30Z")
Unlike you plebs I have a degree in Armchair Video Game Economics from DEVRY UNIVERSITY so believe me when I say: taxation is in fact, good. ---
**Author:** ![Joanaas\_KILLforFREE](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/joanaas_killforfree/32/151477_2.png) [@Joanaas\_KILLforFREE](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Joanaas_KILLforFREE)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/78 "2019-07-29T17:37:18Z")
I don’t get it… I won’t be using player owned station for trading, since there are no guarantees they who control the citadels won’t just turn off market modules and leave all my orders and money frozen… the taxes were already high for empire stations as they were… what is this going to accomplish? more money for large corporations who control citadels near the market hubs?! while the small folk that just want to sell their stuff safely are being penalised here? what the hell CCP? i thought you wanted to equalize the playfield not make the rich even richer… 🧐😒 ---
**Author:** ![Jeronica](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeronica/32/383351_2.png) [@Jeronica](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeronica)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/79 "2019-07-29T17:38:03Z")
thats not how it works, they’ll still pay the sales tax ---
**Author:** ![Wedge\_Yamamoto](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wedge_yamamoto/32/151462_2.png) [@Wedge\_Yamamoto](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wedge_Yamamoto)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/80 "2019-07-29T17:38:17Z")
I think you’re missing the point. Most people who live and work in high-sec don’t want to join a big alliance and prefer to work solo or in small groups. By the way that’s 80% of all the characters in New Eden. So why should the 15% that want to be part of a big alliance be allowed to bully all the rest? If this was the real world, the Guristas would not tolerate other gangs moving in on their turf and just blow up TTT and anchor their own keepstar. ---
**Author:** ![Rhivre](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rhivre/32/358488_2.png) [@Rhivre](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rhivre)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/81 "2019-07-29T17:38:30Z")
Its purely to provide a sink. The current sink for Transaction tax was 11.7T in June, this was with (I hope) the majority of people having Accounting V, so at 1%. ---
**Author:** ![Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nicolai_serkanner/32/358049_2.png) [@Nicolai\_Serkanner](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nicolai_Serkanner)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/devblog-updates-to-sales-taxes-brokers-fees/178876/82 "2019-07-29T17:38:53Z")
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