# Discussion about "Into the Abyss" update **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [April 15, 2018, 12:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843 "2018-04-15T12:09:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/301 "2018-05-04T12:01:39Z")
Mutated T2 mods will have two results: - More bricked T2s, thus reducing supply of T2. - Mutated T2 mods, thus reducing demand for DED/LP/Officer mods. Fk that. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/302 "2018-05-04T12:03:25Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Mutated T1 mods will have two results: > > More bricked T1s, thus reducing supply of T1. > Mutated T1 mods, thus reducing demand for T2 mods. Ftfy since you don’t want t2 in the equation 😂😂😂😂😉😉 ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/303 "2018-05-04T12:06:13Z")
I think he understands all of that, he just doesn’t want to adjust. Funny thing is that he doesn’t understand his investment in faction/ded items in hopes for people mass-mutating them was short-sighted. MT2 won’t eat into the faction market, but the faction market won’t profit as much as some people hoped it would. Economically, it would be an extremely stupid idea to mass-roll faction items with the nerfed stats and the effort to get mutaplasmids. These items will cost far more in production than Officer modules. T1 and T2 are the items that might still see some use for mutaplasmids, but even that might be thinking overly optimistically. ---
**Author:** ![Bouh\_Revetoile](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bouh_revetoile/32/68319_2.png) [@Bouh\_Revetoile](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bouh_Revetoile)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/304 "2018-05-04T12:11:47Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Mutated T2 mods, thus reducing demand for DED/LP/Officer mods. **This won’t happen.** It has been demonstrated extensively already. Repeating that it is a menace won’t make it true. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > More bricked T2s, thus reducing supply of T2. T2 will not be the only mutated items. Meta items in particular will be interesting to mutate, and T1 mutated items can counter the effects on T2 market if these become too expensive. ---
**Author:** ![Jeremiah\_Saken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeremiah_saken/32/266740_2.png) [@Jeremiah\_Saken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeremiah_Saken)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/305 "2018-05-04T12:18:38Z")
The abyssal sites are meant to be selfsustained, Rise said that at the interview. So I don,t know where did you ger that pretty low. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/306 "2018-05-04T12:22:15Z")
Go on Singularity Out of the 5 sites I did, I got 1 filament. If it were _sustainable_ there would have been 1 filament per site… lol ---
**Author:** ![Jeremiah\_Saken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jeremiah_saken/32/266740_2.png) [@Jeremiah\_Saken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jeremiah_Saken)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/307 "2018-05-04T12:28:23Z")
🙄 it’s SiSi, it will change 1000 times until it hit TQ. Do you think mutagens will drop with as high rate as on Sisi? Rise said in worst scenario we will get same level of filament, in best level higher. ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/308 "2018-05-04T12:29:14Z")
> [@zluq\_zabaa](#): > > Run the sites on SiSi and revisit your assumption. I did and they were dead easy in a Sacrilege. It took me not more than 10 minutes to run them while I was busy doing other things. A human? We can run dozens and dozens of anomalies in a carrier with tons of more micromanagement and auxiliary activities like intel watching every day. You can run at least the same number of sites depending on how many filaments you have. You do not need the perfect roll. Even mediocre rolls generate extremely powerful modules that make faction or deadspace modules pale in comparison. Your assumptions that you need many rolls or that it would take too long to farm those sites is baseless and naive as virtually every activity in EVE has proven to be susceptible to exploitation through massive numbers of characters. In conclusion: I stand by my statement without any alterations. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/309 "2018-05-04T12:34:41Z")
I know drop rates will change lol They’re pretty hilarious atm I’d only reduce bpc drops for sure The rest will still be pretty rare which is fine ---
**Author:** ![Bouh\_Revetoile](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bouh_revetoile/32/68319_2.png) [@Bouh\_Revetoile](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bouh_Revetoile)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/310 "2018-05-04T12:39:46Z")
> [@Dyver\_Phycad](#): > > You do not need the perfect roll. Even mediocre rolls generate extremely powerful modules that make faction or deadspace modules pale in comparison. Your assumptions that you need many rolls or that it would take too long to farm those sites is baseless and naive as virtually every activity in EVE has proven to be susceptible to exploitation through massive numbers of characters. Please give numbers to show how deadspace or faction modules pale in comparison. Is it the MWD ? Or the neutralizer ? Can you tell us more about what is a mediocre roll please ? > [@Dyver\_Phycad](#): > > I did and they were dead easy in a Sacrilege. It took me not more than 10 minutes to run them while I was busy doing other things. Which level did you try ? ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/311 "2018-05-04T12:43:08Z")
> [@Dyver\_Phycad](#): > > In conclusion: I stand by my statement without any alterations. Without providing any substantiated reason as to why you stand by your statement or let’s call it what it is: mere unfounded speculation that you would find to be wrong, if you took the effort to check the numbers. I provided many examples above in this thread of how low chances on even a slightly good roll are. Counter prove that using mathematics or stfu. ---
**Author:** ![Cypherous](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cypherous/32/499883_2.png) [@Cypherous](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cypherous)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/312 "2018-05-04T12:45:40Z")
> [@Bouh\_Revetoile](#): > > and no one can do more than 4 of these each hour. Citation needed, CCP claimed they would take “no longer” than 15 minutes, but i highly doubt people are actually going to take that long once they figure out which are the best fits with the best types of weather effect ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/313 "2018-05-04T13:02:15Z")
10 Tier 1 and about 8 Tier 2 sites in low sec. I turned 1 50MN MWD into a 510%/140 cap usage/420 sig radius/somewhat less CPU, but a more PG. That was a good roll. Another MWD ended up with 480 sig radius, 510% speed, but more Cap, CPU/PG usage. I’d call that mediocre. > [@zluq\_zabaa](#): > > I provided many examples above in this thread of how low chances on even a slightly good roll are. Counter prove that using mathematics or stfu. Why so angry? You do not include in any way/shape or form the numbers of EVE characters doing these sites. Your math is flawed and incomplete. Considering how they are now, you can probably even parallelize them with a couple of characters as the NPC behavior is not erratic and the confines of the arena give easy to use limits. It’s that easy. Now calm down. ---
**Author:** ![Bouh\_Revetoile](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bouh_revetoile/32/68319_2.png) [@Bouh\_Revetoile](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bouh_Revetoile)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/314 "2018-05-04T13:05:21Z")
> [@Dyver\_Phycad](#): > > 10 Tier 1 and about 8 Tier 2 sites in low sec. And how many _unstable_ mutaplasmid of _one_ praticular type, that you can use for _one_ particular module, did you find ? ---
**Author:** ![Dyver\_Phycad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dyver_phycad/32/358575_2.png) [@Dyver\_Phycad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dyver_Phycad)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/315 "2018-05-04T13:10:35Z")
None in particularly large numbers. The hangar says 2 for x-large shield boosts, 1 for a 500MN MWD, 1 for a large shield extender and 2 for Large armor reps. Gravids are more common and that’s the ones I used for the above modules. ---
**Author:** ![Bouh\_Revetoile](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bouh_revetoile/32/68319_2.png) [@Bouh\_Revetoile](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bouh_Revetoile)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/316 "2018-05-04T13:21:30Z")
Thank you very much for these data that proves exactly what I’m saying ! People who fear a T2 module can be converted into a faction/DED/officer module or better only look at the stats an unstable mutaplasmid can give. And as you just demonstrate, they are not that common. You also showed how difficult it is to farm any _one_ particular mutaplasmid, which mean that industrialising the process of mutation in order to get a specific module to DED/LP/officer grade will not be possible, because you need a reliable source of ONE particular mutaplasmid to do it and they don’t drop all the time. So eventhough I made a small mistake on the number of site you can run in one hour (although no one here tryed the lvl5 pocket that seem very difficult to farm efficiently and fast), you just showed that 4/h/player is actualy far too optimistic. Considering on top that SiSi probably have higher drop rate than Tranquility will have, an estimation of 1 or 2 unstable mutaplasmid per hour per player is still rather optimistic I think. And finaly, out of these 18 sites you did, you found 2 interesting rolls. Are they really on the level of faction/DED/officer modules yet ? That gives you an estimation of the number of mutaplasmids you will need if you hunt a specific module and stat. ---
**Author:** ![zluq\_zabaa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zluq_zabaa/32/19011_2.png) [@zluq\_zabaa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/zluq_zabaa)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/317 "2018-05-04T13:25:04Z")
> [@Dyver\_Phycad](#): > > None in particularly large numbers. The hangar says 2 for x-large shield boosts, 1 for a 500MN MWD, 1 for a large shield extender and 2 for Large armor reps. Gravids are more common and that’s the ones I used for the above modules. So you are claiming you found any “Unstable” Mutaplasmids in Tier 1 and Tier 2 sites? ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/318 "2018-05-04T13:26:07Z")
> [@zluq\_zabaa](#): > > Funny thing is that he doesn’t understand his investment in faction/ded items in hopes for people mass-mutating them was short-sighted. Pfft, I sold my DED stockpiles over a year ago. I dont have a horse in this race. > [@zluq\_zabaa](#): > > I think he understands all of that, he just doesn’t want to adjust. Funny thing is that he doesn’t understand his investment in faction/ded items in hopes for people mass-mutating them was short-sighted. > > MT2 won’t eat into the faction market, but the faction market won’t profit as much as some people hoped it would. > > Economically, it would be an extremely stupid idea to mass-roll faction items with the nerfed stats and the effort to get mutaplasmids. These items will cost far more in production than Officer modules. > > T1 and T2 are the items that might still see some use for mutaplasmids, but even that might be thinking overly optimistically. It WILL happen. Why risk mutating DED/LP/Officer, when can use T2 instead? > [@Bouh\_Revetoile](#): > > T2 will not be the only mutated items. Meta items in particular will be interesting to mutate, and T1 mutated items can counter the effects on T2 market if these become too expensive. Depends on price of mutaplasmids. But would you run them on a meta instead of a T2? * * * Mutated T2 modules WILL eat into the DED/LP/Officer market. ---
**Author:** ![Bouh\_Revetoile](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bouh_revetoile/32/68319_2.png) [@Bouh\_Revetoile](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bouh_Revetoile)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/319 "2018-05-04T13:29:26Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > But would you run them on a meta instead of a T2? Meta modules have interesting stats compared to T2, like a lower cap penalty for MWD for example, and still better stats than T1, so with mutation you can get very interesting stuff. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Mutated T2 modules WILL eat into the DED/LP/Officer market. They won’t because there won’t be enough of them and they will be too expensive. Except of course when an idiot will sell the mutated item regardless of the statistical value, a bit like someone would sell an officer module for a fraction of its price because he doesn’t realize it’s value. ---
**Author:** ![Loreline\_Farcloud](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/loreline_farcloud/32/69487_2.png) [@Loreline\_Farcloud](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Loreline_Farcloud)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2018, 1:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843/321 "2018-05-04T13:32:04Z")
Do you even understand the basis of the eve economy? your fearmongering and whining is why CCP can never get their decent ideas into the game because people like you make too much noise about something you aren’t prepared to fully understand or adapt to. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843.md?page=15) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/discussion-about-into-the-abyss-update/69843.md?page=17)