# Do problem players have any responsibility to change their own behavior? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 6, 2017, 8:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981 "2017-11-06T20:30:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/81 "2017-11-08T17:56:44Z")
> [@Piugattuk](#): > > CCP actually encourage adverse behavior CCP are the OG trolls. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/82 "2017-11-08T17:59:50Z")
I hope you don’t think I have a notion of power as an absolute or constant as that would mean I was really really bad at explaining myself, rather than just long winded and a bit bad ---
**Author:** ![Drago\_Shouna](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/drago_shouna/32/350651_2.png) [@Drago\_Shouna](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Drago_Shouna)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/83 "2017-11-08T18:06:05Z")
It’ll never happen. These players will never ever alter their behaviour. All they’ll ever do is quote the EULA and that it’s “allowed” and anyone disagreeing can go and HTFU. These types of players are the worst kind, as for some unknown reason they enter a game and instantly lose all social conscience and empathy to other players. Then they claim they’re not like that in real life…they may not be, but it’s obviously what they’d like to be if they could. ---
**Author:** ![Major\_Marshmellow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/major_marshmellow/32/35081_2.png) [@Major\_Marshmellow](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Major_Marshmellow)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/84 "2017-11-08T18:06:34Z")
Does the tail wag the dog? Power is so complex we can’t possibly tackle it in this format. Billionaires are being arrested as we speak and their vast wealth confiscated. Nothing lasts… ---
**Author:** ![Major\_Marshmellow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/major_marshmellow/32/35081_2.png) [@Major\_Marshmellow](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Major_Marshmellow)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:09pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/85 "2017-11-08T18:09:11Z")
> [@Drago\_Shouna](#): > > These types of players are the worst kind, as for some unknown reason they enter a game and instantly lose all social conscience and empathy to other players. Then they claim they’re not like that in real life…they may not be, but it’s obviously what they’d like to be if they could. Worth repeating. ⚡ ➕ **1** ⚡ ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/86 "2017-11-08T18:10:21Z")
> [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](#): > > I hope you don’t think I have a notion of power as an absolute or constant No, sorry. I was expanding on your points, as directed to the antagonist you where addressing. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/87 "2017-11-08T18:20:06Z")
what players? Loads of examples in this thread of players self regulating and dealing with problem behaviour themselves. Loads of examples of people being banned for actual harassment and bullying, remember, this thread isn’t about ganking. So who are ‘these players’ who lose ‘all social conscience and empathy to others’? Please provide just one example of behaviour that is bullying or harassment that has not resulted in a player ban, and I will report the perpetrator even if you haven’t (and why not). If you think non-consensual pvp is alone evidence of losing all social conscience and empathy for others, and that it alone constitutes bullying and harassment, well that is what we have been discussing and just repeating OMG they nasty in game so must be nasty irl, and complaining that people point out the rules of the game we are all playing to demonstrate that this behaviour is no different from other competitive games, well what is that contributing to anything? If you have a point to make, please make it. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/88 "2017-11-08T18:24:47Z")
coolio I was worried I rambled too much. My dream is for a white knight to ride into these forums and actually stand up for the weaker players by giving them hints and tips to level the playing field but… actually ‘gankers’ and the like seem to do this all the time (they must have so much power they don’t mind sharing it I guess), you can learn so much from their threads about good op sec and whatnot, but some people do not want help they just want to feel better than others and it is a shame. One person says, I don’t like that activity, its not for me, another says I don’t like that person they are bad and I am not. ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/90 "2017-11-08T18:31:02Z")
this went over my head but I liked it so nvm ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/91 "2017-11-08T18:39:21Z")
> [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](#): > > coolio I was worried I rambled too much. Well, you did a little, but its part and parcel of posting here (and overall online). I used to write essays as well, but learned to ignore irrelevancies and boil ones thoughts down as concisely as possible. This community still supports new players, when they have the “right” attitude. I hope that never goes away. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/92 "2017-11-08T18:41:02Z")
> [@Drago\_Shouna](#): > > These players will never ever alter their behaviour. All they’ll ever do is quote the EULA and that it’s “allowed” and anyone disagreeing can go and HTFU. > > These types of players are the worst kind, as for some unknown reason they enter a game and instantly lose all social conscience and empathy to other players. Then they claim they’re not like that in real life…they may not be, but it’s obviously what they’d like to be if they could. This is so nebulous and detached from anything concrete it is useless. Look at the OP. Quintessen: Bullying is bad. Others: Okay, but what is bullying? Q: Not ganking. O: Scamming? Q: No, unless you go full on Erotica 1…or maybe 50% Erotica 1…well okay, maybe it is bullying. O: PvP? Q: No, but EVE should be a welcoming place where everyone can enjoy the game. O: But some people might not enjoy being ganked. Q: I don’t want to discuss ganking. I know bullies in game, they want to cause psychological harm. O: Why can’t they block them, and if players violate the EULA/TOS report them and move on? Q: The bully then controls them, and you are becoming a bully too if you don’t agree with me! O: You still haven’t really defined bullying…? Seriously, this is all a bunch of un-grounded mealy mouthed Bravo Sierra that can mean anything and everything is bullying aside from turning this into some thing like Candyland Online. This is a competitive MMO with a minimal set of rules and as such if you are foolish or careless or imprudent you’ll lose your stuff to varying degrees. It used to be we’d celebrate things like the GHSC heist and assassination…now people are sitting around worrying about all this mealy mouthed nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/93 "2017-11-08T18:41:15Z")
I dont have epilepsy, so you can stop that gif now. If anything, you would only be harming innocent bystanders. ---
**Author:** ![Major\_Marshmellow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/major_marshmellow/32/35081_2.png) [@Major\_Marshmellow](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Major_Marshmellow)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 6:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/94 "2017-11-08T18:49:13Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > This community still supports new players, when they have the “right” attitude. Perfect example of your flawed thinking. Thanks! ![explosion](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/2/c/2c9da47025dc5168ff41d9b3a27e0f2aecd2c60a.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/95 "2017-11-08T19:07:46Z")
I think he just means you cant support people who don’t want support or to learn, to make mistakes and discuss them and find new strategies or ways forward, or to give or take help, people who just want to call names and break the game because OMG a psychopath shot my rifter they so evil please CCP make me a safe space, who would rather name call and label people sociopaths for playing a game by its rules, making pop psychology assumptions about someone’s mental state because they shoot things in eve, who talk about new players, but don’t offer them anything to keep them engaged and playing this great game beyond ‘avoid all risk and if you get blown up its because the players are toxic’ I guess someone blew you up, you got salty, and they were mean or something? ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/96 "2017-11-08T19:10:00Z")
How is that gif even relevant? Go to sleep, kid. School tomorrow. EVE community will bend over backwards to teach/aid a new player that shows commitment to this game we all love to hate to love. Except you, perhaps. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/97 "2017-11-08T19:18:07Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > EVE community will bend over backwards to teach/aid a new player But what do they see as a lesson? 🤔 [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/5/4/54517c3956e0c4be13ea9f0aea946585e9a0863b.jpeg "Permaband - Killing is Just a Means") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSxNW5dDYEY) ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/98 "2017-11-08T19:19:43Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > But what do they see as a lesson? 🤔 Carrot or the stick. Both work. ---
**Author:** ![Major\_Marshmellow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/major_marshmellow/32/35081_2.png) [@Major\_Marshmellow](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Major_Marshmellow)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/99 "2017-11-08T19:29:56Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Carrot or the stick. > > Both work. Can you guess where you can put that carrot? ![butt](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/5/d/5d27fe0cfafdf7e023f9570ad996c6b6f96e090b.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/100 "2017-11-08T19:44:33Z")
Would you prefer the stick? ---
**Author:** ![Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/patti_potato_patrouette/32/18901_2.png) [@Patti\_Potato\_Patrouette](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Patti_Potato_Patrouette)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 7:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981/101 "2017-11-08T19:54:33Z")
Not much help I can offer right now as a returning filthy casual mostly solo player, except encouragement, isk maybe, and sharing what little knowledge I have- but like most of the sociopaths who post in these threads (to offer advice even if the kindest advice really is htfu- which was never meant to be a put down we all had to get it or we would be all be whining about getting exploded and eve dies in 2006) I’m only on the forums to share and learn- even the CODE threads teach you loads about opsec AND when you work out why they can say they always win you win too. Faylee basically gave away exactly how he was making so much isk and told his victims and the response was often ‘you evil man’. a wasted opportunity. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981.md?page=4) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-problem-players-have-any-responsibility-to-change-their-own-behavior/36981.md?page=6)