# Do you want more protection from people in highsec, or less? **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [December 29, 2018, 11:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176 "2018-12-29T11:45:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 7:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/621 "2019-01-14T07:39:59Z")
> [@Black\_Pedro](#): > > I think your feelings don’t match reality. Take a close look at the Monthly Economic Report and you’ll see how little stuff is destroyed there compared to what is moved around. I shall take a closer look before shooting comments based on a narrow part of High sec before commenting again on the subject. My focus had been looking at [CODE. | Alliance | zKillboard](https://zkillboard.com/alliance/99002775/) and I had read a thread the other day where someone linked some info on the amount of isk that is lost by that one corp in mind. I know I am about to move freight right under the nose of that corp as sometimes I do feel that some of them in Code. are asleep at the controls. Like today I passed them and they had declared war on my corp. yet they didn’t attack my orca loaded with 1.2bil. (small fry I am) Anyhow here is my current desktop and the spreadsheet i had started to look at since Code. opened a war vs Frostpacker. [https://i.imgur.com/wrBaPAP.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/wrBaPAP.jpg) single picture ---
**Author:** ![Qia\_Kare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/qia_kare/32/279281_2.png) [@Qia\_Kare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Qia_Kare)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 7:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/622 "2019-01-14T07:49:59Z")
I don’t know if your version of Windows uses the same hotkeys, but on Win7 you can screen capture just the active window by holding Alt when pressing Print Screen. Might be convenient if you try to do something like this again. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 9:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/623 "2019-01-14T09:19:17Z")
> [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](#): > > High sec ganking should be via Wardec only. Derp…ganking and wardecs are at polar opposites. Maybe learn what you are talking about before you talk. ---
**Author:** ![Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/iceacid_frostpacker/32/505689_2.png) [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Iceacid_Frostpacker)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 10:10am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/624 "2019-01-14T10:10:19Z")
Do they have to be though? Thinking outside the box to supply something to the thread, offer something before pulling apart replies would be the better approach Protection against the high sec gank via the form of a wardec be placed first on a pilot or pilots corp to curd the random gank of a neutral pilot in high sec space. I invite you to partake in offering a suggestion. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 11:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/625 "2019-01-14T11:01:53Z")
> [@Foggy\_Bernstein](#): > > I couldn’t help but notice that Dom seems to be your own personal dick licker in that he follows you around worshiping you and liking every one of your posts. I thought they were the same person ? Well, one has not affirmed that nobody ever got killed by a gun yet, but I’m confident they affirmed other stupid things. ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Pedro](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/black_pedro/32/257285_2.png) [@Black\_Pedro](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Black_Pedro)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 11:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/626 "2019-01-14T11:34:09Z")
> [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](#): > > Protection against the high sec gank via the form of a wardec be placed first on a pilot or pilots corp to curd the random gank of a neutral pilot in high sec space. Yeah, but that risk is suppose to be there. The problem with giving players warning of an attack via a personal wardec is that it makes fitting and flying of industrial ships rather one dimensional. Basically everyone would fit for max yield/cargo docking up when there was any risk of attack or perhaps switching to a combat ship. Industrial fitting and ship choices would be made almost irrelevant. You could haul an infinite value of stuff in an untanked rookie ship with no fear of loss. One can imagine some grand revamp of how fighting is done, but whatever you dream up probably should keep at least the possibility of unexpected combat and present choices and trade-offs to the players. Eve already suffers too much from PvE/PvP polarization and reliance on evasion metas (like the Intel of local chat). We don’t need any more of that. ---
**Author:** ![Sitting\_Bull\_Lakota](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sitting_bull_lakota/32/438272_2.png) [@Sitting\_Bull\_Lakota](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sitting_Bull_Lakota)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 11:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/627 "2019-01-14T11:36:23Z")
> Iceacid\_Frostpacker > Protection against the high sec gank via the form of a wardec be placed first on a pilot or pilots corp to curd the random gank of a neutral pilot in highsec space. First, I was unable to make sense of what you wrote until about the fifth read. I still may not have it. I assume what you are suggesting by restricting all ganking to wardecs is: “Remove suicide ganking.” Now to offer a suggestion: No. Neutral ganking needs neither curing nor curbing. It provides a small but noticable market pressure. It helps to keep hauling a profitable profession. It provides a very low cost (skillpoint-wise) pvp activity for new and older players. To those same players who enjoy the low-sp romp it may also provide a high payout in isk and modules as well as a chance to be on the dishing-it-out side of the cutthroatery EvE is known for. Finally, it is the only counter to neutral haulers, missioners, miners, explorers, incursioners, etc. some of whom are either alts of or indirectly involved in supporting real opponents’ activities. Consider the ubiquitous farming-alts believed to be financing pvp primary players. Oh, by the way, how else do you propose we deal with botting orcas? Spend all day bumping them? For a shiny nickel I can round up some new players and have a marvelous time whaling in the increasingly deceptively safe waters of highsec. ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 1:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/628 "2019-01-14T13:15:07Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > The ability to wardec an individual has been put forward so many times over the years this isn’t a matter of closed thinking. It’s a matter of knowing how bad & abusable this is. I’d be all for this (because omfg the madness), which means I’m actually absolutely against it (because i care about the game), but it would be ■■■■■■■ hilarious! (for a week, then the game dies) ---
**Author:** ![Solecist\_Project](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solecist_project/32/479741_2.png) [@Solecist\_Project](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solecist_Project)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 1:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/629 "2019-01-14T13:23:21Z")
Amount of isk destroyed is a bad metric. What matters is the amount of ships destroyed combined with the amount of people directly being affected. There’s people who make a huge fuzz about how dozens of billions are being destroyed and how it hurts the game and makes masses of players quit, yet what it really is is that a tiny amount of people with too much value in their cargo are getting killed by an even tinier amount of people. Watch out for people deliberately constructing misleading ■■■■■■■■. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 6:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/630 "2019-01-15T06:32:51Z")
> [@Iceacid\_Frostpacker](#): > > Protection against the high sec gank via the form of a wardec be placed first on a pilot or pilots corp to curd the random gank of a neutral pilot in high sec space. There are plenty of ways to protect against a freighter gank…only idiots are ganked in an overloaded freighter. ---
**Author:** ![Marellen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/marellen/32/112541_2.png) [@Marellen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Marellen)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 8:15am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/631 "2019-01-15T08:15:20Z")
> [@Rexxar\_Santaro](#): > > I disagree. > > Hi-Sec isn’t so protected as you thought, especially if you are in a War-Eligible corporation. As I mentioned above, your protection in hi-sec is completely defined by the cost of your assets in space, **which can be targeted** (pod, ship, Citadel, deployable structure like MTU, whatever). More expensive assets means that you can be suddenly attacked anytime, anywhere, by anybody even by 1 month life ALTs. > > The rewards are already adjusted to the ground in hi-sec, based on the current in game inflation, resource grinding level of null-sec and J-space dwellers and required time to grind something. I’d say the hi-sec rewards are based on HUGE time investments per each 100M ISK during some activities or rng case which happens very rare in other kind of activities. But lets nerf it. I want to see what can be nerfed even more btw. Played for 2 hours yesterday in highsec with this alpha, small b-type MWD, small c-type rep, small c-type AB dropped, that will be circa 150m isk. Thats a sub 1m SP alpha in a frigate. Accounting for “RNG” as you describe it, I’m probably running at 40m isk/hr on this character, and that started more or less on day 2 with a frigate that I got from starter missions. Most of the loot I’m collecting is up by 20% compared to where I remember it, alpha injectors seem to be up by 20%, and most of the things I want seem to be up by 20%. Haven’t played for a while, but don’t remember there being a news report of L4 missions, burners or incursions being deleted from highsec, and I’ve checked the loot table prices on ded3/4s, so there is still at least 3 farmey ways to grind 100m/hr, and that still seems to a relevant enough income to at least setup some sort of bigger play/trading stake or fund some pvp. > [@](#): > > You should compare the hi-sec protection with SOV BlueDonut null-sec protection. BTW, I’m living in low-sec also for long time now and I’ll surprise you maybe that the rewards there are as bad as in hi-sec time to time or I’d say often. Its not remotely comparable. Concord never gets counter dropped, never loses, and comes at an agreed schedule, and doesn’t care how ■■■■ your ship is, or even if its dead. They still come and they still win. Most of the time intel channels tells you that the frigate in system belongs to the shitty kitey group nobody wants to fight and nobody will come to help you with, so that you can make a judgement of don’t bother to undock and tackle it, which of course has the opportunity cost of not doing any PVE, and not having any fun PVP. having said all that, I personally find reactive defensive pvp, defending a friendly in nullsec to be some of the most fun pvp in the game. **_ie the actual observation is that playing as a weak concord is more fun than being protected by the real Concord._** God knows why you would even make a distinction, because its straight forward to get yourself recruited to a null organisation and enjoy the benefits. Its not like you can’t clone jump back and forth so as to enjoy the benefits of both spaces. ie it can’t be seen as a balance issue between spaces, because you can access all spaces whenever you feel like it, and since eve is a game of alts, its not like your nullsec character has to do the highsec work under threat of a dec. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 9:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/632 "2019-01-15T09:02:57Z")
Probably running at 40m hour, hmmm in my experience many people tend to average out on the high side by taking the better drops and don’t factor in the time to generate or locate content. 3 ways to farm 100m/hour, details please. Incursions is one, after that it gets a bit hazy. Indy takes a massive investment in SP and infrastructure and of course the requirement to pay protection fees and/or defend it. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 9:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/633 "2019-01-15T09:17:07Z")
Burner blitzing if you only count the time after building faction standings? ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 9:19am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/634 "2019-01-15T09:19:57Z")
Thanks, I should go do that at some point 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 9:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/635 "2019-01-15T09:32:06Z")
I heard unconfirmed ccp upped the standing hit for declining missions if you do. So might need to keep a careful eye on that and see if it is true. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 9:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/636 "2019-01-15T09:36:58Z")
God I hope not, it was annoying enough before…, if that is the case no missioning for me. ---
**Author:** ![Erik\_Aihaken](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/erik_aihaken/32/92554_2.png) [@Erik\_Aihaken](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Erik_Aihaken)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 11:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/637 "2019-01-15T11:52:09Z")
Game is ■■■■■■ beyond repair by bots. Just uninstall already. Let it die. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 12:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/638 "2019-01-15T12:55:21Z")
> [@Erik\_Aihaken](#): > > Game is ■■■■■■ beyond repair by bots. > > Just uninstall already. Let it die. It depends how you treat the game. PIRAT who are a bunch of cheating scumbags due to botting and thus cheating to get to the position they are now can no longer war dec me as I do not have structures. I can just make stuff for my own use and can admire my vast riches without being affected by such cheating scumbags. So at this point I can treat the game as a measure my wealth solo play game, as long as I can do that then all those cheating scumbags around me don’t bother me at all. But as soon as CCP enables PIRAT to war dec me then the cheating bot scumbags will bother me again. Well lets say that their continued ability to play the game will annoy me, but they are still too damn useless to get in my way anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Dom\_Arkaral](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dom_arkaral/32/462611_2.png) [@Dom\_Arkaral](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dom_Arkaral)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 12:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/639 "2019-01-15T12:59:28Z")
Putting all the eggs in the same basket won’t make all of the eggs stale @Dracvlad They obviously did something more personal to you with all the insult throwing 😂 ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2019, 1:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176/640 "2019-01-15T13:06:07Z")
> [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > Putting all the eggs in the same basket won’t make all of the eggs stale @Dracvlad I did not do that, you just did, I said PIRAT not all war deckers, reading and comprehensive is important when you reply to someone young bean. > [@Dom\_Arkaral](#): > > They obviously did something more personal to you with all the insult throwing 😂 They pulled a nice trick on me once which was clever use of corp changing mechanics, so I used the same trick to help someone save their Jump Freighter from VMG. But that is not the reason even though you would love it to be because of your tear fixation, there are no tears here. They botted to get into a dominate position in hisec against non-PVP focussed carebears, which makes them the biggest carebears in the game, they also blanket war decked anything that moved thus driving many people out of the game, what is to like about them and that these cheating scumbags cannot impact my play by war decking me is a very good thing. So as bots do not affect me I don’t see any reason to leave the game even though it is dominated by botters. Simple answer isn’t it. In fact it is a very good reason to keep the war dec ability linked to structures. Even Tora is coming round to the view that it is a good thing if you can read INN that is. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176.md?page=30) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/do-you-want-more-protection-from-people-in-highsec-or-less/130176.md?page=32)