# Encounter Surveillance System projected to be a "Permanent thing" **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [July 2, 2020, 9:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650 "2020-07-02T21:10:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 8:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/164 "2020-07-04T08:32:45Z")
> [@Shadalana](#): > > 0.0 will lose players. thats bad for 0.0 > the player will most likely not leave eve, but the "elit"pvpler, which hunt farmers, will lose content. > thats acutal fine for me, I won’t lose anything of value. The rest of the game lost players during the years CCP shoved everything up the nullseccers collective asses. The only players nullsec is losing, ever since the black-out, is those they don’t give a ■■■■ about anymore. That’s, according to the changes during these last months since black-out, are the carebears, the afk players and the farmers. No one who matters gives a single flying ■■■■ about those. This includes CCP, all the leaders of the respective nullsec entities and all the player-types CCP now cares about. CCP’s changes to the game over the last years, before black-out, negatively influenced literally the whole game. If you don’t believe it, just look at what they’re doing now, why the economy needs to be moved into a better direction and why everyone pretty much agreed that the game was horribly stagnating. Will nullsec lose even more players? Yes. Will nullsec lose players who matter? No. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 8:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/165 "2020-07-04T08:33:17Z")
> [@Shadalana](#): > > 0.0 will lose players. thats bad Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Shadalana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shadalana/32/207845_2.png) [@Shadalana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shadalana)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 8:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/166 "2020-07-04T08:48:17Z")
> [@Solstice\_Projekt](#): > > Will nullsec will lose even more players? Yes. > Will nullsec lose players who matter? No. you are right in many points. but in matter question I disagree. does a player matter? sure, even if he does not like your or my play style. even if he hates pvp will 0.0 lose players, that matter? sure. even carebears matter in 0.0 (belive it or not), because they generate content. no carebares to lazy (aka semiafk farming) to watch intel means no free killmails… will the carebares leaving 0.0 be mad about leaving 0.0? no, the will just find another nice place in new eden do get isk…there are enough options available will CCP feel it? I think not. blackout was different. no one will leave no the game because auf the ESS change. will CCP succeed with generating more content for pvpler in 0.0? I would bet that not. (I would bet isk on this, but I have no idea how to measure success or not. be my guest and help me out on agreeable terms and I bet a billion isk) will 0.0 have less residents after the change? yes but, of course ,all I say could be totally wrong, because there is still no dev blog. just a dev dropping a bomb in an interview. not sure what he or ccp was thinking when he was leaking this info without any details… ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 12:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/167 "2020-07-04T12:26:34Z")
> [@Manweru\_Cemenotar](#): > > he ain’t afk, or camping if he does that tho… Problem is that local residens dont know that, thus they have to assume that he is always not afk. > [@Manweru\_Cemenotar](#): > > I highly doubt that single afk player wether or not using cloaking device was capable of exploding ratters “right left and center” Ever heard about Olmeca Gold who was camping a certain region for a year? ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 12:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/168 "2020-07-04T12:31:42Z")
> [@Solstice\_Projekt](#): > > No one who matters And who matters? Like 5-10 dudes who are leaders of big alliances, the rest of player base can simply delete the game? ---
**Author:** ![Solstice\_Projekt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solstice_projekt/32/503293_2.png) [@Solstice\_Projekt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solstice_Projekt)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 12:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/169 "2020-07-04T12:56:52Z")
Are you taking this personally? You shouldn’t, otherwise you can’t actually function in society, because it is like this everywhere, for almost everyone. The only ones who matter are the devs and those who lead the thousands. There wouldn’t be any alliances, if these people weren’t willing to be led. You, I, and them don’t matter at all. We’re replacable and CCP, over the years, provided us enough evidence in the form of devblogs that they carefully watch out for their words and make sure that they don’t inform us _too well_ about what they’re doing. In case of CrimeWatch 2.0, as an example, they just outright lied to people knowing well that there will be those who show sympathy for what they’re doing. In the end, we can’t even guarantee that the members of the CSM really bring up what we wish them to bring up. There simply is none. The NDA protects CCP’s interest, which extends to the CSM. We can not ever be sure that we get to know what they’re actually talking about. Yes. You could delete the game and never come back and it wouldn’t matter, as long as long as you can be replaced. That’s how this always worked. Right now, starting with the black-out, they’re slowly replacing the population again. They’ve spent the years since 2013 with gathering whales, farmers and carebears and they’ve spent the last _months_ getting rid of them again. vOv ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/170 "2020-07-04T13:16:53Z")
One can only wonder how do you function in a society if you think that your opponent automaticly takes everything personally. Funny thing: alliances would neither exist if there wouldn´t be anyone to lead. Without players Mittens and Piggleman would have to go for a good old fist fight. I agree with what you wrote but there is one thing: good luck for EVE to exist without players. I dont matter, you dont matter, however thousands matter because they have an impact on such relatevily small game. Does CCP have to take rather radical actions in order to achieve their goal quicker than 10 years? Sure. Does CCP have to take a good dump on overall balance between factions of players? No. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/171 "2020-07-04T13:18:54Z")
I feel you are missing the point of who changes are intended to benefit and how, though you did hit on it on passing. ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/172 "2020-07-04T13:33:05Z")
More kills in null ---
**Author:** ![Shadalana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shadalana/32/207845_2.png) [@Shadalana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shadalana)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/173 "2020-07-04T13:54:20Z")
you hope, I hope but tbh I fear this idea will reduce the amount of kills… ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/174 "2020-07-04T14:11:21Z")
I simply dont believe that new ESS will not become yet another horror from CCP ---
**Author:** ![Big\_Country\_Boy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/big_country_boy/32/282041_2.png) [@Big\_Country\_Boy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Big_Country_Boy)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 3:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/175 "2020-07-04T15:05:50Z")
Really, I played null with various groups under another character for a long time. What drove me out of null when I made this one had nothing to do with CCP, we adapt and overcome there. What got me out of null was player culture there. Null attracts two general kinds of players in my experience. First, the lazy farmer (quitting in droves with super/carrier/rorq/mining nerfs), and the die hard pvp addict who will undock for anything and hunt it without mercy. Null works for them right now. Basically though, the alliances running with you will show up for fleets is what ruined it for me. You have a war, yes i get fleets, but daily drunkfest fleets are not my thing. This change will certainly buff one of those groups while hurting the other. In that way it works as intended. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 3:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/176 "2020-07-04T15:41:57Z")
That’s a what, not a who. ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 4:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/177 "2020-07-04T16:41:34Z")
Oh, guess this new ESS thingy will provide local residents with more kills of roaming gangs and cloaky campers, right? ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 4:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/178 "2020-07-04T16:54:34Z")
> [@Shadalana](#): > > You will be first one whining, when less players are in 0.0 Not really, because the ones who remain will the ones who deserve to be there. > [@Shadalana](#): > > does a player matter? Nope. Farmer trash does not matter, ever. They create nothing of value, and they make every possible effort to keep it that way. CCP may miss their subscription fees in their annual financial report but the game itself will not. > [@Daro\_Mozu](#): > > Without players Mittens and Piggleman would have to go for a good old fist fight. What’s your point? Even if all of the farmer trash ragequits there will still be plenty of people playing the game and plenty of people to lead. Remember, not everyone is a helpless perma-victim like you. ---
**Author:** ![Shadalana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/shadalana/32/207845_2.png) [@Shadalana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Shadalana)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 5:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/179 "2020-07-04T17:04:56Z")
OK, Boomer. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 5:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/180 "2020-07-04T17:10:24Z")
Whoosh ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 5:20pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/182 "2020-07-04T17:20:50Z")
> [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > What’s your point? Even if all of the farmer trash ragequits there will still be plenty of people playing the game and plenty of people to lead. Remember, not everyone is a helpless perma-victim like you. Christ allmighty, how mentally deranged are you? If you would actually read my post you would see that i wrote > [@Daro\_Mozu](#): > > 5-10 dudes who are leaders of big alliances, the rest of player base can simply delete the game? which means that i literally excluded ALL players from this list except alliance leaders in order to establish who are those “who matter”. And what do you see? That i removed only krabs and only krabs. You remind me about Olmeca: if you force into him a ton of weed and 2000 liters of alcohol and will somehow revive him and ask “mate, what date is it today?”, he will answer “supers in delve”. If you see only what you want to see - it´s beyond my capabilities to somehow make you understand certain things. ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 5:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/183 "2020-07-04T17:24:30Z")
> [@Daro\_Mozu](#): > > which means that i literally excluded ALL players from this list except alliance leaders in order to establish who are those “who matter”. And what do you see? That i removed only krabs and only krabs. No, I see that your post is utter nonsense. You’ve removed all players but alliance leaders when that’s a fundamentally stupid thing to do. There is no scenario here where everyone but the alliance leaders will quit EVE. The only “people” at risk of quitting are the farmer trash and their removal is not a loss. ---
**Author:** ![Daro\_Mozu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daro_mozu/32/184030_2.png) [@Daro\_Mozu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daro_Mozu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 5:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650/184 "2020-07-04T17:29:11Z")
Once again: > [@Daro\_Mozu](#): > > _in order to establish who are those “who matter”_ It was a question… not a realistic scenario… good god. > [@Merin\_Ryskin](#): > > The only “people” at risk of quitting are the farmer trash and their removal is not a loss. First of all: i love how you dont even see krabs as people. Are they subhumans or what? Second: even pvp eventually died out during blackout, but it kinda ruins your narrative, so i guess we will just ignore that. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650.md?page=8) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/encounter-surveillance-system-projected-to-be-a-permanent-thing/252650.md?page=10)