# Eve Concurrent Average Online under 20k now :( **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [August 22, 2019, 10:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056 "2019-08-22T22:43:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:43pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/41 "2019-08-23T18:43:22Z")
> [@Theron\_Larkis](#): > > you’re one of “them”. I dont like krabs But I dont like that attitude more. ---
**Author:** ![Oh-my\_giddy\_aunt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/oh-my_giddy_aunt/32/156820_2.png) [@Oh-my\_giddy\_aunt](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Oh-my_giddy_aunt)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/42 "2019-08-23T18:46:50Z")
> [@ChowYung\_Phatt](#): > > > [@Theron\_Larkis](#): > > > > Then I can see why you react as you do, you’re one of “them”. Good luck, I hope you find a way to do well in EVE. If not then so be it. > > How do i react? Shouldn’t take any notice, he seems to make a lot of assumptions. ---
**Author:** ![Kezrai\_Charzai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kezrai_charzai/32/394578_2.png) [@Kezrai\_Charzai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kezrai_Charzai)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/43 "2019-08-23T18:56:43Z")
> [@Theron\_Larkis](#): > > ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/9/2/92f78470938ab9a75f8cc0ce9405c4691767b2d8.jpeg) Veryez: > > > There was a time when CCP promoted All play styles as being valid and actually just wanted people to “play their game”. > > That was the time random investors owned CCP who only cared for short term profit, not for the game or its premise. Now that CCP is owned by a games company who understands and nurtures pvp sandboxes CCP can change their their tone again, back to old school CCP: HTFU. > > ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/9/2/92f78470938ab9a75f8cc0ce9405c4691767b2d8.jpeg) Veryez: > > > \<20k online users is a big red flag that should not be ignored. > > Says who? You? Some random people? Based on what logic or numbers? Or is it perhaps just used by people to try and further their agenda? Why not 25k, or 15k? A lot of people who are ignorant about corporate management and financial markets tend to say things like this. - Investors have virtually no say at all in company operations, daily management, or design decisions. They do have occasional meetings and directives where they say things like “we would like to see greater growth” or “we want a focus on paying more dividends”. That’s about it for calling the shots. - _Most_ investors care about the long term health of the company, and long term growth. They care _more_ than the employees at the company. The employees are drawing a paycheque - the investors have millions of dollars at stake. Only a certain segment of investors who plan to hold a company for the short term or to flip their shares ‘care more about short term profit’ - this was not the case with CCP’s long-term investors. - The previous investors bailed on CCP exactly _because_ CCP has been failing to deliver on long term growth, short term profit, or value for investment. They bailed _because_ CCP manages the company badly. You have your cause and effect exactly backwards here. - CCP may have had a video and a mantra of “HTFU”: they never lived it, they don’t run their company that way, they don’t design or code that way, they don’t even know what it means in terms of the game except for their implicit message: “Suck up all the bugs, bad decisions and poor design we throw your way, whiners, because it’s all you’re gonna get. Oh, and don’t forget to buy a sub on your way out!” - There is no one specific ‘online’ number that means trouble. However when that number gets lower every year, it certainly does mean trouble. Plus, the past few years show it isn’t the krabbers who leave… they just relocate. It is the serious players, the PvPers, and the innovators who get fed up with sub-par game development and leave. Next time, before you start singing the company song of ‘CCP knows best’, check your facts. Oh, and maybe play a little more of the game than being an F1-monkey in rental space. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 6:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/44 "2019-08-23T18:59:01Z")
> [@Xuixien](#): > > They’re players who don’t do anything except PvE in order to amass great wealth, in order to brag to other krabbers about how much ISK they have and how rich they are. Yeah sorry man, you jealous much? Anyway CCP states those are some of the many different careers a player can choose to do in this game. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/b/2/b272a0ba60d8c957176545dffb90bf2f673e5582.jpeg "EVE Online - Official Gameplay Trailer - Play Free!") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPFII3ozSHI) In fact gaining massive wealth has been one of the main selling points of this game for a very long time. [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/1/3/2/1326771cb39d5e6652e9d8e741cb047e05b3929b.jpeg "EVE Online: Dare To Be Bold") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNyfI4dv1dg) ---
**Author:** ![Theron\_Larkis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theron_larkis/32/170573_2.png) [@Theron\_Larkis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Theron_Larkis)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/45 "2019-08-23T19:04:20Z")
> [@Kezrai\_Charzai](#): > > Next time, before you start singing the company song of ‘CCP knows best’, check your facts. Oh, and maybe play a little more of the game than being an F1-monkey in rental space. Then explain CCP’s sudden 180, since they’re now owned by PA. Also I’ve not EVER been part of such a terrible group, I don’t even know where you get that from given that I’m very obviously _against_ krabbers. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/46 "2019-08-23T19:10:25Z")
> [@Boom\_Boom\_Longtime](#): > > 45k - 60k a few years ago? More than a few. It’s been declining in comparison to those numbers for 7 years. But anyways. There’s many short term reasons for the drop. - Summer. - Bot banning. - Bots quitting due to blackout. - Null bears quitting due to black out. We will hopefully see some seasonal recovery around autumn and, hopefully, the blackout will replace economy suppressing bots/bears with content creating players. ---
**Author:** ![Theron\_Larkis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theron_larkis/32/170573_2.png) [@Theron\_Larkis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Theron_Larkis)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/47 "2019-08-23T19:12:57Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > the blackout will replace economy suppressing bots/bears with content creating players. Bingo. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/48 "2019-08-23T19:15:55Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > In fact gaining massive wealth has been one of the main selling points of this game for a very long time. Gaining massive wealth doesn’t have the same effect as in that video when everyone else is just as wealthy and the wealthiest of all are bots. The mass farming has devalued isk like that of the currency in other games. It’s now meaningless and unimpressive. ---
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/49 "2019-08-23T19:16:06Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > > They’re players who don’t do anything except PvE in order to amass great wealth, in order to brag to other krabbers about how much ISK they have and how rich they are. > > Yeah sorry man, you jealous much? Uh, no? Why would I be? I mean aside from the fact that it’s ridiculous to be jealous of people who AFK’d their way to a fat wallet, I have more ISK than I know what to do with, and will never run out with my current playstyle. This is the first year I’ve actually paid real money for a subscription, and I’ve been a regular player since 2011 (started in 2009). ---
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 7:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/50 "2019-08-23T19:18:51Z")
> [@Kal\_Ray](#): > > You mean when I spend $20 to get almost 2 billion isk, this is not causing inflation? I would have to pve for a very long time to get 2B isk… > > I pve and pvp, my pve helps pay for my pvp. Or I could just buy some isk I guess. No, it actually takes ISK out of the game… because you don’t spend $20 and CCP magically injects ISK into your character’s wallet. You spend $20 and then you sell the PLEX or whatever to other players, and taxes remove ISK from the market. You need to understand ISK faucets vs ISK sinks and horizontal vs vertical movement of ISK. ---
**Author:** ![Merovee](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merovee/32/167629_2.png) [@Merovee](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merovee)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/51 "2019-08-23T20:02:43Z")
I’m going miss the krabs, I’m glad I dumped my plexs just before the black out, about time I had good luck, with all the bad luck I’ve been having with this recession this year. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 8:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/52 "2019-08-23T20:05:24Z")
Gotta say, all the constant fearmongering about bots and bad economy reminds me of Chicken Little. ---
**Author:** ![March\_rabbit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/march_rabbit/32/453160_2.png) [@March\_rabbit](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/March_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 9:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/53 "2019-08-23T21:45:05Z")
> [@Theron\_Larkis](#): > > In the mean time CCP is going “lol, gtfo. Good riddance” while having all the stats. All these “Free SP for logging in” events didn’t happen i guess. 😏 ---
**Author:** ![March\_rabbit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/march_rabbit/32/453160_2.png) [@March\_rabbit](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/March_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 9:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/54 "2019-08-23T21:54:10Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > We will hopefully see some seasonal recovery around autumn It would be nice but if i’m not mistaken 2 or 3 previous years haven’t shown this. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 11:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/55 "2019-08-23T23:28:21Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > Gotta say, all the constant fearmongering about bots and bad economy reminds me of Chicken Little. Fear mongering? The players and CCP recognising the overabundance of materials and isk in the game and the bad effect bots have on the game is fear mongering to you? Seriously, what happened to you? ---
**Author:** ![Boom\_Boom\_Longtime](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/boom_boom_longtime/32/503592_2.png) [@Boom\_Boom\_Longtime](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Boom_Boom_Longtime)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 11:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/56 "2019-08-23T23:32:38Z")
I was actually quite drunk when I made this post last night - I’ve had a few drinks tonight, but on reflection I actually don’t disagree with what I said last night full of wine. Numbers speak for themselves ---
**Author:** ![MadMuppet](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/madmuppet/32/161198_2.png) [@MadMuppet](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/MadMuppet)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2019, 11:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/57 "2019-08-23T23:46:15Z")
I couldn’t recommend this game to my friends for several years. If this keeps up, I can. Time for new blood. ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2019, 7:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/58 "2019-08-24T07:00:01Z")
> [@Daichi\_Yamato](#): > > > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > > > Gotta say, all the constant fearmongering about bots and bad economy reminds me of Chicken Little. > > Fear mongering? > > The players and CCP recognising the overabundance of materials and isk in the game and the bad effect bots have on the game is fear mongering to you? > > Seriously, what happened to you? More like what happened to you? Wait a minute, first let me put on this tin-foil wizards hat. Sorry but I’m not drinking that Kool-Aid. CCP has been conducting their ‘War On Bots’ for as long as I’ve been in this game and yet for some reason the bot issue is supposedly worse now than before? Something just doesn’t sound right with that. I don’t know, maybe there actually is an overabundant amount of materials and ISK in the game. One thing is for sure, I definitely don’t have an overabundance of materials and ISK. My average ISK per hr income has been drastically nerfed over the years and is now barely 1/3rd of what it use to be. In fact on a few different occasions I’ve had to buy PLEX just to buff my wallet so I can actually do things in-game. Personally it seems to me that blaming it all on bots and RMT is a rather convenient excuse to justify all this ‘chaos’ crap CCP keeps throwing into the sandbox. All of that content is scripted, designed and implemented to destroy player assets, which will then hopefully cause players to purchase even more PLEX just to replenish their in-game wallets and assets. Basically it’s the Butterfly effect, all designed to boost the bottom line of CCP’s payoff from PA. Yeah, I know they’re a business wanting to make a profit from their product. Do you remember the 2011 ‘Summer Of Rage’ and being viewed as the ‘Golden Goose’? Well guess what, that’s when the goose was put into the oven and it’s now fully cooked. Anyway, time to take off this tin-foil wizards hat and let somebody else wear it. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2019, 12:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/59 "2019-08-24T12:18:23Z")
> [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > yet for some reason the bot issue is supposedly worse now than before? The extent of the bot problem is more apparent than before. But yes, introducing alphas is very likely to have been a major boost to botting. Hence the focus on the vni. Hence the access restrictions on level 4 missions. And the blackout has had a greater effect fighting bots than originally thought it would. Thanks to the recent changes to null, VNI and FW, the bot issue is probably the lowest it’s ever been since pre alpha, maybe better. > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > My average ISK per hr income has been drastically nerfed over the years and is now barely 1/3rd of what it use to be. In fact on a few different occasions I’ve had to buy PLEX just to buff my wallet so I can actually do things in-game. Ahh so this is why you’re bitter. You bot or are bot aspirant? > [@DeMichael\_Crimson](#): > > which will then hopefully cause players to purchase even more PLEX just to replenish their in-game wallets and assets. Why? We knew that once the isk generation of nullsec was hit it would cause a fall in plex prices. The value of isk just went up. The reasons to buy PLEX for isk just went down. As time goes on, production may balance out with destruction and everyones reserves of materials are used up such that industry gets a profit margin! ---
**Author:** ![DeMichael\_Crimson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/demichael_crimson/32/514115_2.png) [@DeMichael\_Crimson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/DeMichael_Crimson)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2019, 12:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056/60 "2019-08-24T12:34:25Z")
Heh, yeah I’m a bot or bot aspirant, nice try at portraying my statements out of context. Anyway, I disagree with your game status evaluation as well as your explanation for all the recent changes. You obviously can’t see the Butterfly Effect / CCP’s money grab intentions due to being completely fixated on Bots. Anyway, enjoy the Kool-Aid. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-concurrent-average-online-under-20k-now/185056.md?page=4)