# Eve do not forget your new players **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [May 26, 2019, 2:16pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033 "2019-05-26T14:16:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2019, 9:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/42 "2019-05-26T21:45:12Z")
> [@Miko\_Jin](#): > > Remember when you started? I do, but I grew some thicker skin and got over it instead of crying about it. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2019, 10:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/43 "2019-05-26T22:00:36Z")
> [@Miko\_Jin](#): > > Remember when you started? > **[Drake Navy Issue | Solonius Rex | Killmail](https://zkillboard.com/kill/31926098/)** > > Solonius Rex (F0RCED ENTRY) lost their Drake Navy Issue in Agrallarier (Sinq Laison). Final Blow by Booster Mord (Dirt Nap Squad) flying in a Gnosis. Total Value: 217,359,719.11 ISK Jesus man back in the day i was baited and killed in hisec. Fun times. Then I went on the forums and cried and quit eve forever, because its a stupid game that doesnt protect me. Wait, no, i didnt. because its a game, and it was fun, and its part of the game, and its just a game, and its not real life, and its not real, and its space pixels. Haha, almost forgot that this was just a game there for a second. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Azariah](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mike_azariah/32/512626_2.png) [@Mike\_Azariah](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mike_Azariah)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2019, 10:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/44 "2019-05-26T22:26:15Z")
That is a fair point. How would you recommend CCP communicate the points? Personally I do not agree with all 8 but that;s just me. m ---
**Author:** ![Natocha\_Daisy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/natocha_daisy/32/474632_2.png) [@Natocha\_Daisy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Natocha_Daisy)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2019, 10:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/45 "2019-05-26T22:47:25Z")
I think they already have: via the forum. If they stuck those rules on a public advertisement I guarantee you not many people would download the game. Take for example: Unfair circumstances? - There is no such thing as “a fair fight” or “an unfair fight”. There’s only a fight. Circumstances are irrelevant. - Just because you can fly something doesn’t mean you should. Doesn’t this seem more like an Eve Survival Guide than anything else? Created by players who have been through the good and bad and held on and kept their interest in spite of the reality of the game. It has its benefits: as a “here you go rookie, you’ve passed your 8 weeks try out and you’re about to quit.” It’s what happened to me anyhow. I don’t think CCP can advertise those points because the game itself is a contradiction and is badly designed. But we Eve lovers, and yes I can call myself an Eve lover because even though I despise parts of the game, I am still an active player, we Eve lovers …actually I forgot the point I was going to make. 😂 ---
**Author:** ![Xuxe\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuxe_xu/32/464660_2.png) [@Xuxe\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuxe_Xu)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2019, 11:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/46 "2019-05-26T23:05:12Z")
“Won’t somebody think of the children” post #8056735, “hisec should be 100% safe” post #7554687 If you want to help new players one can - no need to need ccp to change the game to suit you. btw, @Elena_Laskova - I was crushed you didn’t stand for the CSM. ☹ As you are an economist, a game developer, a programmer, an IT expert, and know everything about EvE I held great hopes for you. Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 12:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/47 "2019-05-27T00:30:13Z")
i am Mexicano speak spanish and realy realy sorry for my translate from gootle translate but realy sorry, my name is Juan Jose i am new player on eve online and i see several videos about Eve in my language for under stand the game, y play other games from steam and origin but eve impact me, no like afk game as mining i mining only for build my ships i learn some tecnics as day jejeje i learn factional but no learn good after some weeks and see my errors, no have oportunity with invisibility ships warped and navigate about me in hi sec or low sec in empty system but is good experience, -regardless of the loss of the ship (this is translate of google xD- i understand pvp rvr pyracy but no understand the no protection about new players, and unther stand experimented players about killers noobs is funny but for healt is bad to long, yes my english is terrible ejejeje i am bad in this, i learn more noobs work hard for level up and and get rich isk but for good old players in eve is funny number of isk of noobs i no imagine how whant isk have a good player and i never ask isk, which I have seen in novices and miss the experience, I just woke up after a long day of work and write this words i am a new player and realy i learn more about that game all time named junjomx, junjos3d from my name and have youtube channel on eionmx name of Hi-security tell my (this zone is securely) all white ships close to me is friendly ships in my beginers and tell my is friendly ships no enemy, i suposed is safe zone but now i learn is very unsafe zone ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 12:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/48 "2019-05-27T00:56:50Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > ou say you understand the game. But you fail to see that the only ‘safe area’ in EVE online is when you’re docked inside a station. > > High sec space isn’t safe. It’s relatively more safe than low sec, null or wormhole space, but it’s not safe. Players are allowed to shoot eachother in high sec space by the game rules. Well, they’re not allowed by the ‘space police’, Concord, but game mechanics allow you to turn your safety to red and shoot illegal targets. See the distinction here? In high sec you are allowed to shoot people, but it’s illegal. > > Because without illegal actions, we cannot play space pirates and without space pirates EVE wouldn’t be EVE. is correct but is good experience vs good old players but no vs noobs players with 1 or 2 mounths or learn color in new players is good idea or is hunt of wich and targeting in body for gankers as prefers easy way to kill ej, expert have skills distance and more damage more blind, vs all low of new player, what learn? day and cover and see overlay all time for see jumpers in sistem is very hard level but no imposible i good players and learn, i move others zone, i like null in empty system, wormhole is very hard for me now i need more level for up i have time and hard work 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 12:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/49 "2019-05-27T00:58:08Z")
where is tl dr ¿ is spanish ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Schweinebacke](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darth_schweinebacke/32/497371_2.png) [@Darth\_Schweinebacke](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darth_Schweinebacke)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 1:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/50 "2019-05-27T01:01:31Z")
It´s not like I am totally out of touch, with how newbies progress through the game. From 2012 to last year whenever I was actually playing the game I was spending most of my time in rookie help, helping new players out either with providing information or helping them out when they needed help with Dagan or other stuff they could not quite handle on their own. Quite often though all it took, was a slight optimization of their setups and some basic info on how to properly fit their ships and they were able to get the task done on their own. I still went from Amarr space over to the SOE arc area 100s of times helping them and at the very least watching how they try to get it done and spend an uncountable amount of hours training new pilots. I also started new chars from scratch with every time they changed the NPE in order to be able to help them better, since it´s a lot easier to answer the possible questions that come up, when you have done the stuff yourself. If new players struggle for the most part it´s ignorance or lazyness. With just a tiny bit of research on the basics of how EvE works, it´s really easy to get started in EvE these days. And it´s not like it´s hard to find the required information. If you enter “eve newbie guide” into google the very first result takes you to the eve-uni wiki which will provide you with all the information you need. Including links to fitting guides and so on. And if that is not enough they can always ask in rookie help (at least they used to get the information they needed most of the time). There are youtube videos for pretty much everything you want to do in eve. And any new player who puts at least any little bit of effort into learning how the game works, it is absolutely no big deal, to earn enough ISK right from the start to replace any losses that might happen to you. And still objecivly speaking, yes even when I start from scratch I do have the advantage of not having to learn all the stuff new players need to learn. Still your claim of income starvation is completly false. Actually a new player can make money a lot faster than sometimes is good for them, as it quite often leads to progressing to bigger ships a lot faster than they should, which they end up losing, because they are missing the skills to properly fit them. But again: This is rather a sign of new players earning way more money than they actually need and quite the opposite of income starvation. ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 1:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/51 "2019-05-27T01:16:36Z")
> [@Darth\_Schweinebacke](#): > > And now compare that to earlier days in EvE. > > When I started there were no career agents. We did not have specialised mining ships. Making 3 million per / hour would have been a wet dream. I had to mine for hours and hours straight over several days, to even be able to afford my first cruiser! > > You get more than that today from the career agents alone. We did not have such effective tools available from day 1 either. We did not have ventures. We started with our shitty unbonused rookie ships with a laughable cargo space with an income rookies these days would not even undock for. > > On top of that we did not even have a whole lot of alternatives either. There was no stuff like explorations where you can easily make millions in your first few days. > > It took me several weeks of mining in a fleet with people, putting effort into building up a corporation to even work half way efficiently to even be able to afford my first battleship. > > From there over time CCP added more and more ways to make money and made them available for new players as well. > > I am not saying that CCP should dial it back to where it was back then. But speaking of income starvation and claiming that these days it would be hard, to replace losses is simply far from the truth. > > My point stands, it´s easier than ever to recover from losses as new players and you get so many goodies on day 1 that even an unlucky gank on your first venture out of a rookie system can be easily recovered from. > > → There is no income starvation at all. > > I would agree that it´s harder to get into PvP these days, as there are far more variables, because of the vast amount of available ships alone. But the time it takes to replace 5 frigs these days is a joke compared to what it took back in my early days to replace even one of them. > > And I am totally fine with it being easier to replace losses these days, if it allows people to spend more time PvPing or makes them more willing to even try out PvPing. > > Speaking of income starvation is flat out dishonest. sorry for my previous translation. but my point was about the insecurity and preference to kill novices for players with many more skills, if it’s laughable to win isk if you know how to do it and in ytube there are huge ways to learn, my point is focused on how the novice in hi-sec will be pvp focus, only the loss work time is frustrating ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 1:32am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/52 "2019-05-27T01:32:36Z")
yea i understand concept of war, force and experience in team, create team battle is good for corps, as much as getting slaves pvp and wars is vs faction, is good, the live of noobs is easy but is leveled with pvp, of focused pvp new players is named (kick childrens in the ground) is funny kill rats and noobs or have force for combats in wars i love wars but no like kill noobs without experiens, that no provided me experience in battle ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 1:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/53 "2019-05-27T01:46:17Z")
heeeee, no my point is… all new players start docked in hi-sec. place of mission is in hi-sec why new players of 2 days to 3 weeks no have protection of eve, plisss rename high security to other name pls pls pls this is camp of hunters pvp and wars need go to some sites yes war of null sec pvp in null sec, this create realy good experience vs good players, If I kill a new player with 2-day playing now, it really does not give me a new experience, or whoever ---
**Author:** ![JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/junjomx_blackstars/32/221803_2.png) [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/JunjoMX_BlackStars)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 1:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/54 "2019-05-27T01:49:50Z")
where can find that 8 points ¿? ---
**Author:** ![Xuxe\_Xu](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuxe_xu/32/464660_2.png) [@Xuxe\_Xu](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuxe_Xu)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 2:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/55 "2019-05-27T02:02:02Z")
go up to post #8 in this thread ---
**Author:** ![Scoots\_Choco](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scoots_choco/32/262262_2.png) [@Scoots\_Choco](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scoots_Choco)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 2:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/56 "2019-05-27T02:12:55Z")
> [@JunjoMX\_BlackStars](#): > > is funny kill rats and noobs or have force for combats in wars > i love wars but no like kill noobs without experiens, that no provided me experience in battle That’s nice. I don’t really care though. A kill is a kill. ---
**Author:** ![Bjorn\_Tyrson](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bjorn_tyrson/32/371958_2.png) [@Bjorn\_Tyrson](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bjorn_Tyrson)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 2:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/57 "2019-05-27T02:41:20Z")
Security and safety are not the same thing. A football match has much higher security than your neighborhood bar, which has more security than your buddies back yard bbq. You COULD end up getting into a fight at any of those locations. In fact the chances of ending up in one are the complete inverse of how much security there is. Same thing with HS, LS, and null. Just cuz the pve security is higher doesn’t mean it’s any safer. And your probably safest in null where, even without “security” you got your friends backing you up on home turf. ---
**Author:** ![Elena\_Laskova](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elena_laskova/32/11436_2.png) [@Elena\_Laskova](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elena_Laskova)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 7:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/58 "2019-05-27T07:42:44Z")
Darth **Some** new players don’t get income problems. But the “natural” path through EVE (i.e. excluding boosting and exceptional luck) has points where there’s far too much grinding required (notably getting from T1/T1 cruisers to actually using T1/T1 Battlecruisers for L3 missions without breaking the rule: “fly only what I could afford to lose”). You’re not the first to claim there are wonderful new sources of income, but I’ve **tested** them all. Run them a few times (to factor out luck) with rookie SP levels and rookie-attainable T1/T1 ships, and actual time vs actual income nets out to about the same income as low-level T1/T1 non-specialist mining. This is probably a natural side-effect of competition between ISK-farmers, but ultimately the reasons don’t matter to me. I don’t play games to grind. If I get to a point that requires too much grinding I usually get bored and stop playing. I doubt I’m the only one to react this way. Note that there might be one exception: I haven’t tried out wormholes. Last time around I got “terminally bored” in the middle of trying to figure them out. One of the things missing from this picture is the ISK-income to cover losing ships while learning to PvP, trying out risky activities (such as wormholes), etc. People shouldn’t be struggling to play for things like that - on the contrary the game should be guiding them towards “learning through loss”. It’s like the obvious paths through the early stages of EVE were designed as if EvE was a mainstream MMO where being killed is free or cheap, and it’s never crossed anyone’s mind that this doesn’t make sense in a game like EVE. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Schweinebacke](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/darth_schweinebacke/32/497371_2.png) [@Darth\_Schweinebacke](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Darth_Schweinebacke)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 8:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/59 "2019-05-27T08:05:56Z")
As I have said before, I have done the grind with no SP and support in any way from my older chars several times over. And i had no issues making money at all, with those activites. And the last time I did not even try doing any high risk activities and neither did I have to try very hard to progress. Still I was able to afford a BC after just 8 days and was already running level 3 missions with it + had more than enough ISK to insure my BC and get new equipment for a replacement as well. Also there were no high risk activities involved. No lucky jackpot drops or anything, just plain old missionrunning. And I would never recommend to a new player to advance at that pace, because the combination of low skills and the lack of experience will very likely get you killed. At the point where you can “afford” to jump into bigger or simply more expensive ships these days they simply will not be ready to do so. If they stay in smaller ships they can easily make enough money to cover random losses and buy some frigs or destroyers to PvP with. And it´s not the lack of income that keeps them from engaging into PvP either. Around 2 years ago (maybe Mike still remembers this…) I did buy a large amount of t1 frigs, fully fitted for PvP and delivered them into rookie systems in Amarr space and tried to hand them out to rookies. The amount of people who actually made use of that offer was insanely low. The few people who actually took one seemed to have used them for other things than trying out PvP. I asked them to give me a report of their experience, but not a single one ever gave me a reply. I even went as far as writing down a lot of their names and checked zkill to see if they actually ended up getting blown up… Guess how many entries I did find? None! ---
**Author:** ![xxxTRUSTxxx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xxxtrustxxx/32/285949_2.png) [@xxxTRUSTxxx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/xxxTRUSTxxx)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 8:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/60 "2019-05-27T08:48:58Z")
translation: give me plex for free, i want to play this game for free and have all the nice stuffz too 🙂 hope that cleared it up for you 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Saboteur](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dread_saboteur/32/270709_2.png) [@Dread\_Saboteur](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dread_Saboteur)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2019, 9:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-do-not-forget-your-new-players/162033/61 "2019-05-27T09:00:06Z")
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