# Eve isn't dying, but it isn't growing. My answer that devs won't recognize **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [January 29, 2023, 4:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694 "2023-01-29T16:42:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Qia\_Kare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/qia_kare/32/279281_2.png) [@Qia\_Kare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Qia_Kare)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 8:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/21 "2023-01-30T08:48:56Z")
I just think it’s weird that people paying a subscription for a game can be primarily motivated by progression instead of having fun for the subscription period. Sure, I was a miner, but I did like it when I was doing it and losing a ship didn’t bother me. I mean, it’s just an excuse to mine and build another thing, right? And that’s what people who are PvPing are giving me, too, right? They’re giving me reasons to build ships to replace the ones people (myself, my corporation, and my alliance included) lose. I never got so poor I couldn’t go out and do a PvE mission for fun if I wanted to. The game only seems to become bitter for people who only care about the isk/hr as a measure of their progress more than whether they enjoy what they are doing. Sometimes I wonder if people these days are born into some way of thinking that prevents them from seeing the value in anything that isn’t objectively measurable with a number, and if such a case were true then catering Eve to people who think that way would make some kind of business sense even though it looks ridiculous on its face to me, even paradoxical. I mean, if your net worth is what you objectively think is the measure of fun you’re having, why are you wasting some of your real net worth on a video game? I don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![Ha\_Kar\_Ma\_Gor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ha_kar_ma_gor/32/352552_2.png) [@Ha\_Kar\_Ma\_Gor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ha_Kar_Ma_Gor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/22 "2023-01-30T09:34:13Z")
> [@Khaldin](#): > > and ALL progress I have made in the form of collateral can be wiped at any given time in the name of some legendary name like James, or some whale that can gank at will, This is one if the core problems that eve has failed to address for almost two decades now. I recently saw a youtube streamer using something like 15 or 20 windows to gank other players. Just like cheating. No skill involved, just fleet warp and shoot on landing. ---
**Author:** ![Vokan\_Narkar](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vokan_narkar/32/326293_2.png) [@Vokan\_Narkar](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vokan_Narkar)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:35am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/23 "2023-01-30T09:35:33Z")
My daily cup of threads about ganking, thank you! But why so big wall of text when it could be just said in one word “remove ganking from game” ? ---
**Author:** ![Verlyn](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/verlyn/32/435163_2.png) [@Verlyn](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Verlyn)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/24 "2023-01-30T09:37:59Z")
Urgh, what the hell is it with all these anti-ganking softies showing up … So many games out there, they have to go pick on the ONE that stands out from the crowd … Just go play those games already and leave Everyone vs Everyone alone … ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/25 "2023-01-30T09:40:49Z")
Hm, that’s considered an import here so it is definitely in the “pricey” range. Whenever I go to the states though, I’ll add it to my list to try it. Thanks for the recommendation. ---
**Author:** ![Kuro\_Kanashimi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kuro_kanashimi/32/351894_2.png) [@Kuro\_Kanashimi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kuro_Kanashimi)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/26 "2023-01-30T09:42:01Z")
OP, You already mentioned NMS, I suggest you stick to that and not bother with EVE 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Gelf](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gelf/32/462608_2.png) [@Gelf](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gelf)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 9:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/27 "2023-01-30T09:43:26Z")
Look, the ganker doesn’t just appear out of nowhere with guns blazing. Usually there are signs. If you aren’t taking the precautions to help you avoid being ganked, then that is down to you. The ganker is trying to out maneuver you, so you need to out maneuver the ganker. This is part of the game. ---
**Author:** ![Yarda\_Black](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/yarda_black/32/373282_2.png) [@Yarda\_Black](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Yarda_Black)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 10:37am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/28 "2023-01-30T10:37:14Z")
I don’t think the OP is playing EVE online at all. ---
**Author:** ![Altara\_Zemara](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/altara_zemara/32/390110_2.png) [@Altara\_Zemara](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Altara_Zemara)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 10:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/29 "2023-01-30T10:48:48Z")
Yet another monotonous rant by someone with no killboard history whom we thus have no evidence has ever even played Eve. ---
**Author:** ![Fifie\_Brindacier](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fifie_brindacier/32/373279_2.png) [@Fifie\_Brindacier](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fifie_Brindacier)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/30 "2023-01-30T11:42:50Z")
> [@Qia\_Kare](#): > > The game only seems to become bitter for people who only care about the isk/hr as a measure of their progress more than whether they enjoy what they are doing. There are people who play for fun and entertainment and others who only play to win. Since there is no winnable endgame in EVE those people see isk amount/hr as a measure of win/loss. I cannot imagine the frustration that must bring but his rant is a foretaste of it. He wants for ships not to go _BOOM_ but that’s the very point of this game. He doesn’t seem to realize or care about the players who build the ships. He doesn’t even care about anyone’s opinion… How rude. > [@Qia\_Kare](#): > > if your net worth is what you objectively think is the measure of fun you’re having, why are you wasting some of your real net worth on a video game? That question makes too much sense. It looks like he’d rather rant. * * * ~Fifie reading EVE field manual. “Hey, but there’s nothing about ranting in here, sir” ---
**Author:** ![Namdor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namdor/32/396179_2.png) [@Namdor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namdor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 1:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/31 "2023-01-30T13:53:39Z")
While I agree that the game is stable, at best, from a PCU perspective, your analysis is clearly silly. These posts never reconcile their claims with the fact that PvP-anywhere has _always_ been a feature of Eve, including during its periods of greatest growth. ---
**Author:** ![Namdor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/namdor/32/396179_2.png) [@Namdor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Namdor)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 2:53pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/33 "2023-01-30T14:53:52Z")
> [@Drayden\_Roberts](#): > > As others have said CCP still get paid for this. More significantly, they almost certainly **prefer** to be paid for plex instead of a sub, given that they’re sold at a premium and can be consumed by other, non-subscription purchases. Anyone who thinks they’re going to go out of their way to make PLEX less attractive Vs. a subscription is deeply confused. The ability to redeem it for a sub is literally what underpins its value. ---
**Author:** ![Inaishite\_Teikei](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/inaishite_teikei/32/383275_2.png) [@Inaishite\_Teikei](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Inaishite_Teikei)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 3:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/34 "2023-01-30T15:39:35Z")
> [@Io\_Koval](#): > > So what is y’all’s favorite kind of wine. At first I read this as “what is y’all’s favorite kind of **whine** ” and thought you wanted to discuss which flavor of “ganking is killing EVE” threads we enjoy the most. I think I like the ones that pretend to be all positive and constructive and just trying to help the game at first, but then break down into anger and crying about open PvP existing in an open PvP game. But the entitled “I’m paying for this game, so I should be immortal and win all the time” that the OP represents is a great one too. ---
**Author:** ![Io\_Koval](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/io_koval/32/282426_2.png) [@Io\_Koval](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Io_Koval)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 3:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/35 "2023-01-30T15:48:20Z")
Yes, I’m familiar with that varietal, although I find the taste too salty for me. There’s some YouTube videos of 2011-era vintage salt whines which could probably hold up to today’s. I’m not a sommelier by any means but I find anything too acidic means the next day I’ll not feel great after drinking it. I know it’s not acidity – reds are less acidic than whites – but something correlated about there being more acid in a red just leads to the next day being miserable. That’s why when I find a good red, I am very happy. ---
**Author:** ![Inaishite\_Teikei](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/inaishite_teikei/32/383275_2.png) [@Inaishite\_Teikei](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Inaishite_Teikei)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 4:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/36 "2023-01-30T16:01:51Z")
I think I’ve had too many mild, sour-sweet “won’t somebody please think of the new players” ones recently, so I appreciate the harsher, more distinct flavor here, although perhaps still a tad too passive-aggressive for my tastes - all the pretending not to care what others think leaves a bad aftertaste. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 4:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/37 "2023-01-30T16:06:42Z")
Catering to new players is what kills the game. In the end, CCP will be left with new players who don’t like the game, and all the people who actually played the game will be long gone. ---
**Author:** ![Mindahouf\_Davaham](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mindahouf_davaham/32/379996_2.png) [@Mindahouf\_Davaham](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mindahouf_Davaham)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 4:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/38 "2023-01-30T16:19:31Z")
Finally I can post again and checked zkill this person does not even have a zkill ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Epeen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mr_epeen/32/373308_2.png) [@Mr\_Epeen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mr_Epeen)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 4:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/39 "2023-01-30T16:50:52Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > Catering to new players CODE is what kills the game. fixt Mr Epeen 🕶 ---
**Author:** ![cyraxthehated\_Metesur](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cyraxthehated_metesur/32/409997_2.png) [@cyraxthehated\_Metesur](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/cyraxthehated_Metesur)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 4:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/40 "2023-01-30T16:52:37Z")
Getting fat from all this popcorn, meh, another self entitled thread. Gets soda… ---
**Author:** ![T\_Elliot](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/t_elliot/32/453851_2.png) [@T\_Elliot](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/T_Elliot)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 5:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694/41 "2023-01-30T17:33:28Z")
> [@Ha\_Kar\_Ma\_Gor](#): > > This is one if the core problems that eve has failed to address for almost two decades now. I recently saw a youtube streamer using something like 15 or 20 windows to gank other players. Just like cheating. No skill involved, just fleet warp and shoot on landing. If you are caught by someone multiboxing, you messed up. Part of this game (the part that always keeps me coming back to it) is that you always have something on the line when you play. Players need to pay attention to your surroundings. Players need to watch local and D-scan. Players who are not prepared to fight need to learn to run away like crazy squirrels when the cats come. There is nothing wrong with being prey. Brer Rabbit enjoyed himself at the expense of the wolf and bear. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-isnt-dying-but-it-isnt-growing-my-answer-that-devs-wont-recognize/393694.md?page=3)