# EVE Online Ecosystem Outlook **URL:** \ **Category:** Dev Blogs\ **Tags:** official, devblog\ **Created:** [March 30, 2020, 6:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809 "2020-03-30T18:10:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 1:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/762 "2021-03-21T13:37:28Z")
> [@SKAfan](#): > > it will create scarcity as moons was for long time in eve the number 1 reason why wars was wage I think you mean number 1 reason for blue doughnut stagnation as they make a trade agreement. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2021, 2:23pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/763 "2021-03-22T14:23:53Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > Consider - 5 million ISK to move up to 500,000m3 of cargo, from any one of and only the four Empire trade hubs to any one of and only the other three trade hubs. If the player wants to move 10m3 of cargo - same fee, 5 million ISK. This would allow players to spread out a bit more and reduce the necessity of Jita with out creating significant impact upon price discovery differences based upon geography. Two issues that I see with this: 1. Freighters exist for this 2. This would remove unique market differences between the trade hubs, linking them all to jita sell/buy/supply/demand for very little cost. Part of what makes EVE unique is that regions and distances _matter._ This directly couples all the 4 top markets into one big market. And also takes away the opportunity for players to profitably haul between market hubs with their freighter. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 10:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/764 "2021-03-23T10:56:55Z")
Gerard Freighters: Although they exist, the fact that Jita volume is many times greater than any other trade hub shows that they are not being utilized to distribute goods to other trade hubs but instead being used to transport to and from Jita at the consumption level and not the distribution level. It is clearly more cost effective to transport to Jita. It could very well be that freighters are part of why one hub is so dominant. Market Differences: Nonsense. Price differences between hubs is rather small. Clearly arbitrage opportunities are exploited where they exist. If they were not, the differences would be much larger. The point is to spread players out. The way to do that is to reduce the advantage of having one giant super space wal-mart at Jita 4-4. If all four trade hubs had the same prices, and transport of goods between those hubs was quick, cheap and safe, then Jita would have no reason to be as dominant. The two issues you have are part of why Jita is dominant and not the solution. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/765 "2021-03-23T18:25:42Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > If all four trade hubs had the same prices, and transport of goods between those hubs was quick, cheap and safe, then Jita would have no reason to be as dominant. The Hubs are not CCP made. They are player made, there are also more than 4 hubs. So… If you are creating a super easy safe transport option, then it is not hub to hub, it is highsec to highsec. Now see the issue? ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/766 "2021-03-23T18:54:54Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > They are player made … > Now see the issue? You get an award for stating the obvious. And no, I don’t see your issue, just noise. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2021, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/767 "2021-03-23T18:58:48Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > And no, I don’t see your issue So you have no issue with cheap, quick, safe, NPC transport between any two highsec systems of goods? Just making sure I understand what you are saying. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 11:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/768 "2021-03-24T11:47:16Z")
What I am saying is, if there is a desire to reduce Jita dominance, then what makes it dominant has to be distributed or destroyed. Distribution would be more constructive. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 6:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/769 "2021-03-24T18:56:55Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > Distribution would be more constructive. But will cheap safe transport reduce Jita dominance or increase it since it would be trivial to get goods to Jita as an initial point of sale. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/770 "2021-03-24T19:08:02Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > But will cheap safe transport reduce Jita dominance or increase it since it would be trivial to get goods to Jita as an initial point of sale. If being at anyone of the other three trade hubs were the same as being at Jita it self, why travel all the way to Jita? ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/771 "2021-03-24T19:10:35Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > why travel all the way to Jita? Volume = availability of rarer goods. Or of the bulk you want. So buyers go to Jita. Which means more buyers = sellers go there to move goods faster. That’s the feedback loop that has caused Jita to keep growing, and Cheap transport does not break that loop. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/772 "2021-03-24T19:50:21Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > Cheap transport does not break that loop. And you base that assumption upon what? ---
**Author:** ![Vortigern\_Vitalis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/vortigern_vitalis/32/455600_2.png) [@Vortigern\_Vitalis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Vortigern_Vitalis)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/773 "2021-03-24T19:50:46Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > But will cheap safe transport reduce Jita dominance or increase it since it would be trivial to get goods to Jita as an initial point of sale. I think you are right that it would only increase Jita’s dominance, given that the routes into Jita remain the most heavily ganked, yet people still take the risk to buy and sell there. (I know that some areas closer to Amarr, such as Ohide, are attracting a fair bit of predatory activity, but even then that is arguably still Jita related as it is along the “post Niarja” long arc to Jita.) Provide a risk free option for getting stuff to and from Jita, and surely it will only boost its dominance further. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/774 "2021-03-24T19:54:39Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > And you base that assumption upon what? On the assumption of basic logic? To break the loop, surely it would need to have impact on the loop, which… it doesn’t. I am not claiming it will increase Jita’s dominance, but I am saying it is possible since it doesn’t interfere with the basic loop which creates a single dominant market hub. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 7:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/775 "2021-03-24T19:59:29Z")
Ok, so just a rehash of what you said before. Whatevah ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2021, 8:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/776 "2021-03-24T20:04:55Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > Ok, so just a rehash of what you said before. So… given you are claiming it would break Jita, the burden of proof is actually on you to show how this will break Jita’s dominance. And by show I don’t mean ‘Cheap transport means all the hubs are the same’ because I’ve already addressed how the volume of Jita makes it more desirable even if all the hubs are the same price. I mean really show. ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2021, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/777 "2021-03-25T12:45:51Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > the burden of proof is actually on you The burden of proof is indeed upon me. However the need to prove anything to you is not. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2021, 1:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/778 "2021-03-30T13:03:28Z")
> [@Adunh\_Slavy](#): > > The point is to spread players out. The way to do that is to reduce the advantage of having one giant super space wal-mart at Jita 4-4. If all four trade hubs had the same prices, and transport of goods between those hubs was quick, cheap and safe, then Jita would have no reason to be as dominant. Why not go even further? Synchronise _all_ markets and completely eliminate the need for transportation. Then players could spread out to the furthest regions of New Eden and never be without the comfort of a nearby market to buy new ships or sell loot. It would spread out all players and remove most of Jita’s dominance. What do you say? ---
**Author:** ![Adunh\_Slavy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adunh_slavy/32/265310_2.png) [@Adunh\_Slavy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adunh_Slavy)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2021, 5:56pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/780 "2021-03-30T17:56:10Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > It would spread out all players and remove most of Jita’s dominance. What do you say? I’d say you’re over reacting and missing the point. ---
**Author:** ![Chupa-Chups\_Haginen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/chupa-chups_haginen/32/265908_2.png) [@Chupa-Chups\_Haginen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Chupa-Chups_Haginen)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2021, 3:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/781 "2021-04-06T15:27:54Z")
there is a catastrophic lack of ice. increase the frequency of its occurrence. don’t kill small corporations ---
**Author:** ![Elwha\_Lynx](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/elwha_lynx/32/246048_2.png) [@Elwha\_Lynx](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Elwha_Lynx)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2021, 3:13pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809/782 "2021-04-07T15:13:20Z")
Not really…been months now and prices of derived products have increased only about 20%–if that. Groups do need to be more flexible and be sure to mine when they have the opportunity. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809.md?page=36) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-online-ecosystem-outlook/228809.md?page=38)