# EVE PVP - an epiphany **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [September 10, 2018, 1:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284 "2018-09-10T01:50:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mayhaw_morgan/32/412682_2.png) [@Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mayhaw_Morgan)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/21 "2018-09-14T18:57:08Z")
What good does information about an unfitted, unpiloted ship do me? ---
**Author:** ![March\_rabbit](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/march_rabbit/32/453160_2.png) [@March\_rabbit](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/March_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 9:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/22 "2018-09-14T21:01:17Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > If youve ever actually done some PVP, you would know that you **dont know until youve engaged.** If a ship has kitey bonuses, it can still be a brawler fit. Even with drone bonuses, it can be a neuting ship. You never know until you engage. > > ![](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khergit_deserters/40/95136_1.png) Khergit\_Deserters: > > > How would anybody know? Except for careful education/study, or the words of a beneficient benefactor. It’s like being in a WWII submarine, and plotting plans toward risky combats. > > **Right click on enemy ship and click “show info”.** Parts marked bold contradict each other. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 3:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/23 "2018-09-15T03:39:39Z")
> [@March\_rabbit](#): > > Parts marked bold contradict each other. No, they dont. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 3:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/24 "2018-09-15T03:39:54Z")
> [@Mayhaw\_Morgan](#): > > What good does information about an unfitted, unpiloted ship do me? Well, this is what Khergit Deserters is having trouble with. ---
**Author:** ![Markus\_Reinhart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/markus_reinhart/32/133706_2.png) [@Markus\_Reinhart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Markus_Reinhart)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 9:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/25 "2018-09-15T09:08:50Z")
The reason most people don’t solo pvp is that they are inherently ■■■■ at this game. Being part of a large alliance (preferably the largest there is, also the one that is already on the winning side) means that they can boast about how awesome they are, especially to themselves, while hiding their shittiness. No really good pvper would ever want to be part of a massive alliance and be in the main fleet as a “grunt” . ---
**Author:** ![Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mayhaw_morgan/32/412682_2.png) [@Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mayhaw_Morgan)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 3:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/26 "2018-09-15T15:35:22Z")
> [@Markus\_Reinhart](#): > > No really good pvper would ever want to be part of a massive alliance and Calling the weaponized lemmings in null security space “grunts” is quite an insult to grunts. Just saying . . . ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 8:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/27 "2018-09-15T20:42:04Z")
Op, you have never played a MOBA right? ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/28 "2018-09-15T21:38:05Z")
> [@Markus\_Reinhart](#): > > The reason most people don’t solo pvp is that they are inherently ■■■■ at this game. Being part of a large alliance (preferably the largest there is, also the one that is already on the winning side) means that they can boast about how awesome they are, especially to themselves, while hiding their shittiness. Well, no. Im in a large alliance cause i want to make isk and fly with my friends. It makes it easier to make a lot of isk if you are in a sov holding nullsec corp, with access to mining and ratting in nullsec with relative safety. I have alts. Plenty of them. That i play as solo, and in small pvp gangs. Its not always solo = good, because everyone picks up on how to PVP when they join fleets. Its certainly harder to PVP alone because being outnumbered 30 to 1 isnt a situation that you can always escape from, no matter how good you are. And it takes skill to FC a fleet too. > [@Markus\_Reinhart](#): > > No really good pvper would ever want to be part of a massive alliance and be in the main fleet as a “grunt” . I consider Rooks and Kings as being amazing players, and they play in groups. Most people, even the really good PVPers, have some sort of affiliation with groups because they want to make isk and want to enjoy this game with friends. Its the whole MMO part of the MMORPG aspect of EVE online. Its more enjoyable to play with friends. Why dont you try it sometime? ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 9:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/29 "2018-09-15T21:39:00Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > Op, you have never played a MOBA right? Real pros play 1v5. You see, all the tournaments, are shitty noobs, cause they all play 5v5. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 9:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/30 "2018-09-15T21:45:29Z")
I obviously ask because OP seems to think that players don’t want or can memorize the stats or basic role of ships, and yet some of the most popular games out there you need to memorize multiple skills, strategies and possible builds of 100+ heroes to master. I just think he is projecting his own shortcomings on everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Markus\_Reinhart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/markus_reinhart/32/133706_2.png) [@Markus\_Reinhart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Markus_Reinhart)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/31 "2018-09-15T22:41:42Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > I consider Rooks and Kings as being amazing players, and they play in groups. Most people, even the really good PVPers, have some sort of affiliation with groups because they want to make isk and want to enjoy this game with friends. R&K is not a massive alliance, it has no grunts. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/32 "2018-09-15T23:47:34Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > I obviously ask because OP seems to think that players don’t want or can memorize the stats or basic role of ships, and yet some of the most popular games out there you need to memorize multiple skills, strategies and possible builds of 100+ heroes to master. > > I just think he is projecting his own shortcomings on everyone else. Apparently those guys are all just submarine commanders with years of tactical experience. No way that a mere 16 year old child could remember all those things. ---
**Author:** ![Solonius\_Rex](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/solonius_rex/32/388172_2.png) [@Solonius\_Rex](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Solonius_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 11:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/33 "2018-09-15T23:48:53Z")
> [@Markus\_Reinhart](#): > > R&K is not a massive alliance, it has no grunts. “Massive” is relative. They have 120 members, almost all active, which is a very large, if not massive amount of players, considering the average active players in a normal corp. ---
**Author:** ![Markus\_Reinhart](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/markus_reinhart/32/133706_2.png) [@Markus\_Reinhart](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Markus_Reinhart)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 1:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/34 "2018-09-16T01:47:06Z")
yeah that’s not massive, you’ll have to come up with a better example. I’m sure you’re intelligent enough to understand this, yes? ---
**Author:** ![Tainui\_Tauranijken1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tainui_tauranijken1/32/123883_2.png) [@Tainui\_Tauranijken1](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Tainui_Tauranijken1)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 3:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/35 "2018-09-16T03:36:39Z")
> [@Ima\_Wreckyou](#): > > I obviously ask because OP seems to think that players don’t want or can memorize the stats or basic role of ships, and yet some of the most popular games out there you need to memorize multiple skills, strategies and possible builds of 100+ heroes to master. I’m quite new and I find it both a little daunting and absolutely fascinating. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Khergit\_Deserters](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khergit_deserters/32/319315_2.png) [@Khergit\_Deserters](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khergit_Deserters)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 7:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/36 "2018-09-16T19:28:59Z")
I didn’t say that Eve solo PVP is bad, or that I hate it. My point was that it doesn’t have the intuitive feel of arcadey fighting, or even flight sim fighting. So it’s only going to appeal to a certain type of person. ---
**Author:** ![Ima\_Wreckyou](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ima_wreckyou/32/235531_2.png) [@Ima\_Wreckyou](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ima_Wreckyou)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/37 "2018-09-16T19:46:18Z")
Yeah, EVE is not an arcade or simulation game. There are such games and if you rather play those go for it. There are however quite a lot of people who like the way PvP in EVE works, including solo PvP. Also the difficulty is not to know all those ships and be the best pilot in EVE, but to just be better than your opponent, which is rather easy most of the time because most people are really bad at EVE. ---
**Author:** ![Khergit\_Deserters](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/khergit_deserters/32/319315_2.png) [@Khergit\_Deserters](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Khergit_Deserters)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2018, 1:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/38 "2018-09-17T01:46:11Z")
Well, I don’t really give a gobsmack about it, do I? Ye word twisters can carry on for as many ages as you want to. Eve pvp is fooking otaku/technical, crazy counter-intuitive, and if you want to play it, go ahead. Satisfied-like, biotches? Bob, just say something that is something like a thought, or shut yer gobs… Sheet or get yer arses off of the pot. ---
**Author:** ![Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mayhaw_morgan/32/412682_2.png) [@Mayhaw\_Morgan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mayhaw_Morgan)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2018, 3:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/39 "2018-09-17T03:22:43Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > Its more enjoyable to play with friends. Spare us the dogma. I wouldn’t play EVE with my actual friends. And, I wouldn’t necessarily enjoy it more if I did. Do you think masturbation is more enjoyable with your friends too? This is exactly the kind of mentality that takes the game’s development in a ruinous direction. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2018, 9:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284/40 "2018-09-17T09:09:23Z")
> [@Solonius\_Rex](#): > > ts more enjoyable to play with friends. Why dont you try it sometime? Because I have a “caustic personality”, apparently ☹ [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-pvp-an-epiphany/105284.md?page=3)