# EVE will always be a nichè Game **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 8, 2021, 8:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186 "2021-03-08T08:43:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 3:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/162 "2021-03-20T15:58:41Z")
Interesting. I bring up the fact that you ignored over a dozen points, and you ignore _that_ and return back to Triglavians. Sorry bud but this isn’t how you convince people of things. ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_4-2-01](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dan_4-2-01/32/258310_2.png) [@Dan\_4-2-01](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dan_4-2-01)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 4:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/163 "2021-03-20T16:59:22Z")
yea u are right but u cant really compare the dumbing down of eve and wow eve still has alot of its core features while wow got to a pure pay to win level, u can buy equipment in the shop which is always better than the equipment u can get ingame and the gear gets stronger with ur level, the npcs are now easy as hell even a retarded chernobyl fish could play it, crafting items has no use anymore (back in the day u needed to craft alot of stuff for raids and pvp) and dont forget the removal of world pvp because the massive use of sharding, now u have to travel into a extra sharded pvp world to do that… almost the same stupid crap they done to ultima online back in the day, but i could also start talkin about swg but then i will start crying! also if u believe some sources modern wow lost like 70% of its active playerbase and most of em came back with classic or were playing on vanilla privateservers i dont think eve did lose that huge numbers of players. sure i remember that the game once had a daily player number of 50-60k players but 20-30k isnt dead and if u compare it to other mmos its still a wonderfull population (for a megaserver) but yea u are right the time everyone went crazy on that mobile phone stuff mmos really started to go bad… i just hope for star citizen now maybe it will change something but for that they need to release the game first lmao ---
**Author:** ![hellokittyonline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/hellokittyonline/32/244672_2.png) [@hellokittyonline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/hellokittyonline)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 6:30pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/164 "2021-03-20T18:30:41Z")
Eve does not have many or really any of its core features in tact. High Sec is bubble wrapped beyond belief, nullsec is a krabbing cesspool and low sec is dead. The OP is pretty close to being right. The main thing people miss is that alpha and skill injectors weren’t meant to bring new players. CCP knows they’re too lazy to do the work to retain new players. Instead these functions were added for the BOTS that prop up PLEX prices which attracts more WHALES. CCP has completely sold out. Just like Blizzard. Just like GGG. CCP makes way too much money off bots and whales to give a ■■■■ about the average player. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 6:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/165 "2021-03-20T18:59:26Z")
OFC eve will always be a niche game look at fighting games , you can explain the games to anyone in 10 seconds , and yet they are niche games because they are hard now take eve , its hard and complex , NICHE GAME, no doubt but there are some types here and there trying to take the characteristics of the game that make it unique , eve lasted for more than a decade because it is unique , not because it is accessible ---
**Author:** ![Noori\_Naarian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noori_naarian/32/261285_2.png) [@Noori\_Naarian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noori_Naarian)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/166 "2021-03-20T20:10:14Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > I think its a myth that the “new gamers” are any different from the old gamers. As a designer i can tell you, this is very much note the case. That being said there is some other unthought of point in the population of eve and why its been substantially low over the years, for reasons i have pointed out many times on these forums In essence, complexity and hardware requirements dictate the max potential population a game can have. To high of either and you kill your population, and they higher (or more prevalent) the two, the lower the population of the game. For this reason (ie, that these two conditions reduce game potential population) the population of eve has what we can call a “smaller ocean” to fish from. On top of this you have the issue that some people do not tolerate pvp abuse well, one of the points ccp seems to be very stuck on while it peddles the dark triad of personalities. This is why its vital for eve to find ways to reduce the complexity in eve, and a way to give people a harbor from that abuse. Hence why noori is a genius designer 100 years a head of any ccp employee and why his positions could not only save eve and ccp, but revitalize it. Yet we have this persistent demand from ccp to stick to that said dark triad and damage their own game, and its company while lying about player concurrent players to make said delusion seem like fact. Its very basic and very easy to understand. Lots of people = lots of money and lots of longevity. CCP is milking a very small audience ignorant of the fact that their income is already limited, no matter how many of these systems you have you will never substantially improve the baseline (income or population). So the hope for eve really is to stop with these nonsensical positions and start trying new things, things that have not been repeated for decades and proven not to work (in terms of revitalizing the game). ---
**Author:** ![Noori\_Naarian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noori_naarian/32/261285_2.png) [@Noori\_Naarian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noori_Naarian)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/167 "2021-03-20T20:11:02Z")
> [@tutucox\_Khamsi](#): > > OFC eve will always be a niche game This really seems like a cop-out statement of delusion. How is it niche? Because its a pvp game? because its a sandbox? hate to break it to you but these are very common things (and increasing in frequency), and that is not what a niche game is. ---
**Author:** ![Nana\_Skalski](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nana_skalski/32/489985_2.png) [@Nana\_Skalski](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nana_Skalski)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/168 "2021-03-20T20:14:40Z")
It is niche because it is not appealing to masses of players, new and old. There is a spot where game is pretty easy to understand but hard to master. EVE is not such game. Its both hard to understand and very hard to master. With WIS they really had a chance to appeal to wider audience. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/169 "2021-03-20T20:21:40Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > How is it niche? eve is not supposed to be pleasant , eve is not supposed to be fun , eve is not supposed to be simple, eve is not supposed to be accessible so whats eve has going for? the setting , eve have a cool space setting and lore , comparable to great scifi setings like dune but at the heart eve is freedom ![Captura de Tela 2021-03-20 às 17.29.07](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/7/5/e/75e368737da5f0313165ef75a9c024787642bee8.jpeg) one can be immersed in the sandbox and do what he wants , eve is a full fledged fantasy world that let the players be anything they are prepared and put the effort to … eve is not > [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > appealing to masses of players, new and old. europa universalis will always be a niche game who will learn all that ■■■■ but imagine if you have to convince a lot of other players in wtf to do to take every turn … MOAR niche ---
**Author:** ![Noori\_Naarian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noori_naarian/32/261285_2.png) [@Noori\_Naarian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noori_Naarian)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/170 "2021-03-20T20:39:04Z")
> [@tutucox\_Khamsi](#): > > eve is not supposed to be pleasant , eve is not supposed to be fun , eve is not supposed to be simple, eve is not supposed to be accessible This sounds like the way you are defining it, not ccp. > [@tutucox\_Khamsi](#): > > one can be immersed in the sandbox and do what he wants , Like living in high sec and not being ganked? Seems like a single sided standard. ---
**Author:** ![tutucox\_Khamsi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/tutucox_khamsi/32/430743_2.png) [@tutucox\_Khamsi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/tutucox_Khamsi)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:40pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/171 "2021-03-20T20:40:24Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > Like living in high sec and not being ganked? yeah if you really put the effort ---
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 8:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/172 "2021-03-20T20:49:58Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > the dark triad of personalities. Newsflash: **Everyone** , every living human being, from your best friend to Mother Theresa, has Dark Triad traits. > [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > So the hope for eve really is to stop with these nonsensical positions and start trying new things, things that have not been repeated for decades and proven not to work (in terms of revitalizing the game). EVE is literally one of the longest running MMORPGs. Clearly something was done right. ---
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 9:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/173 "2021-03-20T21:05:07Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > This sounds like the way you are defining it, not ccp. Ahem: ![ccpwrangler](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/4/c/64c7b74d33f140746d78b0c792f6f9e0750e5c01.png) ---
**Author:** ![Merin\_Ryskin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/merin_ryskin/32/259354_2.png) [@Merin\_Ryskin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Merin_Ryskin)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 10:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/174 "2021-03-20T22:03:54Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > Hence why noori is a genius designer 100 years a head of any ccp employee and why his positions could not only save eve and ccp, but revitalize it. Forgot to post this from your Neeri alt? ---
**Author:** ![Avaelica\_Kuershin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/avaelica_kuershin/32/478139_2.png) [@Avaelica\_Kuershin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Avaelica_Kuershin)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 10:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/175 "2021-03-20T22:50:41Z")
> [@Noori\_Naarian](#): > > Hence why noori is a genius designer 100 years a head of any ccp employee and why his positions could not only save eve and ccp This, here, is why most of us can’t take you seriously. There is a place for complexity and danger (from other players) in games just as there is a place for transparency (of mechanics) and certainty of outcome… Some other games have arguably far greater complexity, to the point where addons are desired to successfully complete group content, but have larger populations than EVE. One such game is also notorious for RNG to the point where engaging in group PVP gives a more certain path to gearing up. ---
**Author:** ![Engerr](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/engerr/32/250002_2.png) [@Engerr](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Engerr)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2021, 11:35pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/176 "2021-03-20T23:35:10Z")
That’s an interesting conversation, but you forgot that EVE is a game in “maintence mode”, it’s not like Path of Exile where whole company is focused on one game, now CCP is making mmorpgfps. Devs said long time ago something like “whatever we develop the player count is on the same level” and they stopped developing it. ---
**Author:** ![Daichi\_Yamato](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/daichi_yamato/32/252995_2.png) [@Daichi\_Yamato](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Daichi_Yamato)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 12:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/177 "2021-03-21T00:49:02Z")
> [@Nana\_Skalski](#): > > With time EVE became more hard especially for completely new player That’s an…_interesting_ opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 12:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/178 "2021-03-21T00:59:26Z")
No, that’s correct. It’s just that the underlying reason for this is that the “new player” has become dumber over time. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Epeen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mr_epeen/32/373308_2.png) [@Mr\_Epeen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mr_Epeen)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 1:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/179 "2021-03-21T01:47:18Z")
> [@Destiny\_Corrupted](#): > > It’s just that the underlying reason for this is that the “new player” has become dumber over time. I remember this new player way back in 2007 that was so dumb he was almost a week in before realizing he should start a skill training. Hard to get much dumber than that. No, Destiny. People are the same amount of dumb now as they always have been. It’s your attitude toward new players that’s changed. Mr Epeen 🕶 ---
**Author:** ![Noori\_Naarian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noori_naarian/32/261285_2.png) [@Noori\_Naarian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noori_Naarian)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 2:11am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/180 "2021-03-21T02:11:55Z")
> [@Xuixien](#): > > Newsflash: **Everyone** , every living human being, from your best friend to Mother Theresa, has Dark Triad traits. News flash some of us do not seek to exploit and manipulate mankind into madness and extreme levels of depression. Not everyone in this world see’s a sick, injured animal on the side of the road and things “lets torment it”. Ccp peddles false metric data, or half truths to try to turn every player into a full time dark-triad individual almost like they are seeking to draw a paralel in the game to the real world as if the only way to get a head is to be one of the sick twisted individuals that harm everything they come across. In essence that form of thinking is the reason we have had wars in the middle east, or oppression abroad by the hands of things like interest. The simple truth is we do not need to behave like that, and we are not inclined and naturally designed to function that way. That in essence is the heart of traits that people with damaged mindsets employ. No, we as a species can look around and see the oppression and do something about it rising each other from the horrible states that such thinking has been inflicted on mankind since its begining. Do better, instead of propagating nonsense. Just because we have “moments” does not mean we are defined by those, we are human after all and the beauty of us as a species is that we we can rise above the level of angels, or fall below the level of animals. If you want to employ yourself to service of yourself, do that, however i choose to employ myself in service to others, to the light of mankind and the betterment of a species (and who knows, maybe some day, somewhere in the universe another(s) species)). ---
**Author:** ![Noori\_Naarian](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/noori_naarian/32/261285_2.png) [@Noori\_Naarian](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Noori_Naarian)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2021, 2:13am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186/181 "2021-03-21T02:13:06Z")
Quoting 2007 where the game has had mechanical changes that have long fought the very essence of that statement to prove yourself right after an employee long has passed from this company. Desperation is the only word that comes to mind. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186.md?page=8) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eve-will-always-be-a-niche-game/299186.md?page=10)