# Eve's War Dec Groups and who are they **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [March 22, 2022, 7:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828 "2022-03-22T07:36:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Wes\_Wyhunnan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wes_wyhunnan/32/409400_2.png) [@Wes\_Wyhunnan](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wes_Wyhunnan)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 3:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/41 "2022-03-24T03:38:16Z")
> [@Faylee\_Freir](#): > > This is incorrect. Read above. It is correct, as I read above. We had 0 structures outside of WH space, and we were war decc’d. we were not the aggressor. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 3:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/42 "2022-03-24T03:40:34Z")
Githany did ask if a war HQ can be anywhere, and the answer to that is that no, it _has_ to be in high-sec. “War eligibility” structures can be anywhere, however. ---
**Author:** ![Faylee\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/faylee_freir/32/439750_2.png) [@Faylee\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Faylee_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 5:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/43 "2022-03-24T05:17:11Z")
> [@Wes\_Wyhunnan](#): > > It is correct, as I read above. We had 0 structures outside of WH space, and we were war decc’d. we were not the aggressor. Githany was asking specifically about WarHQs. In order to declare war on someone the structure tied to the war HAS to be in Highsec. Your structures weren’t WarHQs because they weren’t in Highsec. All your structures did was make you eligible for war to be declared against you. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 6:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/44 "2022-03-24T06:38:15Z")
Ok so you could be allied in a war with a Poco , which could be anywhere , supposed that’s something How about a rule that over 5 war Dec’s every war after that mean they are auto open for allies, would that work? ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 6:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/45 "2022-03-24T06:48:59Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > How about a rule that over 5 war Dec’s every war after that mean they are auto open for allies, would that work? What do you mean? All receiving entities are already open to allies. You just have to hit a toggle, and then accept corporations/alliances who send ally offers. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 6:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/46 "2022-03-24T06:57:23Z")
Many give up or play on an alt Dracvlad said he asked people to open up for allies , most said not bothered or don’t want to antagonise the war decer any more. But if it opens automatically after 5 it could get around the apathy many have to wars , and I know you will say why brother to protect people who don’t care , you have a point but just thinking about making it easier to fight and for longer . ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 7:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/47 "2022-03-24T07:22:17Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > But if it opens automatically after 5 it could get around the apathy many have to wars , and I know you will say why brother to protect people who don’t care , you have a point but just thinking about making it easier to fight and for longer . The whole ally system is stupid and should never have been implemented. It bastardizes the original concept of wars as implemented by CCP. We have a system in which attackers must pay a fee, and that’s fine. But what can happen is that attackers pay a fee, then the defenders all switch corporations, and open their original corporation for war allies. Then the attackers end up having to fight players they never intended to fight, while the players they _did_ intend to fight, _and paid to do so,_ are entirely unreachable. If wars need to be paid for, _everyone_ should have to pay for them equally, or no one should pay at all. Even though I used the system for my personal benefit, I believe it’s a really bad system, and enabling CCP to think that it’s working by participating in it due to lack of better choice does more harm than good. At least being war-eligible is a requirement for allies. That’s the sole saving grace to be found here. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 7:30am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/49 "2022-03-24T07:30:45Z")
> [@Faylee\_Freir](#): > > So I wouldn’t know but everyone says that Highsec mining isn’t worth doing but I bet if you pulled up the MER that you’d find The Forge, Lonetrek, and The Citadel holding their own in amount mined. Mining is going to be fine, people need those low level ores, I am wondering about the rest of the process, compressing in an Orca has already removed one requirement to have a structure. The players I am with, all were doing indy in hisec, but now not one has a structure in hisec. There is of course NPC stations. > [@Faylee\_Freir](#): > > Not being rude but what you just said is what I was shouting back when CCP Burger gave that wardec presentation - when everyone grabbed their pitch forks. It’s true now and it was true then… the overwhelming majority of our targets are the result of blanket decs where we opportunistically camp the hubs and pipes. These targets absolutely overwhelmingly belong to a Nullsec group. I know you are not being rude, but that is what you blew up, what you do not see was those hisec players not logging in and not returning. You do not see the whole picture. Yes you blew up mainly nullsec players but you had wars against hisec entities that produced zero kills and there was a reason for that. > [@Faylee\_Freir](#): > > The PowerPoint presentation pointed to 5 main culprits responsible for 90% of the carnage. If you go back and look at those groups then you’d find that every single one were blanket war dec’d group whose wars overwhelmingly consisted of Nullsec groups. Targets of opportunity. Not some focused campaign against industrialists in Highsec. Guess who the loudest whiners were? Nullsec. I knew several nullsec industrialists doing indy in hisec, they used out of alliance alts and indy corps with structures. At this point I would think that the only thing they do in hisec is mine the low ends, compress it and export it. So at this point you can’t touch them. > [@Faylee\_Freir](#): > > Look at what happens when Nullsec comes to Highsec to fight. They hate it. Kane is 100% right in that between confusing mechanics and engagement rules, it’s just not their cup of tea. So it’s no surprise that Nullsec groups hate Highsec and wardecs. They can’t stand that they have to deal with them when and if they come to Highsec. They rely heavily on bubbles and caps, most doctrines cannot spread points like hisec doctrines. They have to fight a different way. > [@Githany\_Red](#): > > Can a war HQ or war eligible structure be in null or in a WH. A war HQ no, but an eligible structure can be anywhere in Eve. A War HQ has to be in hisec. > [@Githany\_Red](#): > > Ok so you could be allied in a war with a Poco , which could be anywhere , supposed that’s something Yes you can use that to ally in on wars. The ally system is great, I find it rather telling that Destiny hates it. ---
**Author:** ![Faylee\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/faylee_freir/32/439750_2.png) [@Faylee\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Faylee_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 7:43am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/50 "2022-03-24T07:43:28Z")
> [@Githany\_Red](#): > > How about a rule that over 5 war Dec’s every war after that mean they are auto open for allies, would that work? I think that assisting in wars is fairly low on what is broken. To Dracs point, I do wish that Crimewatch was equipped to allow remote assistance between parties with mutual enemies / timers. Example: Group A and Group B are friends. They both declare war against Group C. Group C gets in a fight with Group B and because Group A is at war with Group C as well, they can provide logi and such to their friends in Group B. Another thing to consider is that if we have 6 wars, our enemies may not want assistance. They may not want people jumping in because they may want to attempt to log off trap or jump us themselves. —- So really instead of ham fisting more nonsensical rules that further confuse already confusing mechanics… why not just fix remote assistance? This way everyone has their cards out on the table with structures at risk… the difference now is that (and I’m sure what you’re searching to have happen) you can create a coalition that opposes the large groups of Highsec war dec players and shows up to big fights and timers. Our joint fleets would be much more fun and interesting with our blues if we could provide remote assistance to each other. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 7:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/51 "2022-03-24T07:50:53Z")
Thanks for seeing that, it was important to defenders to be able to do combined fleets and CCP destroyed that option. For defenders however it is a very high on the list of issues, in my view the number one issue. It is why in fact any attempt to gang up was thwarted and the possibility of fun large fights around structures stillborn, all to the detriment of the game. ---
**Author:** ![Destiny\_Corrupted](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/destiny_corrupted/32/411527_2.png) [@Destiny\_Corrupted](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Destiny_Corrupted)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 7:51am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/52 "2022-03-24T07:51:36Z")
Neutral RR always favored larger groups more, not only because of the N+1 consideration, but because as group size goes up, the amount of available friends/allies grows exponentially. Neutral RR was fun to use to bait targets into taking fights that they perceived as extremely favorable, but it was a very unbalanced system. Now, neutral boosting on the other hand, acted as a sort of equalizer between smaller and larger groups, and probably should’ve stayed in the game. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 10:03am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/53 "2022-03-24T10:03:17Z")
If we remove Githany and Dracvlad from this discussion, it will be more straight-forward with less exaggerated red herring inaccuracies. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2022, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/55 "2022-03-24T18:58:47Z")
> [@Aiko\_Danuja](#): > > If we remove Githany and Dracvlad from this discussion, it will be more straight-forward with less exaggerated red herring inaccuracies. Well watching Drac lie makes me cackle 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Xuixien](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/xuixien/32/416896_2.png) [@Xuixien](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Xuixien)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 1:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/56 "2022-03-27T01:29:31Z")
If you have structures in HiSec, you should be wardeccable, periods. Regardless of whether the aggressor has structures. ---
**Author:** ![Zaera\_Keena](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zaera_keena/32/449938_2.png) [@Zaera\_Keena](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zaera_Keena)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 4:02am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/57 "2022-03-27T04:02:58Z")
If you live in HiSec, you should be wardeccable, periods. Regardless of whether you has structures. ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/7/6/e/76e868aa1f408a6f32c7a925427e1bb3680eab01.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 8:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/58 "2022-03-27T08:14:15Z")
Dracvlad quickly checks Safety. War Eligibility and finds: Not War Eligible… Yeah right…, practice what you preach perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![God\_Emperor\_Kane](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/god_emperor_kane/32/399336_2.png) [@God\_Emperor\_Kane](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/God_Emperor_Kane)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 4:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/59 "2022-03-27T16:42:37Z")
Well they might not be and really need any. But their members have multiple alts structures running in various systems around highsec. They have quite a few actually. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 5:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/60 "2022-03-27T17:12:48Z")
True, and we have knocked off the odd one or two at times. Still I always find it a tad amusing that an entity that claims all of hisec has no structures to lord it over others with. Can you imagine the Satey. Keepstar in Uedama, what a horrible thought that. But that is saying I am here and I have control of this space. Tora used to talk about putting up a Keepstar in hisec, would have been good to see actually. ---
**Author:** ![Saeger1737](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/saeger1737/32/459629_2.png) [@Saeger1737](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Saeger1737)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 7:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/61 "2022-03-27T19:55:45Z")
You know war immunity corps are making the game stagnant right? These alliances and corps allow nullblocs, wormhole groups and lowsec groups to move materials with impunity, thus allowing for such massive build ups that caused scarcity in the first place. Whining about wardecs isn’t the problem, it’s about the sandbox, and what’s good for the sandbox, not for the individual. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2022, 9:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828/62 "2022-03-27T21:10:43Z")
> [@Saeger1737](#): > > You know war immunity corps are making the game stagnant right? Yep. And I am afraid my alts are making use of it as well. To be honest, I think war immune corporations should get a baseline non-zero NPC tax on top of their corporation tax. Players would have to choose between evasion and evasion. You should not be able to have both. Today most of high sec is both tax- and war-immune. Adding additional financial benefit to taking the risk of being in a war-eligible corporation may shake up high sec a bit more. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/eves-war-dec-groups-and-who-are-they/354828.md?page=4)