# Freighter PvP & the Ante **URL:** \ **Category:** Warfare & Tactics\ **Created:** [March 18, 2024, 6:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389 "2024-03-18T18:14:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mephiztopheleze](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mephiztopheleze/32/381036_2.png) [@Mephiztopheleze](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mephiztopheleze)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 11:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/61 "2024-03-19T11:58:22Z")
> [@stefnia\_Freir](#): > > Active fit DST can be neuted before getting shot. Depends on the system. > relying on active fit DST is a bad move. if you’re fitting for anti-gank, you shouldn’t be fitting active tank. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 12:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/62 "2024-03-19T12:41:39Z")
I mean active hardener, not local rep. Also we are talking EHP, which is not impacted by rep. ---
**Author:** ![Anthony\_FatTony\_Amico](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anthony_fattony_amico/32/391106_2.png) [@Anthony\_FatTony\_Amico](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anthony_FatTony_Amico)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 12:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/63 "2024-03-19T12:51:17Z")
Reduce your capital investment ratio so your portfolio is not as damaged when loss does occur. Also spreading the money across a wider area is a great thing too. 🤓 Imagine if you did this kind of ratio in RL with like stocks? You would be laughed out of the room and probably fired when that bubble pops as you bet everything goes up… As they say don’t put all your eggs in one basket. No reasonable person would put their entire life savings into ONE singular stock? 🤔 Break up the loads and work harder. Lazy bones 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wayay_bonnylad/32/414346_2.png) [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wayay_Bonnylad)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 2:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/64 "2024-03-19T14:58:52Z")
I quite like the suggestion made further up the thread about having security loss being tied to the value of the killmail. If you appear on a killmail then you take the hit - the bigger the ISK loss on the KM the bigger the security loss. You take a nominal hit to your rating for having a go, but score big and you take a big secuity loss which will ultimately force your team of gankers out of hisec for a while to repair ratings, before coming back for another go. I liken it to current police attitude to shoplifters in the UK - they hardly ever bother. But then some big heist happens and the perps become public enemy number one until they are caught. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/65 "2024-03-19T15:19:12Z")
> [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > I quite like Perhaps if you tell me _why_ you believe the measures you propose should be introduced, I might be able to consider them. ‘Because I like the idea’ isn’t exactly persuasive. ---
**Author:** ![Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wayay_bonnylad/32/414346_2.png) [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wayay_Bonnylad)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 4:00pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/66 "2024-03-19T16:00:39Z")
I am not trying to persuade you. I honestly couldn’t give a flying monkey what you think. If ganking is your preferred play style you won’t want it to change, even if it is better for the overall game, because it would affect your personal gameplay. I merely pointed out that I quite like the idea, and how I perceived it could work. If someone who matters reads it, stops for a second and thinks about it themselves, they may also think it is a good idea and it may get discussed in a forum where it matters. Think about it yourself for a while. Not everyone will spoon-feed you ideas. Have a good day. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 4:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/67 "2024-03-19T16:33:13Z")
> [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > I honestly couldn’t give a flying monkey what you think. Whoa Bonnylad! It is because I actually _do_ care what you and others think that I spend time in reading and responding to comments such as yours. What I think may not be of interest to you - that’s fine - but don’t you see that you are guilty of the same dismissive attitude of which you have (wrongly) accused _me_? Every change to ganking over the past 10 years has affected my playstyle. True, I may have thought the changes unnecessary, but I did accept them because I trust CCP to balance the game in the way it wishes. > [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > If someone who matters reads it If only those who agree with you matter to you, then you will never be able to defend your assertions effectively, because you will be unprepared for any challenges put to you. You will certainly not be able to persuade (there’s that word again) those who have power if you cannot demonstrate that you have at least considered views other than your own. You’re right; people may agree with you, ‘stop for a second, and think about it themselves’. They may indeed like your ideas. But if they’re not prepared to engage with dissenting voices in a mature fashion, they will simply be sounding-off in an echo-chamber. > [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > Think about it yourself for a while. I did. You now have my considered response. See? I don’t try to cancel people based upon whether I agree with them or not. > [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > Not everyone will spoon-feed you ideas. Complex notions cannot always be grasped at the first attempt. If I were, for example, to give you some ideas about respect, subtlety, discussion and debate, you might need to be ‘spoon-fed’, because the true nature of these concepts appears to elude you. If, however, you wish to bestow upon me your ideas about, say, immaturity, cant and sloppy thinking, i should indeed have to be spoon-fed, for they are entirely new to my experience of communicating via the written word. ---
**Author:** ![Mephiztopheleze](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mephiztopheleze/32/381036_2.png) [@Mephiztopheleze](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mephiztopheleze)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 11:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/68 "2024-03-19T23:29:37Z")
Umm, not sure I’ve ever heard of gankers using neuts. A DST has a decent capacitor, it would require a fair bit of neut pressure to alpha the cap and the hardener wouldn’t shut off until it finishes the cycle anyway. I’m pretty sure they’d just bring extra dps instead of neuts. And you absolutely want active hardeners to take advantage of the overheat bonuses. When folk refer to active tank, they’re _usually_ referring to repair modules. ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/69 "2024-03-19T23:55:26Z")
> [@Mephiztopheleze](#): > > I’m pretty sure they’d just bring extra dps instead of neuts. You should doubt. If it’s less expensive to shut down using neuts, then neuts are the way to go. > [@Mephiztopheleze](#): > > And you absolutely want active hardeners to take advantage of the overheat bonuses. No, you absolutely do not want. Unless you want to die of course. > [@Mephiztopheleze](#): > > When folk refer to active tank, they’re _usually_ referring to repair modules. Not for a DST used in the context of a suicide gank. ---
**Author:** ![Mephiztopheleze](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/mephiztopheleze/32/381036_2.png) [@Mephiztopheleze](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Mephiztopheleze)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 2:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/70 "2024-03-20T02:44:48Z")
Please show me the lossmail of a ganker fit with neuts. I’ve never heard of it. ---
**Author:** ![Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wayay_bonnylad/32/414346_2.png) [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wayay_Bonnylad)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 8:31am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/71 "2024-03-20T08:31:25Z")
Again, in case you overlooked it the first time, I am not trying to persuade you, or anyone else, about this idea. I simply pointed out that I like the idea. It is not even my idea - it was something I read further up the thread. Clearly, you revel in the back and forth of intellectual debate and you obviously have very well developed written communication skills. Unfortunately, I don’t care much for long-winded debate - I am too long in the tooth and only really come to the forums to sound out current thinking and occasionally make a comment on something that catches my eye. I did not make any attempt to get anyone ‘cancelled, whether they aggree with me or not’. From various threads I have come to the conclusion that you are firmly in the Ganking is Good camp, and accept that you will do your best to shoot down in flames any suggestions that may affect that playstyle. But I resent the snidey personal comments about respect and subtlety. Personally, I appreciate that there is a place for ganking in the game, just that there may be a little too much of it. This suggestion of having dynamic security rating loss intrigues me and could have merit. Yes, I understand your worry that professional gankers may have to work in the background to repair standngs in order to keep at it, rather than sit for hours picking off the ripe fruit that attempts to pass by. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 8:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/72 "2024-03-20T08:59:29Z")
> [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](#): > > I don’t care much for long-winded debate - I am too long in the tooth Thanks for your response, Wayay, I appreciate it. I understand you better. Being long in the tooth is not a bar to enjoying an exploratory conversation, or a debate. I am in my 7th decade! ---
**Author:** ![Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wayay_bonnylad/32/414346_2.png) [@Wayay\_Bonnylad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wayay_Bonnylad)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 9:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/73 "2024-03-20T09:05:05Z")
I am rapidly approaching that milestone too. 🙂 Still playing video games into retirement! What a time to be alive!! ---
**Author:** ![stefnia\_Freir](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/stefnia_freir/32/390048_2.png) [@stefnia\_Freir](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/stefnia_Freir)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 9:33am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/74 "2024-03-20T09:33:40Z")
> [@Mephiztopheleze](#): > > I’ve never heard of it. I did. No reason to search for a lossmail, I trust my memory more than your ears. ---
**Author:** ![Zaera\_Keena](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zaera_keena/32/449938_2.png) [@Zaera\_Keena](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zaera_Keena)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 6:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/75 "2024-03-20T18:22:45Z")
> [@Corey\_Fumimasa](#): > > The scout has double webs. Why are you not using an insta warp hecate with tipple webs? Nobody to blame but yourself. You really are clueless (maller slow boating upto your 2 web scout ?) and deserve to lose your freighter. Now if I was your scout, would warp next to freighter in an insta warp hecate ( requires 500 mill implants) near the freighter insta lock and web it, then watch it insta warp into the distance and insta warp after it. This maller can insta lock a freighter and gank it solo? Share that fit, that’s one kickass Maller. > [@Corey\_Fumimasa](#): > > there has to be the potential for victory. Getting away is victory . You just dont know how as clueless. You want blood? Get a PvP ship and do some GANKING. > [@Corey\_Fumimasa](#): > > The Cats don’t drop anything if the freighter gets away. Yes they do, their mods after concorde ganks them. They also take a sec hit which costs money to repair. ---
**Author:** ![Zaera\_Keena](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zaera_keena/32/449938_2.png) [@Zaera\_Keena](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zaera_Keena)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 6:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/76 "2024-03-20T18:36:39Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > How many allies does that Maller need to bring your Freighter down? None. According to him, maller ganks him solo costing 2% of the value of his freighter, > [@Syzygium](#): > > Why should you win this confrontation? Because he thinks that the more expensive ship should always win (Pay to Win ). ---
**Author:** ![Syzygium](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/syzygium/32/510263_2.png) [@Syzygium](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Syzygium)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 7:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/77 "2024-03-20T19:41:54Z")
Ah. Okay, I obviously had the _completely wrong_ impression that this Maller would need at least a dozen Talos’, a Scanner, a Looter and an own Hauler/Freighter to extract the loot safely, all working together without a major fuckup in order to make a single ISK profit. My bad. Yeah, looks completely imbalanced, the Solo Maller just ganks him and takes away all his stuff effortlessly, costing him billions and there is _nothing he can do_. _Absolutely nothing_ works against this evil ganking plan. It’s so horrifying, it probably even drives players away from EVE that haven’t even played yet, just from the hearsay! Please, someone needs to act! #CCP #needsfixing #verybadthingswillhappen ---
**Author:** ![Zaera\_Keena](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zaera_keena/32/449938_2.png) [@Zaera\_Keena](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zaera_Keena)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 7:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/78 "2024-03-20T19:47:35Z")
> [@Syzygium](#): > > it probably even drives players away from EVE that haven’t even played yet Especially those WoW credit card warriors that buy freighters on day 1, then come to the forums screaming. ---
**Author:** ![Corey\_Fumimasa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/corey_fumimasa/32/402866_2.png) [@Corey\_Fumimasa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Corey_Fumimasa)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 10:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/79 "2024-03-21T10:48:07Z")
My point is specifically that Freighter PvP is consensual, and currently pretty balanced from a meta standpoint. The difference with any other PvP engagement is that the victor gets to loot the field. This is not the case with freighter PvP. A “win” for the freighter is merely escape. All the support ships required for a gank only come into play once the freighter is solidly on the losing side of the engagement. Currently the best play for the freighter captain is to tether in Sivala and wait for the pirates to engage another freighter, then jump through. What if there was another factor, one which makes the freighter captain consider running the camp? A big fat reward for successfully evading the campers if they make a play for that specific freighter. The freighter pilot might think, “I got this” and make the run. Rather than sit around watching netflix and waiting for an opening. ---
**Author:** ![Corey\_Fumimasa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/corey_fumimasa/32/402866_2.png) [@Corey\_Fumimasa](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Corey_Fumimasa)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 11:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389/80 "2024-03-21T11:09:34Z")
Its a shame they don’t have a bot that helps as much with reading comprehension as it does with writing. Something like Grammerly but in reverse. I’ll take a stab at it for the hawks in the audience. “Miners bad! Gankers Good and Noble! Need more targets to make for more gankers! Need prize for playing mining hauling game. Like big stuffed bear at carnival that no one win but everyone want. Then more miners and haulers make more targets!” [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389.md?page=3) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/freighter-pvp-the-ante/443389.md?page=5)