# From Extraction To Production: Update **URL:** \ **Category:** Announcements\ **Created:** [November 20, 2021, 12:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887 "2021-11-20T00:08:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 118
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:16am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2393 "2021-12-07T01:16:08Z")
In current game, according to Pyfa, your fit has 81K EHP with all lvl 5. If his screenshot is correct it’ll be about 15% less BUT he doesn’t fit a survey. If his Pyfa is actually correct (who the fck knows) then a proc is going to lose a lot of EHP. Then again, in the first iteration they stated the proc and skiff would lose EHP, not sure what happened to that. ---
**Author:** ![Kenneth\_Feld](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenneth_feld/32/435300_2.png) [@Kenneth\_Feld](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenneth_Feld)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2394 "2021-12-07T01:17:57Z")
> Tomorrow’s fit after the patch (based on Singularity fitting window) Yeah - I am not totally convinced sisi is still correct - this is what i got via pyfa EDIT: add screenshot of strip miner I’s as that is what you used - showing 6.81m3/s ![Screen Shot 2021-12-06 at 8.17.16 PM](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/4/d/d/4dda2ad28bcc7010df8530f0c1ce7cd6407950b8.jpeg) ![Screen Shot 2021-12-06 at 8.18.57 PM](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/b/5/7/b57468cbb3e1a2ebcd5ea9503f0941d1bf325da9.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Kenneth\_Feld](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenneth_feld/32/435300_2.png) [@Kenneth\_Feld](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenneth_Feld)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:22am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2395 "2021-12-07T01:22:39Z")
This whole game is about choices - if you choose to fit a survey scanner instead of tank - that is a choice - it is a choice you didn’t have to make before but you do now. the 3rd low can add tank or yield - that is your wildcard now ---
**Author:** ![Suki\_Vokkonen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/suki_vokkonen/32/382402_2.png) [@Suki\_Vokkonen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Suki_Vokkonen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2396 "2021-12-07T01:23:11Z")
2k more, but maybe because it assumes level 5 Shield Management ? I’m level 4 as I said. I’ll soon see it live anyway. I think the ships bonus and attributes are ok on Singularity Only the Role Bonus (50% to drones HP and damage) are not implemented on Sisi for the Procurer and Skiff, and is worrying me for tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:23am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2397 "2021-12-07T01:23:51Z")
Ehh you’re kinda missing the point. IF this pyfa is correct, and I doubt it is given the quick release, then the proc is losing a lot of EHP AND a lot of yield (with T1). Also, holy crap, fit an MSE. ---
**Author:** ![Kenneth\_Feld](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenneth_feld/32/435300_2.png) [@Kenneth\_Feld](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenneth_Feld)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2398 "2021-12-07T01:39:09Z")
NOW you understand why i didn’t work on EHP numbers - I usually fit resists over buffer as I have a rorqual with shield reps - but in this case I just clicked off a MSH and didn’t look much further That said, the yield is an issue I hate the most about this patch I know why it was done and I agree with the reason it was done, I would have “Fixed” it differently and that is about all I can say there. ---
**Author:** ![Suki\_Vokkonen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/suki_vokkonen/32/382402_2.png) [@Suki\_Vokkonen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Suki_Vokkonen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2399 "2021-12-07T01:41:41Z")
> [@Kenneth\_Feld](#): > > This whole game is about choices - if you choose to fit a survey scanner instead of tank - that is a choice - it is a choice you didn’t have to make before but you do now. Totally acknowledge that and I’m fine with this. Got ganked by 2 catalyst in my Retriever with 11k ehp, early on. I felt \>50k ehp was more than enough to make a gank of 8-10 useless, unless they are in because of boredom. As for the strip miner, I used them so that I don’t need to swap crystals. Now that they re unifiying them, I will consider them, but I’m still unsure if I’ll train the new reprocessing skills (to be able to fit the crystals), or if I’ll just cash in the SP and spend them on my poor combat skills that have me miss all the combat event in the past few months. As you say, choices. Crystal A I type only requires 3 level for the simple ore processing, that should be quick to learn. ---
**Author:** ![May\_Q\_Cry](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/may_q_cry/32/370362_2.png) [@May\_Q\_Cry](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/May_Q_Cry)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2400 "2021-12-07T01:44:22Z")
So then you would agree. When CCP Psych said they were going to “significantly increase the EHP of all barges and all exhumers as well as their mining yield” that was a false statement? ---
**Author:** ![Suki\_Vokkonen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/suki_vokkonen/32/382402_2.png) [@Suki\_Vokkonen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Suki_Vokkonen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2401 "2021-12-07T01:50:03Z")
> [@Kenneth\_Feld](#): > > That said, the yield is an issue I hate the most about this patch > I know why it was done and I agree with the reason it was done, I would have “Fixed” it differently By removing the waste mechanic? I wished they had removed it, except maybe for type C crystals. That mechanic is the reason they nerfed the T1, because people complained (and I understand) that by removing waste on T1, the difference with T2 still having waste was not worth training/fitting T2. Remove waste and just increase the ressources 80% (for example), if that is the ore buff they were looking for. ---
**Author:** ![Kenneth\_Feld](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenneth_feld/32/435300_2.png) [@Kenneth\_Feld](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenneth_Feld)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2402 "2021-12-07T01:50:40Z")
I will give you the fact it is poorly worded and somewhat “Ambitious” I, however, knew what he meant and things changed after he said it The yield part was correct until the nerf to T1 miners which i already covered - so, again things changed after the statement was made ---
**Author:** ![John\_Snowfox](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/john_snowfox/32/299803_2.png) [@John\_Snowfox](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/John_Snowfox)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 1:53am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2403 "2021-12-07T01:53:14Z")
I’m new to the game. I don’t really understand what the update does. Can someone explain why everyone is mad about it? And yes I’ve read a bunch of the posts here but they’re getting into the finer details of it. I’m looking for a high-level overview of why this update is bad. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 2:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2404 "2021-12-07T02:12:02Z")
> [@Suki\_Vokkonen](#): > > From the current OP: > [@CCP\_Psych](#): > > significantly increase the EHP of all barges and all exhumers as well as their mining yield Just wondering, who YOU think these changes will benefit the most? I know many nulsec miners who are looking forward to the day they don’t have to warp off a fleet of Exhumers as soon as rats turn up. I also know many gankers who’ve already worked out how many extra Cats they’ll need to kill the new and improved Exhumers. Nerf Rorquals (was needed) then buff Exhumers EHP so they can better survive in the Rorqual mining environment and also give them better yields to help compensate for the loss of multibox Rorqual mining. ---
**Author:** ![Suki\_Vokkonen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/suki_vokkonen/32/382402_2.png) [@Suki\_Vokkonen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Suki_Vokkonen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 2:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2405 "2021-12-07T02:28:15Z")
Don’t know if you are talking to me or to CCP Psych. Feel like you are not reading the room properly, if your question was to me. ---
**Author:** ![May\_Q\_Cry](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/may_q_cry/32/370362_2.png) [@May\_Q\_Cry](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/May_Q_Cry)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 2:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2406 "2021-12-07T02:48:34Z")
> [@Kenneth\_Feld](#): > > things changed after the statement was made This is a fair point and one I hadn’t considered. ---
**Author:** ![Suki\_Vokkonen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/suki_vokkonen/32/382402_2.png) [@Suki\_Vokkonen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Suki_Vokkonen)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 2:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2407 "2021-12-07T02:50:36Z")
By the way, exhumer pilots in null are probably going to be happy, if they fly the Mackinaw. If they currently fear the rats, the Mackinaw is the new Skiff, with 3 times the hold. For the past 3 weeks I’m solo testing from the ORE region (Outer Ring). I have no issue with rats, including the battleships. This fit is basically the same ehp and surprisingly same yield as my current Skiff on TQ (even with the nerf to the T1 strip miner. (I’m only Exhumers level 4) [Mackinaw, Mackinaw New Skiff] Mining Laser Upgrade II Mining Laser Upgrade II Damage Control II Survey Scanner II Caldari Navy Medium Shield Extender Multispectrum Shield Hardener II Multispectrum Shield Hardener II Strip Miner I Strip Miner I Medium Core Defense Field Extender II Medium Core Defense Field Extender II Caldari Navy Vespa x5 ---
**Author:** ![Sgt\_Ocker](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sgt_ocker/32/270881_2.png) [@Sgt\_Ocker](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sgt_Ocker)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 6:17am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2408 "2021-12-07T06:17:05Z")
Not fair. Just tested your fit. Now I need to consider resubbing all my indy alts. sarcasm is hard to convey in words but - Thanks 😏 ---
**Author:** ![Moko\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/moko_musana/32/373694_2.png) [@Moko\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Moko_Musana)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 6:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2409 "2021-12-07T06:49:49Z")
> [@Suki\_Vokkonen](#): > > Note : a Survey scanner is a must, I don’t want to waste cycle time. It’s a must on anything that mines, whether you’re solo-mining, mining with your buddies, or mining with your alts. I take it, however, that a random amount of ore turning into waste at the end of each mining cycle makes the module more or less obsolete, as the rock despawns considerably less predictable, especially if someone else is also mining the rock, or if multiple mining lasers on the same ship are finishing their cycles in different ticks, for example because one module ran out of crystals and had to be manually restarted, while the other kept spinning on it’s own. > [@Suki\_Vokkonen](#): > > [Procurer, \*Simulated Procurer Fitting] > Mining Laser Upgrade II > Mining Laser Upgrade II > Damage Control II > > Survey Scanner II > Multispectrum Shield Hardener II > > Strip Miner I > Strip Miner I > > Medium Core Defense Field Extender I > Medium Core Defense Field Extender I > Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Flipping the multispectral for a large extender (use the additional powergrid, or add a reactor control or power diagnostic into the new low if the new extra PG alone is not enough) might advantageous over a the resist module. I don’t know the EHP numbers right now, but with the tank being passive, it can’t be forgotten to be turned on, it is active at times where you cannot turn it on, for example when you get instalocked by an artillery camp on dropping stargate/wormhole cloak, and it also results in more shield hp for the orca’s shield extention command to affect, while a harmony command on the orca results in not being stacking penalized due to no other source of resistance affecting your shield. ---
**Author:** ![Induce\_Deadline](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/induce_deadline/32/418955_2.png) [@Induce\_Deadline](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Induce_Deadline)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 8:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2410 "2021-12-07T08:20:09Z")
> [@Kenneth\_Feld](#): > > EDIT: add screenshot of strip miner I’s as that is what you used - showing 6.81m3/s Not that I care, but just to point out what myself and others may be thinking… Where in those screenshots is the significant buff to EHP @CCP_Psych refers to? Not suggesting I think barges/exhumers need more EHP, I don’t really care, but from what I’ve read it sounds like people have a point. If you max tank fit with a survey scanner before/after the changes, EHP isn’t jumping by much? You seem like a bit of a CCP shill, are you representing the changes from CCP or collecting feedback from players to deliver to CCP? Huge difference. ---
**Author:** ![Adriana\_Shi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/adriana_shi/32/290979_2.png) [@Adriana\_Shi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Adriana_Shi)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 8:29am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2411 "2021-12-07T08:29:28Z")
I understand there is likely technical issues with Crystals giving Suspect timer. if this is released like this there could very well be significant griefing in highsec with these crystals. as a moon owner i dont want to need to invest in a fleet of suicide Catalysts to defend my moon. Please don’t make me. just wait for them if you can’t do it now. Release the other two crystals but leave the C Types out till we can effectively deal with them in highsec. This will be revisited after release… is NEVER encouraging from CCP… Soon.tm… could mean never… either do it or dont. ---
**Author:** ![Kenneth\_Feld](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenneth_feld/32/435300_2.png) [@Kenneth\_Feld](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenneth_Feld)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2021, 10:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/2412 "2021-12-07T10:55:50Z")
Yes, yes and yes I try and explain the changes - and at this point it is even hard for me to understand what is going on. There is an onslaught of old information out there. I have CLEARLY said what i do and don’t like about the patch I have also clearly said I am not the EHP guy, just not my thing, and even my screenshots confirm that the EHP buff really didn’t happen witht he procurer and even though it was said all barges get more yield, in the end that wasn’t possible and the ceveter got a small nerf…i am not trying to hide that and it is CLEARLY in my screenshot and I even mention it in writing separately. I am just trying to get correct information out there - that is all - you can like it, not like it, I can’t make that decision for you. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=117) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=119)