# From Extraction To Production: Update **URL:** \ **Category:** Announcements\ **Created:** [November 20, 2021, 12:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887 "2021-11-20T00:08:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:05pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/410 "2021-11-20T15:05:32Z")
> [@Oskar\_Milde](#): > > I really do feel for the Devs as there is no pleasing this player base. The playerbase is large and diverse, with a host of competing interests. It’s only natural that competing interests… compete. ---
**Author:** ![Kiddoomer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kiddoomer/32/260329_2.png) [@Kiddoomer](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kiddoomer)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/411 "2021-11-20T15:10:48Z")
Just wanted to point out that at max skills, the Mackinaw is 703.01 m3 short of ore hold to do any L4 mining mission in one trip, 353m3 if counting the standard cargo hold. With the new mining barge gas harvester reshipping to a venture will not be needed anymore for gas missions which is a good plus for me. ---
**Author:** ![CCP\_Psych](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ccp_psych/32/268632_2.png) [@CCP\_Psych](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/CCP_Psych)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/412 "2021-11-20T15:10:49Z")
Yes it will be ---
**Author:** ![The\_Insane\_One](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_insane_one/32/446904_2.png) [@The\_Insane\_One](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Insane_One)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/413 "2021-11-20T15:18:51Z")
@CCP_Psych is it 34% to have waste, or is it 100% of having waste at 34% of what you mine? ---
**Author:** ![Bokerman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bokerman/32/297561_2.png) [@Bokerman](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bokerman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/414 "2021-11-20T15:22:35Z")
The reason why ppl started mining in command ships is because the gankers in high sec freely gank everything else with pretty much zero downside. So to protect themselves against that, they spent a long time acquiring the skills to fly the Orca etc. Its not all players fault that some players abused alts and all the accounts one can get these days, and afk mine or afk rat and break the game in doing so. That was the real problem…and now CCP are trying to control that effect on the economy without actually rectifying the problem with the game. A bit of extra tank on barges wont help some miners. Its about time security status in high security systems actually meant something. Instead HS gankers can freely do what they want with little to no downside and very little investment. Now nobody wants to ruin the fun of ganking but come on ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:24pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/415 "2021-11-20T15:24:10Z")
I seen several such posts, one was from Destiny. I have for too long been limited to a Skiff or Proc because I hate to be an easy kill. My mining is limited, I do Orca / Skiff in hisec and Prospect / Endurance everywhere else, but not very often, only when I want to make stuff. As long as I can continue to do this somewhat efficiently I will be happy. I will never get into a Rorqual, but I am happy that CCP did not stop it from mining period. It is good to see that CCP listened and made adjustments that moved towards many peoples complaints. The gankers have a reduction in the tank of the Skiff and Proc and perhaps less people using the Orca, I would think that they would still be happy. Though lets see what they say when CCP adjusts the other barges/exhumers. ---
**Author:** ![Heavy\_Met4l\_Queen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/heavy_met4l_queen/32/296347_2.png) [@Heavy\_Met4l\_Queen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Heavy_Met4l_Queen)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/416 "2021-11-20T15:28:08Z")
> [@aldarrin](#): > > I think it starts and ends with suicide ganking in highsec. Suicide ganking is healthy for the game, and i consider it a minimal problem. You are not meant to mine with complete immunity in your highsec ore-ritch theme park. Don’t want to get ganked? Pay attention to local, don’t make yourself a target and mine further away from trade hubs. As for making money… well anyone interested in making money is not going to be mining. > [@aldarrin](#): > > I think people are mad that they skilled into a 2b ship that wasn’t really great at mining to begin with and are mad that it’s getting needlessly nerfed. It was approx 700 mil before scarcity hit, which was a fair price for such a platform. If your spending 2 bil for such a ship and are using it incorrectly, you’re an impressive fool. And again, it was never supposed to be great at mining. If you trained into it and bought one expecting to make bank mining solo, your incredibly incompetent. ---
**Author:** ![Lurswena\_Ice](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lurswena_ice/32/305444_2.png) [@Lurswena\_Ice](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lurswena_Ice)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/417 "2021-11-20T15:31:46Z")
In Nullsec I mine SOV belts 🙂 You just keep that index up and mine, and there is quiet a bit to mine if you can hold it 5/5 Belts reset after you mine empty after Maintenance. ---
**Author:** ![Fartsniffer\_Munba](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fartsniffer_munba/32/248389_2.png) [@Fartsniffer\_Munba](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fartsniffer_Munba)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/418 "2021-11-20T15:33:59Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > But what if the engine doesn’t have the capability to support that yet (eg. particularly point 4)? It’s nothing that didn’t work on Sisi already. If mining drones can deposit ore to the ore hold, the access is there. If indy core can pull from fuel bay, why can’t compression module pull from ore hold? > [@The\_Insane\_One](#): > > @CCP_Psych is it 34% to have waste, or is it 100% of having waste at 34% of what you mine? I can answer that one. It’s a 34% chance to waste as much as you pulled on that cycle, waste being reducing a rock on top of the pull. ---
**Author:** ![Ranar\_Linyne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ranar_linyne/32/378478_2.png) [@Ranar\_Linyne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ranar_Linyne)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/419 "2021-11-20T15:36:22Z")
Mining frigates were restored. To everyone struggling to find a positive thats it. Mining frigate changes were reverted. > [@Fartsniffer\_Munba](#): > > Any compression is better than no compression. I was never going to use a lossy compression process. Much less one that continued to risk my expensive assets beyond the need for that. No compression, in this case, is most certainly better than that nonsense. > [@Brisc\_Rubal](#): > > Did they reduce the waste numbers for some of the modules? Yes. Is that what people asked them to do? Yes. All t2 wastes. Faction wastes. Drones above t1 waste. All they had to do was make the rocks 20-50% larger instead of 100%. Using the rock as the variable is more direct, and less convoluted. Certainly the better choice, and the one the original dev team envisioned using in such a way. Anything involving waste is automatic ■■■■. Nobody will use it if there is a 0% waste option. Period. It’s like the only heard the bit about frigates and new bros. A big round of sincere applause for the collective pulling their heads out of their asses on that one, but now there is no reason to use t2. Well, unless your objective is to destroy material. > [@Pinaka\_Hakoke](#): > > Orca got even more nerfs compared to the 1st iteration? Yes, thats correct. More nerfs to the orca. Apparently it was still to viable for anything other than afk boosting. > [@Jada\_Avari](#): > > there’s little point using T2s on expensive rocks. Waste is the problem. Always has been. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/420 "2021-11-20T15:36:51Z")
Ah I see. Well I very much appreciate the interest, Ive a very long working day today so dont have much time to write. I think if I was to sum it up Id say that yes, I dont believe the large Command Ships should be miners themselves; CCP should be angling that being a Mining Manager over a team of people who mine shpuld be what those ships are for, not have 20 of them all to one person and hoovering up rock to poop isk. Any concept of mining as a task or even developing it into actual gameplay lost when you can AFK to PLEX with them. Ventures should have gas harvesting removed as that is the only remaining Alpha Farming trick they have left. If you want to farm this, get an account like any other farmer (also Gas and PI need a nerf on the whole but thats another convo entirely). Oh and lossless compression is stupid. It leads to compressed ore being worth more than anything made from it and thats just unrealistic and idiotic. I also object to CCP U turning because it just shows that if afk bot krabs cry enough they get what they want. This isnt a good precedent. ---
**Author:** ![Fartsniffer\_Munba](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/fartsniffer_munba/32/248389_2.png) [@Fartsniffer\_Munba](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Fartsniffer_Munba)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:39pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/421 "2021-11-20T15:39:14Z")
> [@Ranar\_Linyne](#): > > I was never going to use a lossy compression process. Much less one that continued to risk my expensive assets beyond the need for that. No compression, in this case, is most certainly better than that nonsense. It was like what, 1.5% loss on Sisi? Could certainly do with that. Also, mining in fractured wormholes is nigh impossible without in-place compression. It’s not like anyone was forcing you to use that compression. Would be nice to have that option, even if it’s not great at the moment, that’s what I was saying. ED: There was no extra risk involved, as compression modules did not need indy core running, do not prevent moving and warping, didn’t give you the timers, and would stop as soon as you warp, they were in fact pretty usable, save for the clunks in loading them. ---
**Author:** ![Bokerman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bokerman/32/297561_2.png) [@Bokerman](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bokerman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/422 "2021-11-20T15:41:33Z")
Simple limit the number of accounts. One account can only mine a set amount and wont impact the game as much as one guy abusing 10+ accounts. This is why everything gets nerfed. ---
**Author:** ![aldarrin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aldarrin/32/279769_2.png) [@aldarrin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/aldarrin)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/423 "2021-11-20T15:41:34Z")
I don’t live in High sec and I don’t fly an Orca. But I know enough about both to understand why folks would fly them in High sec. My point stands, there’s no problem with the Orca. You can gank it, just need numbers. Not really that different from a whaling fleet. You don’t have a god given right to _easily_ gank miners. Do the math and muster the numbers or stfu & gtfo. It didn’t mine that much to begin with (currently it mines about 15% of what a Rorq does), so I see no compelling reason to nerf it. Maybe if they make it cost 500m _fitted_ I can see folks being happy with it as a boosting and hauling boat. But 2b for a boost ship is pretty damn steep (closer to 3b fitted). 700m just for the hull is too much tbh. If it’s going to be a glorified command ship then that’s what it should cost; redo the ship so it costs and moves like a T2 BC and call it a day. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/424 "2021-11-20T15:42:45Z")
How do you propose doing that? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Insane\_One](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/the_insane_one/32/446904_2.png) [@The\_Insane\_One](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/The_Insane_One)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/425 "2021-11-20T15:44:34Z")
its boring that way, ill keep my 12 account mining fleet running and paying for it, ooh you think theyll limit how i can play and not get my $ to pay the bills? Dont think so. ---
**Author:** ![Ranar\_Linyne](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ranar_linyne/32/378478_2.png) [@Ranar\_Linyne](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ranar_Linyne)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/426 "2021-11-20T15:45:07Z")
> [@Ramona\_McCandless](#): > > Ventures should have gas harvesting removed I couldn’t disagree more on that point. The venture should, as it currently does, be able to mine EVERYTHING. Slowly. Its an intro, a primer if you will, to all things mining. It being unable to preform any single mining task means early exposure to that is literally impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/427 "2021-11-20T15:45:41Z")
Good job Im not making that point to you, krabby ---
**Author:** ![Bokerman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bokerman/32/297561_2.png) [@Bokerman](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Bokerman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/428 "2021-11-20T15:45:48Z")
Well they manage to stop ppl logging in as lots of alpha accounts compared to omega status so why not expand the same process and limit the number of omega’s. maybe add an extra 2 char slots to one account though to compensate so ppl can still do everything on eve and find a balance. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2021, 3:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/429 "2021-11-20T15:46:45Z")
> [@Bokerman](#): > > Well they manage to stop ppl logging in as lots of alpha accounts No they dont, sad to say. Its extremely easy to log in multiple Alphas, or Omega and Alpha at the same time. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=20) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=22)