# From Extraction To Production: Update **URL:** \ **Category:** Announcements\ **Created:** [November 20, 2021, 12:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887 "2021-11-20T00:08:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![Ash\_Beldrulf](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ash_beldrulf/32/473706_2.png) [@Ash\_Beldrulf](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ash_Beldrulf)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/955 "2021-11-22T14:03:05Z")
@CCP_Psych why was the fuel consumption not reduced for the compact indy? The cycle time was cut in half but the fuel used stayed the same? ---
**Author:** ![TheResearchGuy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theresearchguy/32/297268_2.png) [@TheResearchGuy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/TheResearchGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/956 "2021-11-22T14:03:58Z")
@CCP_Psych the Rorqual graphs are great. Could we please see these same graphs for the Orca too? thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Lodemai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lodemai/32/374211_2.png) [@Lodemai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lodemai)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/957 "2021-11-22T14:06:51Z")
Uhm…according to the shared excel the fuel usage in the first iteration was 500/750 for the T1/T2 modules, while it is 250/500 now ---
**Author:** ![ntrosell2](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ntrosell2/32/411950_2.png) [@ntrosell2](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ntrosell2)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/958 "2021-11-22T14:07:04Z")
I do not consider that being able to use Jump represents 8B of ship, and yes, I imagine in large corporations it will be simple to fill 300k of cargo without problem, that is why I am speaking from the point of view of small and medium-sized corporations. You do the same with an orca, it does not force you to be trapped for 5 minutes, you can use the Micro to activate the warp faster and now you will also be able to compress, the only advantage of the rorqual over the Orca was the power to compress and the drones, now we have ISK 300M drones that do nothing and the power to compress is already in a smaller ship and with more livertad of movement. the only profitability of the rorqual was that, and this nerf takes away almost everything for which having such an expensive ship in the air is worth it ---
**Author:** ![TheResearchGuy](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/theresearchguy/32/297268_2.png) [@TheResearchGuy](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/TheResearchGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/959 "2021-11-22T14:08:23Z")
But the mining index increases the # of anons - today. And those anons today are useless. Other than Merc and Crokite, nothing else is mined. They’re a complete waste of putting in industry upgrades in NS. As part of end of scarcity, I know many of us thought these anons would be useful again. Not seeing that. CCP, please improve the reason to have Industry upgrades in a system. ---
**Author:** ![Decimus\_King](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/decimus_king/32/481632_2.png) [@Decimus\_King](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Decimus_King)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/960 "2021-11-22T14:18:10Z")
with the removal of basic minerals from R4, you’d have a reason to mine bistot and arkonor again. Not a great alternative, but an alternative regardless. Beyond that yeah it is still disappointing that anoms are not great to have. It does provide belts for newbros to earn a decent bit. ---
**Author:** ![Moko\_Musana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/moko_musana/32/373694_2.png) [@Moko\_Musana](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Moko_Musana)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:57pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/961 "2021-11-22T14:57:55Z")
> [@Decimus\_King](#): > > Beyond that yeah it is still disappointing that anoms are not great to have. It does provi R4 is great because you can mine it under CONCORD umbrella, which means whenever you want, i.e. even when your capitals are not on standby. For Mex and Pye, I’d rather go find some Scordite, Pyroxeres or Plagioclase, which also have Mex and Pye and can be mined under CONCORD umbrella, then to crab in nullsec and have to worry how to get the ores moved. With the update, I’ll also have to worry how to get it compressed, before worrying about how to move it. ---
**Author:** ![Lfod\_Shi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lfod_shi/32/376240_2.png) [@Lfod\_Shi](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lfod_Shi)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/962 "2021-11-22T15:03:46Z")
Just wondering if anyone knows when the test server is gonna be updated with the revised changes… or has it been updated already? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/963 "2021-11-22T15:22:01Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > However, Conduit jump will allow entire mining fleets to instantly extract to safety when a hostile fleet jumps into system, which I think is not a good addition to the game. > > With just a regular jump bridge a Rorqual can extract a mining fleet to safety as well, except not instantaneous, and it wil require the other miners to pay attention to get themselves to safety. > > A conduit jumping Rorqual would simply take all miners within range with him to safety, which includes the miners that aren’t even paying attention or are AFK. Right, but having the Rorq sit on tether for compression (doesn’t break tether) and bridging (doesn’t break tether) rather than having it _in the belt_ to do the jump, that’s totally fine. Setting up the conduit jump helps smaller groups—only so many can go. I can (and have) bridge 254 pilots in one go, even w/a blops bridge. Limiting this only to bridging gives more advantage to the large groups. Also ‘all the miners in range’. Hah. So in a normal moon frack or ore deposit, that’ll be… what, **3**? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/964 "2021-11-22T15:26:03Z")
You simply click the icon to the left of the capacitor, and then click the hold you want to look at. 2 whole clicks. You _do_ have ‘show full tree’ enabled, right? ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/965 "2021-11-22T15:26:25Z")
> [@Lfod\_Shi](#): > > when the test server is gonna be updated with the revised changes Q2 2024 ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/966 "2021-11-22T15:33:21Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Right, but having the Rorq sit on tether for compression (doesn’t break tether) and bridging (doesn’t break tether) rather than having it _in the belt_ to do the jump, that’s totally fine. In my opinion, in-space compression should not be possible in safety. It should break tether and should be disallowed inside a POS. If that is not the case, I think CCP should change that. Bridging from the safety of tether is fine, that is how bridges work for titans and black ops battleships too. What isn’t fine is if it can be done from the belt, instantly and taking AFK miners with them, in the form of a Conduit jump. A Rorqual bridge from the belt would allow the mining fleet to extract as well, but with added risks for the Rorqual that isn’t instantly gone and with risks for miners who aren’t paying enough attention to take the bridge. Sure, the Rorqual could simply jump out instead, but that adds interesting choices for players to make: personal safety versus fleet safety. A conduit jump would simply do both and wouldn’t even require the non-Rorqual miners to pay attention. Industrial jump bridge for Rorquals = good Conduit jump for Rorquals = bad ---
**Author:** ![Osarian\_Torentes](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/osarian_torentes/32/394468_2.png) [@Osarian\_Torentes](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Osarian_Torentes)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/967 "2021-11-22T15:36:20Z")
_“As we transition the Rorqual from the absolute best solo mining ship to a more supportive role, offering PANIC, storing of ships, remote repairs, links, and a beefy tank, we want to ensure that these ships provide ample value on the field.”_ **To do facilitate this we are going to make it harder to fit the industrial core at the same time as a beefy tank.** You want to make a rorqual better at mining fleet boost and command, maybe make the Indy core have bonuses to remote shield/armor repair (either amount boosted or cap reduction per cycle or cycle speed), tractor range/velocity, and scanner range/velocity, to go along with the hefty increase in fitting cost. Or y’know don’t increase the fitting costs at the expense of tank CCPlease To be fair though, the changes you’d made to compression were designed by someone who wasn’t really thinking, or even tried playing with them. **Props to you for scrapping this version of them.** Edit: rorq’s creating indy jump bridges would be a nice ideal, I still find it stupid that the Capital **industrial** ship can’t use **industrial** cynos ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/968 "2021-11-22T15:42:49Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > Bridging from the safety of tether is fine, that is how bridges work for titans and black ops battleships too. It’s how conduit jumps work for blops, _too_. The afk fuel/ammo truck sitting 2.5k off the blops gets decloaked by the bombers coming back, and taken along for the ride. OH NOEZ!! We must get rid of conduit jumps completely! A rorq bridging from the belt locks a rock and is ready to PANIC. Which he can already do to make all of the barges invulnerable, even if they’re AFK. And no, in-space compression doesn’t break tether. Holy carp, if the only possible way to compress moon-goo meant spending hours sitting there untethered, it would’ve been even _more_ of a complete crapshow that needed overhaul. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:46pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/969 "2021-11-22T15:46:11Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > It’s how conduit jumps work for blops, _too_. I also do not like how it makes extracting a CovOps fleet way too easy, but at least a CovOps fleet would rarely be caught before, unlike mining ships in a belt, so there was not much of a gameplay difference there. Mining fleets however make for great objectives to fight over. Conduit jumping those mining fleets will make extracting those mining fleets too easy and safe. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:47pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/970 "2021-11-22T15:47:39Z")
Yeah, every change ever was gonna make mining fleets too safe, and yet, rorqs die all the time. Jump drives, panic, supercapital umbrellas, _and they still die_. Every day. Unless you don’t think the [Imperium](https://zkillboard.com/kill/96819063/), [Horde](https://zkillboard.com/kill/96780232/), and [Frat](https://zkillboard.com/kill/96769561/) count. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:50pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/971 "2021-11-22T15:50:38Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > A rorq bridging from the belt locks a rock and is ready to PANIC. Which he can already do to make all of the barges invulnerable, even if they’re AFK. This is a fun interactive way to allow Rorquals to ‘save’ a mining fleet - safe until a backup fleet arrives, so guaranteed content for all players involved. Now if that Rorqual conduit jumps instead, there will be **no content** for the roaming hostile fleet and no content for the defence fleet. Conduit jumps would make PANIC irrelevant for saving a mining fleet and would deny content. Rorquals shouldn’t get conduit jumps. A jump bridge would be a good addition, but not a conduit jump. ---
**Author:** ![Lodemai](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/lodemai/32/374211_2.png) [@Lodemai](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Lodemai)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/972 "2021-11-22T15:51:35Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > sit on tether for compression (doesn’t break tether) Doesn’t it? It should: ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/b/9/f/b9f9c426d50112456cd5d955cd5e84ffe0567302.png) ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/973 "2021-11-22T15:52:09Z")
Didn’t actually break it when we tested it last week. Maybe it does now? ---
**Author:** ![Oskar\_Milde](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/oskar_milde/32/396309_2.png) [@Oskar\_Milde](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Oskar_Milde)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/974 "2021-11-22T15:52:10Z")
That was kind of the point I was making to Arrendis. He was saying that everyone should just use T1 strips for everything. I replied to say that yeah you get more ore out of the rock, but it takes twice as long (well, less due to wastage, but I think you get my point) [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=47) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=49)