# From Extraction To Production: Update **URL:** \ **Category:** Announcements\ **Created:** [November 20, 2021, 12:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887 "2021-11-20T00:08:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 89
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 6:12pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1806 "2021-11-27T18:12:27Z")
> [@Cara\_Lube](#): > > and we ar back at step one. > this patch is ment to increase the support(centric)role of the orca. > and this will be done by geting rid of its support options and potential. > wich makes absolutly noe sense at all. > > its like a patch ment to increase the dmg of mission runners by reducing the npc resists by 10% while limiting the highslot use in misson-sites to one. We’re not because that conversation was specifically about using remote shieldreps which requires miners to be active and put in effort which, lets be honest, is generally not the case. Stop being overly dramatic. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 6:18pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1807 "2021-11-27T18:18:50Z")
> [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > that conversation was specifically about using remote shieldreps No, _your_ point in that conversation was about using remote shield reps. Other people in that same conversation were very blatantly saying ‘that’s nice, but we have other priorities’. You don’t really seem to understand that other people see different parts of an issue than you do, do you? P.S… > [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > Ah so you’re avoiding to answer, ok. Considering I [responded](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1785) specifically to that bit, looks a little to me like _you’re_ the one avoiding the answer. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 6:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1808 "2021-11-27T18:37:27Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > No, _your_ point in that conversation was about using remote shield reps. > [@Cara\_Lube](#): > > would like to see a fit that fullfill your suggestions, 2-3 mining links(if they implement a waste reduction one), 2shield links, 2+ RR, CiC to make these RR worthwhile, a compressing unit, a tractor beam to be able to pick up your fleets hulk jetcans(because of their hold size). with 6 highslots. mixed in with some self defense while being restricted on top by cpu and powergrid. It got mentioned a few times before that as well, but that post is what started that bit of the conversation. ---
**Author:** ![Aisha\_Katalen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aisha_katalen/32/387724_2.png) [@Aisha\_Katalen](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aisha_Katalen)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 6:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1809 "2021-11-27T18:38:47Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > Considering I [responded](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1785) specifically to that bit, looks a little to me like _you’re_ the one avoiding the answer. You responded to that AFTER I said you didn’t explain it. I’m not a time traveller. ---
**Author:** ![Kenrailae](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/kenrailae/32/494205_2.png) [@Kenrailae](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Kenrailae)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 6:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1810 "2021-11-27T18:48:21Z")
I don’t have a side in this, to be clear. Mining and industrials are broken. Literally EVERY mobile game offers a more exciting experience than mining in Eve. How the heck CCP can’t figure out that if you offer THE WORST play experience in all of MMOs, and you set it up so it promotes AFK’ing, ruin the ability of every ship to AFK, and then nerf the one final one that can AFK mine, and your gameplay is worse than even mining in runescape of all games… IDK. It’s beyond words. But I don’t have a side. I want the game to recover. Part of that is for gankers and miners and everyone to stop with the BS ‘But they’re the ones causing the problem’ arguments on the forum and point those fingers at CCP and everyone say, or else unsubscribe so they get the message, ‘NO, CCP, this is _NOT_ our fault. It’s your 2003 game design that hasn’t changed in 20 years. Fix it. The right way, not just another band-aid.’ ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1811 "2021-11-27T19:06:24Z")
> [@Aisha\_Katalen](#): > > You responded to that AFTER I said you didn’t explain it. Yes, in a response to other things you said. Amazing, I responded to something after you said it. Still not seeing you address the issue you whined that I didn’t answer. ---
**Author:** ![Jaxan\_Brax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jaxan_brax/32/404150_2.png) [@Jaxan\_Brax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jaxan_Brax)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:07pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1812 "2021-11-27T19:07:25Z")
_Eats more popcorn_ You’re not supposed to AFK mine. You’re supposed to find a group of people and make friends and work together to protect your interests. Find people who like to mine and make friends. Then find people who like to fight and make friends. Then have your PvP friends protect your mining friends and all share in the profits. Your miners build your fighter’s weapons and your fighters protect your miners. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:08pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1813 "2021-11-27T19:08:29Z")
> [@Jaxan\_Brax](#): > > You’re not supposed to AFK mine. You’re supposed to find a group of people and make friends and work together to protect your interests. There’s not supposed to be any right _or_ wrong way to play the game, as long as you’re playing by the rules CCP sets. Which includes afk mining, stupid as that is. ---
**Author:** ![Jaxan\_Brax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jaxan_brax/32/404150_2.png) [@Jaxan\_Brax](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jaxan_Brax)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:14pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1814 "2021-11-27T19:14:06Z")
My first solo kill ever was a guy AFK gas mining in null. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1815 "2021-11-27T19:17:01Z")
> [@Arrendis](#): > > There’s not supposed to be any right _or_ wrong way to play the game I think the word ‘supposed’ might also have been italicised, to reflect the reality of what you’re saying there. I well recall ganking a by-no-means youthful character, mining in a vessel with civilian lasers and prop-mod. I put it out of its misery. Here’s another example: [Mackinaw](https://youtu.be/5La9Qj7aS-4?t=186) ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:32pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1816 "2021-11-27T19:32:44Z")
O, and by-the-way, Miners… In the beginning, I _bumped_ my way around the belts. No amount of hit-points made the slightest difference to that activity. I was peddling Mining Permits at 10m a throw (it’s more now, I understand). Frustrated miners would pay up just to get rid of me. I bumped all-sorts in my Magnificent Mach. AFK Orcas and Skiffs bounced satisfyingly off into space and, because AFK, I had all the time in the world to do it. I think their yield suffered somewhat. Perhaps now you’ll ask for bumping to be outlawed? I predict a return to the old practice and a flood of saline-drenched invective on the Forums! ---
**Author:** ![Rowley\_Birkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rowley_birkin/32/375243_2.png) [@Rowley\_Birkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rowley_Birkin)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:33pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1817 "2021-11-27T19:33:53Z")
Please stop fighting among ourselves. The “enemy” here is the proposed patch. that’s what’s causing us so much angst. Please keep making coherent arguments against it (or for it, if there are good aspects). 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Jenny\_Hong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/jenny_hong/32/411360_2.png) [@Jenny\_Hong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Jenny_Hong)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:41pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1818 "2021-11-27T19:41:13Z")
> [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](#): > > There is not a single pleasure in this world which is immune from the dark hand of Fate. Fapping, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 7:54pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1819 "2021-11-27T19:54:14Z")
Blindness… ---
**Author:** ![Arrendis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arrendis/32/432594_2.png) [@Arrendis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arrendis)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 8:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1820 "2021-11-27T20:29:10Z")
Arthritis. ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 8:38pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1821 "2021-11-27T20:38:50Z")
Results on the three barges in terms of mining speed: → skill levels used: mining V, astrogeology V, mining barges V, specialty crystals related **IV** (e.g. veldspar processing on TQ, common asteroid on SiSi) → calculated _theoretical time to fill ore/mining hold_, as **TFH** in minutes per mining module, since the _clickfest_ topic came up with @Kenneth_Feld . That is for ONE strip miner module. As all ships can fit two, **the _actual_ time to fill the hold is half of what is shown below !** **Covetor** (_reference fit_: 3 mining laser upgrades II, 1 x Modulated Strip Miner II) TQ: with tech II crystal 1593 m3/121.5 sec = 13.1 m3/s (ore hold = 7000 m3, TFH = 8.9 min) with tech I crystal 1480 m3/121.5 sec = 12.2 m3/s (TFH = 9.6 min) SiSi: (remark: Mining Hold = **7,500** m3) A I 1675 m3/180s = 12.4 m3/s (TFH = 10.1 min) A II 2011 m3/135s = 14.9 m3/s (TFH = 8.4 min) B I 1675 m3/121.5s = 13.8 m3/s (TFH = 9.1 min) B II 2011 m3/108s = 18.6 m3/s (TFH = 6.7 min) **Retriever** (_reference fit_: 3 mining laser upgrades II, 1 x Modulated Strip Miner II) TQ: with tech II crystal 1593 m3/162 sec = 9.8 m3/s (ore hold = 27,500 m3, TFH = 46.8 min) with tech I crystal: 1480 m3/162 sec = 9.1 m3/s (TFH = 50.4 min) SiSi (remark: Mining Hold = **31250** m3) A I 1843 m3/180s = 10.2 m3/s (TFH = 51.1 min) A II 2212 m3/180s = 12.3 m3/s (TFH = 42.3 min) B I 1843 m3/162s = 11.4 m3/s (TFH = 45.7 min) B II 2212 m3/144s = 15.4 m3/s (TFH = 33.8 min) **Procurer** (_reference fit_: **2** mining laser upgrades II, 1 x Modulated Strip Miner II) TQ: with tech II crystal 1462 m3/162 sec = 9.0 m3/s (ore hold = 12,000 m3, TFH = 22.2 min) with tech I crystal 1357 m3/162 sec = 8.4 m3/s (TFH = 23.8 min) SiSi (remark: Mining Hold = **14,000** m3) A I 1470 m3/180s = 8.2 m3/s (TFH = 28.4 min) A II 1764 m3/180 = 9.8 m3/s (TFH = 23.8 min) B I 1470 m3/162s = 9.1 m3/s (TFH = 25.6 min) B II 1764 m3/144s = 12.3 m3/s (TFH = 19.0 min) (extra _reference fit_ - Procurer gets extra low slot: **3** mining laser upgrades II, 1 x Modulated Strip Miner II) A I 1603 m3/180s = 8.9 m3/s (TFH = 26.2 min) A II 1923 m3/180s = 10.7 m3/s (TFH = 21.8 min) B I 1603 m3/162s = 9.9 m3/s (TFH = 23.6 min) B II 1923 m3/144s = 13.4 m3/s (TFH = 17.4 min) Conclusions: (1) using the new B I type crystals, or passing the lvl threshold to use the new **tech II** A/B crystals **leads to higher mining speeds** than currently on Tranquility, for the three hulls. (2) for tech I vs. tech I comparison only the Procurer loses slightly with the new A I crystal (3) the time to fill the Mining Hold is reduced, in general, on the Procurer and the Retriever, and quite short on the Covetor, making the latter less comfortable to use, even unboosted. (4) **overall improvement in mining performance ! Happy casual miner…** Currently there are some issues on the expedition frigates on Sisi, the bonuses are not applied correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Rowley\_Birkin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/rowley_birkin/32/375243_2.png) [@Rowley\_Birkin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Rowley_Birkin)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 9:01pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1822 "2021-11-27T21:01:29Z")
Nice calculations. Thank you. “Happy casual miner…”, sadly not the R4 HS moon miners… ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Wadiest\_Yong](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/wadiest_yong/32/426921_2.png) [@Wadiest\_Yong](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Wadiest_Yong)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 9:03pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1823 "2021-11-27T21:03:47Z")
Thank you. Yes, the R4 changes are weird, out of place even, and imo not addressing the issue. ---
**Author:** ![ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/isd_dorrim_barstorlode/32/361083_2.png) [@ISD\_Dorrim\_Barstorlode](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/ISD_Dorrim_Barstorlode)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 9:48pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1824 "2021-11-27T21:48:28Z")
Removed some off topic posts. ---
**Author:** ![WindRider9](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/windrider9/32/280759_2.png) [@WindRider9](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/WindRider9)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2021, 9:49pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887/1825 "2021-11-27T21:49:14Z")
I’m curious, what happens when a orca is bumped with industrial core on? Anyone? Bumped with no option to return? [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=88) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/from-extraction-to-production-update/337887.md?page=90)