# Gankers and freighters, a request for discussion. Not a BJ RANT **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [March 5, 2018, 3:42pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236 "2018-03-05T15:42:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 41
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/862 "2018-04-12T09:38:27Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > This is nonsense. How do you do this solo (your steps listed above: > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Specific to LS, without wardec, this would work out as follows: > -Bump the target with a ship. > -Point it within 3 mins of the first bump with another ship. > -Warp the point ship off grid, to disengage gateguns. > -Warp back and reset the warp-off timer again, within 3 mins of the last one, to reset the warp-off timer. > -Rinse repeat. The only nonsense here is your claim this is possible to do solo when you clearly include 2 ships in this. Yet you have the position that the highsec freighter pilots deserve to be able to play solo, just not lowsec pvpers. Just stop being lazy in highsec and there is no need to nerf lowsec. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > You cant destroy a ship, as a solo PvPer, simply by bumping it, without aggressing it. > > Not one iota of that is changed in this proposal. Then maybe read back above slowly and try to understand it before posting rubbish. Of course you can’t kill a ship just my bumping. That isn’t what the tactic is about. It’s about using the sentry guns tactically against the larger ship, to your advantage, not against you. That you still don’t understand this is amazing. Until you actually understand what’s being discussed, this is going to be circular. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/863 "2018-04-12T09:38:34Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > Why? A simple question… Make a thread on that topic, and ask there. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:39am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/864 "2018-04-12T09:39:05Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Make a thread on that topic, and ask there. Are you suddenly an ISD, stop being a Jonah, pretending you are something you are not. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:41am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/865 "2018-04-12T09:41:40Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > How do you do this solo You cant do it solo as is now either in LS. > [@Dracvlad](#): > > Are you suddenly an ISD, stop being a Jonah, pretending you are something you are not. Drac I am not going to derail into explaining why CCP changing the game so you could fly an Omega and Alpha simultaneously would be devastating for all aspects of EVE balance/meta/activities and CCP income. I already stated, as relevant to this topic, that your proposal would mean each gank fleet would have TWICE the ships, per player, as now, vs your 1 Omega + 1 alt. 6 Omega gank players, would turn from 6 Omega ships, into 6 Omega ships + 6 Alpha alts= 12 ships ganking you. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/866 "2018-04-12T09:42:06Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > You cant do it solo as is now either in LS. ■■■■■■■■. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/867 "2018-04-12T09:42:34Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > ■■■■■■■■. Explain to me how you do it solo in LS now. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/868 "2018-04-12T09:44:33Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Explain to me how you do it solo in LS now. Larger ship on gate that you want to engage. Bump it so it can’t jump gate, nor align to warp out. This is done so that the larger ship makes the decision to engage. Once they engage, sentry guns help the solo player in the smaller ship. Point, shoot. Kill the other ship. ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/869 "2018-04-12T09:47:45Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > I already stated, as relevant to this topic, that your proposal would mean each gank fleet would have TWICE the ships, per player, as now, vs your 1 Omega + 1 alt. Rubbish, I told you why this would not be the case, you chose to ignore it. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/870 "2018-04-12T09:47:46Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > This is done so that the larger ship makes the decision to engage Only an idiot in a larger ship, that is taking no damage, would engage to cause gateguns to fire on themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/871 "2018-04-12T09:48:31Z")
> [@Dracvlad](#): > > Rubbish, I told you why this would not be the case, you chose to ignore it. Perhaps I missed it. Please link the post, or paraphrase it, as to how this would not be the case. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/872 "2018-04-12T09:49:38Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Only an idiot in a larger ship, that is taking no damage, would engage to cause gateguns to fire on themselves. And yet it happens. Amazing. Sentry gun play is a common aspect of lowsec pvp tactics. There is no need to nerf this at all, just so freighter pilots can be lazy in highsec. The lazy freighter pilot should add the extra character, to web them. This should be a nerf to lowsec pvp by making solo players take a second character to point, because of highsec issues. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:50am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/873 "2018-04-12T09:50:19Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > And yet it happens. Amazing. It can still happen in the proposed change. They can still be stupid and open fire. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:52am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/874 "2018-04-12T09:52:01Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > It can still happen in the proposed change. > > They can still be stupid and open fire. Jeez, why are you not getting this. The whole reason to engage at the moment is because there is no get out of bump free after 3 minutes card. Introduce that and then there really is no need to engage. Lowsec pvp nerfed. Just stop being lazy in highsec. No issue solved. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/875 "2018-04-12T09:56:10Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Introduce that and then there really is no need to engage. As I stated above, simply point it and fly off grid to disengage gateguns. Whether you need two ships for that, depends on the align time of the target. Its feasible to bump, point, warp off grid, and return to rinse/repeat before it warps off. If not, then have another ship point it and warp off grid to disengage gateguns, and return to repoint it to reset timer, while you continue bumping it. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:58am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/876 "2018-04-12T09:58:00Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > As I stated above, simply point it and fly off grid to disengage gateguns. Why does lowsec need this nerf? Why do lazy freighter pilots in highsec deserve their solo play, but not lowsec pvpers? ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 9:59am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/877 "2018-04-12T09:59:24Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Why does lowsec need this nerf? Its not a nerf to any sector. No sector mechanics are changed. The same change applies everywhere. If you cant keep a ship bumped/pointed, thats your problem. The means to do so will still exist, as before. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 10:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/878 "2018-04-12T10:01:41Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > Its not a nerf to any sector. It is. Read above. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > If you cant keep a ship bumped/pointed, thats your problem. If you can’t avoid being bumped in highsec, that’s your problem. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 10:03am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/879 "2018-04-12T10:03:34Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > It is. Its not. The same change applies everywhere and applies only to bumping. It does not change any sector mechanics, one bit. > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > If you can’t avoid being bumped in highsec, that’s your problem. The proposed change does not make it easier or harder to avoid bumping, anywhere. To avoid a bump, you must avoid the ship impacting with you. That is not changed by this proposal at all. Inb4 you run into another one of your rabbit holes. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 10:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/880 "2018-04-12T10:06:17Z")
> [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > The same change applies everywhere and applies only to bumping. > It does not change any sector mechanics, one bit. Oh great. So if it doesn’t change any sectors mechanics, then it doesn’t happen at all. It’s either a change or it isn’t. If it is, it has effects, including in lowsec and those changes in this case are a nerf to lowsec pvp. > [@Salvos\_Rhoska](#): > > The proposed change does not make it easier or harder to avoid bumping, anywhere. It provides a get out of bump free after 3 minutes mechanic for lazy pilots. If they can’t avoid getting bumped or can’t escape from a bump, that’s their problem. ---
**Author:** ![Salvos\_Rhoska](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/salvos_rhoska/32/14128_2.png) [@Salvos\_Rhoska](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Salvos_Rhoska)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 10:08am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236/881 "2018-04-12T10:08:29Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > So if it doesn’t change any sectors mechanics It doesnt change any sector mechanics. The change applies to bumping, regardless of sector, universally. > [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > If they can’t avoid getting bumped or can’t escape from a bump, that’s their problem. The proposed change doesnt help or impair anyone from performing a bump, or the target from avoiding one. It simply puts a universal cap on how long that can be done without placing a point on it. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236.md?page=40) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/gankers-and-freighters-a-request-for-discussion-not-a-bj-rant/61236.md?page=42)