# Ganking makes Eve a better place **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [June 25, 2021, 1:45pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690 "2021-06-25T13:45:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 9:40am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/163 "2021-10-14T09:40:59Z")
Nobody’s asking for a 100% safe Eve. If I’m killed I want it to be for profit, or because I suck at using weapons but at least had a fighting chance, not because some suicide gang of 15 with zero interest in profit or a good fight had lulz picking on a piddling little mining vessel that didn’t stand a chance. Yes…I’ll say it…such gankers are basically cowards who likely are useless at fighting anything with a gun in lowsec. ---
**Author:** ![Githany\_Red](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/githany_red/32/378551_2.png) [@Githany\_Red](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Githany_Red)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 9:44am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/164 "2021-10-14T09:44:36Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > But that claim that ganking helps people fit a proper tank is nonsense, because extra shielding, armour, etc merely increases how many gankers it takes to kill you That’s why we find change in our hunting tactics work best, we all adapt but can’t over use something, what works one day will not the next . A small example, Ew burst work great if you get positioning and timing right. Gankers get to know your Ew burst pilots , upping their eccm , they even changed ship once because one of our burst pilots showed up, now some groups target our burst pilots on their attack runs setting aside 2 ganker for this task. So there’s no proper fit no proper way just don’t repeat yourself and keep your enemies guessing. Fit your ship properly and watch local and d-scan and watch the space around you for scouts. You don’t want people like Rion the ganker scout calling in a gank on you. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 10:01am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/165 "2021-10-14T10:01:24Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Nobody’s asking for a 100% safe Eve and: > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > It doesn’t make you un-killable Thanks Bob for that. If not 100% safe, then complaining about not being unkillable might not be the best way to express it. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > If I’m killed I want it to be for profit Luckily, what each of us individually want isn’t relevant to what others want. We are all free to choose why we do things, and that means we are all free to choose reasons other than profit. So someone else choosing to kill for fun, is just as valid. No one reason is more equal than another. ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 10:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/166 "2021-10-14T10:48:39Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > Luckily, what each of us individually want isn’t relevant to what others want. What a self-contradictory argument. So the ganker is ‘free’ to choose their Eve lifestyle but the miner isn’t. That is effectively what you are saying. Why isn’t what the ganker wants equally as irrelevant ? ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 10:56am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/167 "2021-10-14T10:56:03Z")
> [@Scipio\_Artelius](#): > > If not 100% safe, then complaining about not being unkillable might not be the best way to express it. Well, no, I think its just that you fail to see the circular reasoning behind the whole ‘tank up to avoid ganking’ argument that gankers use to ‘justify’ their cause. It is on par with a burglar somehow claiming he is helping you to avoid being burgled and you should have better alarms…as he exits your front door with his bag of swag 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 11:18am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/168 "2021-10-14T11:18:32Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > The claim that people ‘let’ themselves be ganked would be true if it were possible to be totally un-gankable. One thing does not prove or disprove the other. If someone’s ship is in space and they go Afk with known gankers in system, in what way does the existence or non existence of an ungankable ship mean that person didnt let themselves be ganked? ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 11:20am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/169 "2021-10-14T11:20:24Z")
Also people who recently have accused me of building strawmen have evidently chosen to blind themselves to the veritible field of hay being built in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 11:24am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/170 "2021-10-14T11:24:17Z")
How do you actually KNOW…in advance…that someone is AFK ? I see this AFK excuse used a lot. But it is yet more circular reasoning ( as if ganking isn’t already full of that ). You cannot know in advance that someone is AFK…the only way you can know is by attacking them and getting no response. But you then can’t use that lack of response as a retroactive ‘AFK’ reason for attacking in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/sasha_nemtsov/32/393707_2.png) [@Sasha\_Nemtsov](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Sasha_Nemtsov)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 1:58pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/171 "2021-10-14T13:58:50Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > How do you actually KNOW…in advance…that someone is AFK ? You see, this is where you don’t think through what you say, Cilla. One example. A mining barge sitting in a belt, motionless; no lasers cycling - for a suspiciously long time, with idle mining drones. ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 2:52pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/172 "2021-10-14T14:52:16Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > How do you actually KNOW…in advance…that someone is AFK ? Why is that relevent to them being AFK? If you choose to be afk you are choosing not to defend yourself. I fail to see how you think any of what you are saying is logic. I see you have already abandoned your “ungankable ship” rhetoric in favour of continually moving goal posts. A person who does not defend themselves in a game where the objective is to compete with others and violence is a legitimate tactic is not a victim, they have simply lost. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 7:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/173 "2021-10-14T19:06:27Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > But that claim that ganking helps people fit a proper tank is nonsense, because extra shielding, armour, etc merely increases how many gankers it takes to kill you. It doesn’t make you un-killable…it just means it needs 20 gankers to kill you rather than 10. Player is still just as dead at the end of it. Given that gankers can scout and know exactly what fit a person is running, they can also plan ahead for what weapons to use. > > Plus the claim that ganking somehow ‘helps’ people is sort of like burglars claiming they help people fit proper burglar alarms…when people wouldn’t need the alarms were it not for the burglars in the first place 🙂 Gankers don’t always roll in groups of 20. A good tank will discourage smaller ganker gangs. See what I find funny about yous and your crowd is you refuse to accept that there are a ton of ways to avoid ganks or mitigate them. Maybe if they added all the ganker corps as red and watched local, which updates instantly, its like they could almost warp away in time… > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Yes…I’ll say it…such gankers are basically cowards who likely are useless at fighting anything with a gun in lowsec. This perspective is so hilarious. It isn’t just miners getting ganked friend. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > So the ganker is ‘free’ to choose their Eve lifestyle but the miner isn’t. The miner is free to mine. Miner is also free to fit a tank, watch local and d-scan, add ganker corp/members to standings, recruit friends to guard, avoid known ganking systems, and otherwise play the game as intended. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > How do you actually KNOW…in advance…that someone is AFK ? I see this AFK excuse used a lot. The venture I blew up in low last night let me burn 40km to him and didn’t even warp away as I started to fire. Yea, he was AFK. Also I’ve seen tons of ventures just chilling in Poinen in the belts. No lasers on. No hardeners. Just waiting for death LOL. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 7:27pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/174 "2021-10-14T19:27:46Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > if it were possible to be totally un-gankable. But that is not possible. It is possible, but it requires you to actually be at your keyboard. ---
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 7:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/175 "2021-10-14T19:31:03Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > How do you actually KNOW…in advance…that someone is AFK ? I always message miners in advance, through EVEmail and personal convo. I ask them how they are doing, ask if they are AFK, and inform them that I will gank if they do not respond within 15 minutes. I usually wait about 20 minutes, and send several follow-up inquiries, but if there is still no response I can generally assume they are AFK. I have only had one miner complain about this, stating that he didn’t respond because he doesn’t like me, and I refunded his ship since he insisted that he had been at his keyboard watching me gank him. ---
**Author:** ![Siegfried\_Cohenberg](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siegfried_cohenberg/32/423311_2.png) [@Siegfried\_Cohenberg](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siegfried_Cohenberg)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2021, 10:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/176 "2021-10-14T22:04:19Z")
Here’s the deal guys. Ganking is healthy for eve. High security space is great for new players and for the ones who just want to relax and do their carebear activities, but they still need to be afraid. High security is not absolute security. Ganking puts people on edge, and carebears need to be reminded that there is danger out there. If they don’t lose something every once and awhile they’ll get bored and just go play another mmo. If a hauler loses their charon after being ganked for the first time they are going to be woken the ■■■■ up. They’re going to think twice before accepting a high collateral contract that goes through uedama. They have to stop and think for a second as to what happened and how they can prevent that loss from happening again. A gank will force the carebear to adapt. If there is no danger in space, there is no reason to learn and improve at the game. If they don’t learn from that loss they will simply get filtered out and get ganked out of the industry as we point and laugh at their incompetance. I really don’t need to explain why ganking is good for mining. This subject has been discussed at length. The activity involves clicking one button every 10 minutes and waiting for your hull to be full. Ganking these literal bot aspirants just reminds them that theres more to the game than waiting for aura to shout YOUR CARGO BAY IS FULL. They probably don’t know it, but miners are literal prey to be exploited for fun. They’re the irl equivalent of a blind pidgeon that can’t fly anymore because its too fat and gankers are the house cat looking for a neck to break. This game will die without villains. Eve already has a small dedicated niche playerbase. Conflict creates content. Content creates a reason to keep playing eve. Loss creates real human emotions other games have a real hard time recreating. Being ganked, scammed, betrayed, or even just losing a pvp fight are one of the memorable moments you can have in eve. It may not be as fun as “winning” but it certainly evokes an oh ■■■■ moment that gets your heart going. If there were no ganking (or related activities), you would be playing space idle simulator 2021. ---
**Author:** ![Scipio\_Artelius](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/scipio_artelius/32/408264_2.png) [@Scipio\_Artelius](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Scipio_Artelius)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 4:14am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/177 "2021-10-15T04:14:10Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > What a self-contradictory argument. So the ganker is ‘free’ to choose their Eve lifestyle but the miner isn’t. “each of us” also includes miners. Why do you consider them to be somehow a lesser player? Miners have every right to choose their lifestyle as anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 5:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/178 "2021-10-15T05:34:39Z")
> [@Gix\_Firebrand](#): > > This perspective is so hilarious. It isn’t just miners getting ganked friend. Baloney ! A quick look on zkillboard shows MOST of the ships ganked are Retrievers, Procurers, Skiffs, Mackinaws and other mining and industrial ships. ---
**Author:** ![Cilla\_Cybin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cilla_cybin/32/292206_2.png) [@Cilla\_Cybin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cilla_Cybin)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 5:48am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/179 "2021-10-15T05:48:46Z")
> [@Siegfried\_Cohenberg](#): > > Ganking these literal bot aspirants just reminds them that theres more to the game than waiting for aura to shout YOUR CARGO BAY IS FULL. They probably don’t know it, but miners are literal prey to be exploited for fun Miners are the people who mine the ore that replaces the ships people lose in combat…or via ganking. Without those bored to tears miners there’d be no ships fighting anyone and thus no ‘more to the game’ ! Eve could survive without gankers…but it could not survive without miners. ---
**Author:** ![Siegfried\_Hohenberg](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siegfried_hohenberg/32/292704_2.png) [@Siegfried\_Hohenberg](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siegfried_Hohenberg)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 6:04am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/180 "2021-10-15T06:04:41Z")
Welcome back from your most loyal fanboy! I miss your freighter actions in Uedama. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 6:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/181 "2021-10-15T06:26:30Z")
> [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Baloney ! A quick look on zkillboard shows MOST of the ships ganked are Retrievers, Procurers, Skiffs, Mackinaws and other mining and industrial ships. Sigh. Do you even play this game? Miners get ganked but abyssal runners/mission runners are on the uptick. A lot. And those miners have so many tools to avoid le gank. They asking for it. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Eve could survive without gankers…but it could not survive without miners. And then market tanks as no ships blow up and then peeps stop mining. Its almost like you don’t understand economics… ---
**Author:** ![Ramona\_McCandless](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/ramona_mccandless/32/468438_2.png) [@Ramona\_McCandless](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Ramona_McCandless)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2021, 6:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690/182 "2021-10-15T06:28:25Z")
You literally agreed with him. He said miners werent the only ships ganked and you said most were. Most doesnt mean all. > [@Cilla\_Cybin](#): > > Eve could survive without gankers…but it could not survive without miners. And not all miners quit. Not all miners arent also gankers. You are either a troll or simply dont think. No one should ever reply to you. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690.md?page=8) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/ganking-makes-eve-a-better-place/317690.md?page=10)