# Getting bumped in a freight highsec should make the bumper flagged **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [March 3, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636 "2019-03-03T17:02:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2019, 10:06pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/203 "2019-03-24T22:06:56Z")
> [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > I was bumped on March 23rd in Niarja from around 15:55 to 17:08 before they finally arrived to start shooting. Granted, I was afk for the first 10 minutes. But it wouldn’t have made any difference at all if I had been on. The next hour or so I was trying to figure out if there was anything I could do. I mean you had over an hour to organize a rescue fleet, that is quite some time. If they nerf bumping one day that will go away and you will die right away without an hour of time to respond. You can argue now that on top of the loss of your ship they stole an hour of your time. But imagine for a second you where able to organize a counter bumper, a ganker fleet of your own to take out the bumping ship, some ewar coverage or reps. Isn’t the possibility to have at least a chance to do something giving some power about the situation back to you? In my opinion a freighter is a capital ship and such a ship isn’t ment to be flown without support. They have huge advantages in cargohold and HP and as a drawback they are slow and vulnerable to bumps. If that wasn’t the case their only downside would be the slow align time (that would still give gankers an opportunity to catch you) and the slow warp speed. I don’t think that is enough especially in highsec where they are pretty hard to kill. As I said in another post, there are other options to move stuff around that don’t suffer from this vulnerability if that is such a high concern but have different drawbacks like low HP and smaller cargo holds but are more suited for solo use. I would rather see those options become more viable and not the other way around. Freighters are already too good and rarely get killed and most pilots fly them around completely unattended like you admittedly. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2019, 10:17pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/204 "2019-03-24T22:17:47Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > Really, keep in mind that unless the mechanics are simple, almost every extra rule to make a situation more complex adds extra edge cases for people to abuse. This is something most people don’t get. Highsec rules aren’t as complicated and easy to abuse as they used to be, but adding such rules will make them super weird again for the average player not familiar with the game mechanics (which is most of the players in highsec). And ironically the people who would profit the most from this are exactly the people they try to hurt such special rules. Because this things are never “miner vs. ganker” or “hauler vs. ganker” but more like “unaware player vs. player interested in how the game works”. And the player who is invested in finding new ways to abuse new game mechanics will in the end always come out on top. ---
**Author:** ![Cypr3ss\_Deteis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cypr3ss_deteis/32/392947_2.png) [@Cypr3ss\_Deteis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cypr3ss_Deteis)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 3:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/205 "2019-03-25T03:07:28Z")
> [@Karak\_Terrel](#): > > > I was bumped on March 23rd in Niarja from around 15:55 to 17:08 before they finally arrived to start shooting. Granted, I was afk for the first 10 minutes. But it wouldn’t have made any difference at all if I had been on. The next hour or so I was trying to figure out if there was anything I could do. > > I mean you had over an hour to organize a rescue fleet, that is quite some time. Um, it’s not even that difficult is it… at ~16:06 (upon returning to keyboard) simply log off. If just being bumped there’s no active timers, so ship would just disappear from system (the ‘emergency warp’ wouldn’t work, I don’t think, but ship would not be held in space (unlike if it had a timer)). Regards, Cypr3ss. ---
**Author:** ![Australian\_Excellence](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/australian_excellence/32/367782_2.png) [@Australian\_Excellence](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Australian_Excellence)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 3:57am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/206 "2019-03-25T03:57:49Z")
I love grouping up with my good friend Siegfried Cohenberg and having a 5 hour bumpoff, where we keep 5-6 freighters bumped the whole time then kill them all one after the other every 15 mins till they’re all dead. While they’re waiting in the que the lucky pilots send us isk as thanks and sometimes end up in one of our famous bonus rooms if they’re one of the real lucky ones. ---
**Author:** ![Teckos\_Pech](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/teckos_pech/32/375283_2.png) [@Teckos\_Pech](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Teckos_Pech)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 4:25am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/207 "2019-03-25T04:25:00Z")
> [@Aquaros\_Armincata](#): > > Getting bumped in a freight highsec should make the bumper flagged. How about if you just stop being dumb? ---
**Author:** ![Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siddharta_bheskagor/32/405738_2.png) [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siddharta_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 6:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/208 "2019-03-25T06:21:58Z")
> [@Cypr3ss\_Deteis](#): > > Um, it’s not even that difficult is it… Yes I learned that finally… ---
**Author:** ![Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siddharta_bheskagor/32/405738_2.png) [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siddharta_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 6:28am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/209 "2019-03-25T06:28:31Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > I pick a ganking ship, fly it to one side of a freighter, align towards some bookmark, site, station or gate behind my victim and press warp just long enough for the ‘specified amount of time’ to fall within the rules you’re trying to set, while bumping the freighter. Please keep in mind I accept ganking and bumping of freighters. I’m talking about bumping them for extended periods of time without any recognizable effort to finally gank them. So I’m thinking about a timer that takes for example 15 minutes after initiating warp. If two ships bumped into each other 15 minutes after one of them initiated warp the one that is not trying for 15 minutes to enter could get a suspect flag. Or the ship could enter warp regardless of alignment. If it’s an AFK Pilot, you have another 15 minutes on the exit gate if you started on the entry gate. From my point of view that should be enough time to make up your mind if the expected loot or educational effect is worth your effort. Or play out extortion schemes. ---
**Author:** ![Cypr3ss\_Deteis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/cypr3ss_deteis/32/392947_2.png) [@Cypr3ss\_Deteis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Cypr3ss_Deteis)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 7:54am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/210 "2019-03-25T07:54:58Z")
> [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > So I’m thinking about a timer Why? I thought that: > [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > Yes I learned that finally… So what purpose does a timer serve? Regards, Cypr3ss. ---
**Author:** ![Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siddharta_bheskagor/32/405738_2.png) [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siddharta_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 1:28pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/211 "2019-03-25T13:28:54Z")
It would make logging off unnecessary. Unlogging seems to be a strange solution. ---
**Author:** ![BPRelvara\_LSG](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/bprelvara_lsg/32/125822_2.png) [@BPRelvara\_LSG](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/BPRelvara_LSG)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 2:15pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/212 "2019-03-25T14:15:13Z")
> [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > Unlogging seems to be a strange solution. You see, you must unlog to play the game, complete paradox 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:21pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/213 "2019-03-25T22:21:03Z")
> [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > Please keep in mind I accept ganking and bumping of freighters. I’m talking about bumping them for extended periods of time without any recognizable effort to finally gank them. > So I’m thinking about a timer that takes for example 15 minutes after initiating warp. If two ships bumped into each other 15 minutes after one of them initiated warp the one that is not trying for 15 minutes to enter could get a suspect flag. Or the ship could enter warp regardless of alignment. If it’s an AFK Pilot, you have another 15 minutes on the exit gate if you started on the entry gate. > From my point of view that should be enough time to make up your mind if the expected loot or educational effect is worth your effort. Or play out extortion schemes. Again, let’s play the _how would I abuse this if I had evil intentions_ -game. After 15 minutes I switch to another bumping pilot. Complicated rule, nothing changed. To combat that, let’s make sure that no matter the pilot, if someone bumps a ship that has been trying to warp for 15 minutes, that pilot gets suspect flagged. Next thing is that gankers put a few permanently bumped freighters on highly travelled gates to kill anyone who gets flagged when they accidentally bump into the freighter. To avoid complicated situations where people abuse the game mechanics, keep the game mechanics simple. Don’t add more rules, because people will get around those. ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:25pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/214 "2019-03-25T22:25:32Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > Next thing is that gankers put a few permanently bumped freighters on highly travelled gates to kill anyone who gets flagged when they accidentally bump into the freighter. I think you mean on Jita undock there right… :P. As I said above. Bumping sucks but sucks less than the alternative rules so it’s what we are going to have to live with. However there are other solutions such as allowing people to warp after a time bumped regardless. Use it or lose it basically. Tackle should be like that as well, if you can’t kill the ship in a reasonable time, you shouldn’t be allowed to pin it till downtime making it a contest of who has to log off first. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:29pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/215 "2019-03-25T22:29:29Z")
Jita undock would indeed be a perfect place for that. But I don’t agree with setting a ‘reasonable time’ for engagements. Sometimes if something seems a stalemate where you can’t kill someone and they can’t do anything back to you, it’s never a true stalemate. You could bet the other guy values his time more than you, and ask ISK to release him. Or you could ask friends or even random people in system to come help you. It’s a multiplayer game and there’s lots of options, make use of them! ---
**Author:** ![Nevyn\_Auscent](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/nevyn_auscent/32/255124_2.png) [@Nevyn\_Auscent](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Nevyn_Auscent)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:31pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/216 "2019-03-25T22:31:30Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > it’s never a true stalemate. Sure, this is often true, but this is also a game. People who play games don’t expect to get trapped in them for hours or lose loads of value. It makes something not fun if you get locked up too long. All those things you list can still be done if there is a cap on how long a stalemate can go on for. Much like we don’t set people criminal permanently despite the fact it would be appropriate, because it’s not fun to have a permanent timer. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:34pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/217 "2019-03-25T22:34:16Z")
> [@Nevyn\_Auscent](#): > > Sure, this is often true, but this is also a game. People who play games don’t expect to get trapped in them for hours or lose loads of value. It makes something not fun if you get locked up too long. > All those things you list can still be done if there is a cap on how long a stalemate can go on for. > Much like we don’t set people criminal permanently despite the fact it would be appropriate, because it’s not fun to have a permanent timer. If it goes on too long, you could also offer to pay ISK (up to your ship’s value) to release you. Or if it goes on too long and no amount of ISK will persuade the other to release you, suiciding your ship is also an option. You’re never truly stuck, there’s lots of possibilities. ---
**Author:** ![Galaxy\_Pig](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/galaxy_pig/32/374625_2.png) [@Galaxy\_Pig](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Galaxy_Pig)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 10:59pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/218 "2019-03-25T22:59:37Z")
“CCPlease HALP! I’ve made several poor decisions in a row! It’s YOUR responsibility to get me out of this corned I’ve back myself into!” -Every carebear speaking on this subject ever. ---
**Author:** ![Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/siddharta_bheskagor/32/405738_2.png) [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Siddharta_Bheskagor)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2019, 11:04pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/219 "2019-03-25T23:04:14Z")
Sometimes I’m slow but I think I finally get it. > [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > Next thing is that gankers put a few permanently bumped freighters on highly travelled gates to kill anyone who gets flagged when they accidentally bump into the freighter. And bump other targets into those traps to make it less random. Strange: Google, Amazon, Facebook,… can make money analyzing its users’ behaviour but behaviour analysis is not yet a thing in EVE. Just kidding, don’t hit me. I’m not fully convinced a reasonable warp timer would not work and a reasonable time could be found. But I guess there’s a reason CCP didn’t follow up on their announcement - if it wasn’t a joke from the start. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2019, 4:37pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/221 "2019-03-26T16:37:37Z")
> [@Siddharta\_Bheskagor](#): > > I’m not fully convinced a reasonable warp timer would not work and a reasonable time could be found. A reasonable warp timer sure does sound reasonable. But I feel the issue would be that this requires some arbitrary value that says “trying to warp for 29 seconds is reasonable, 30 isn’t” and leaving the burden of knowledge on the players. The people that play high sec ganking games will then grab their secondary bumper to start bumping after exactly 29 seconds while the unaware high sec carebear will call CCP that their _reasonable_ timer does not work. I do support ideas that make the game a better (but not necessarily safer) place, but warp mechanics are pretty complex. If you want to help people who are the victim of these complexities, don’t make it even more complex by adding more rules to make it more _reasonable_. Try to make it simpler instead. ---
**Author:** ![Anderson\_Geten](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/anderson_geten/32/390041_2.png) [@Anderson\_Geten](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Anderson_Geten)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2019, 4:44pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/222 "2019-03-26T16:44:22Z")
> [@Gerard\_Amatin](#): > > The people that play high sec ganking games will then grab their secondary bumper to start bumping after exactly 29 seconds while the unaware high sec carebear will call CCP that their _reasonable_ timer does not work. This would have no effect. After 29s of started the warp, you warp, period. Also the warp timer could be twice the “align time” of the ship. That is, after twice the align time of the ship, you warp, whatever is your align. ---
**Author:** ![Karak\_Terrel](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/karak_terrel/32/373453_2.png) [@Karak\_Terrel](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Karak_Terrel)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2019, 5:51pm UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636/223 "2019-03-26T17:51:33Z")
> [@Anderson\_Geten](#): > > Also the warp timer could be twice the “align time” of the ship. That is, after twice the align time of the ship, you warp, whatever is your align. It would have to be far higher than that, otherwise it would have a huge impact on regular combat situations as well. [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636.md?page=10) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/getting-bumped-in-a-freight-highsec-should-make-the-bumper-flagged/143636.md?page=12)