# Griefing ruins the game **URL:** \ **Category:** Crime & Punishment\ **Created:** [January 2, 2022, 12:21am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880 "2022-01-02T00:21:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Aiko\_Danuja](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/aiko_danuja/32/481237_2.png) [@Aiko\_Danuja](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Aiko_Danuja)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 6:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/21 "2022-01-02T06:34:07Z")
> [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](#): > > 15v1 isn’t fun. If it’s 15v1, it’s not griefing. Griefers by definition are a minority. If you are out-numbered by ‘griefers’ then they obviously aren’t griefers. The problem is YOU, not them. They are the community, and you are the griefer, and they are banding together to remove you. Let me guess, someone rolled into your hole and killed a Praxis. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 6:36am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/22 "2022-01-02T06:36:00Z")
You used a Praxis. That alone got you what you deserved. These crappy ships ruin so much of EVE that everyone who uses it should automatically lose SP every time they lose a Praxis. ![REDNES](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/9/6/5/96524d53cb22e8d34dff925203908c55729b363e.png) ---
**Author:** ![Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arcturen_sanguis/32/261712_2.png) [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arcturen_Sanguis)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 7:26am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/23 "2022-01-02T07:26:28Z")
Tell me what ship a 500k SP alpha can fly with 2+1 hundred thousand tons of mass, I’d happily replace it. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 7:38am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/25 "2022-01-02T07:38:57Z")
Any other BS? An Abaddon only takes 519000 SP to get to Amarr BS IV, and it’s heavier and you support industrialists instead of using cheap, prebuilt ships that circumvent industrialists completely. Actually, most BS are heavier than a Praxis, but you have to decide and don’t get an OP jack-of-all-trades-minimaster-of-all-ship. ![REDNES](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/9/6/5/96524d53cb22e8d34dff925203908c55729b363e.png) ---
**Author:** ![Abu\_Ahmed\_Al-Kuwaiti](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/abu_ahmed_al-kuwaiti/32/510981_2.png) [@Abu\_Ahmed\_Al-Kuwaiti](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Abu_Ahmed_Al-Kuwaiti)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 7:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/26 "2022-01-02T07:46:20Z")
Typhoon/Tempest are the fastest T1 rollers and can be used day 1 with the 1m SP. Pretty sure they go like twice the speed of a praxis without having to do mass calc with 1600 plates. ---
**Author:** ![Gix\_Firebrand](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gix_firebrand/32/456949_2.png) [@Gix\_Firebrand](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gix_Firebrand)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 7:46am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/27 "2022-01-02T07:46:52Z")
You realize every time you do that, you get your own thread closed right? ROFL. I’d venture a guess living in a hole, soloing it, doesn’t lend much to social graces huh? ---
**Author:** ![Qia\_Kare](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/qia_kare/32/279281_2.png) [@Qia\_Kare](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Qia_Kare)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/28 "2022-01-02T07:55:19Z")
> [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](#): > > They hold you there for 3-4mins ewar only so everyone can get on the KM. If the ship was assured to be a loss and I had other things to do or places to be, I used the self destruct to reclaim my time. ---
**Author:** ![Leggone\_Stracks](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/leggone_stracks/32/290900_2.png) [@Leggone\_Stracks](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Leggone_Stracks)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:03am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/29 "2022-01-02T08:03:02Z")
How long does it take to self destruct? Or do the game mechanics mess that up. ---
**Author:** ![Leggone\_Stracks](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/leggone_stracks/32/290900_2.png) [@Leggone\_Stracks](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Leggone_Stracks)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/30 "2022-01-02T08:06:04Z")
Use a Mammoth. It will take you 10 times longer, but it is 100 times cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![Gerard\_Amatin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/gerard_amatin/32/481361_2.png) [@Gerard\_Amatin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Gerard_Amatin)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:12am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/31 "2022-01-02T08:12:29Z")
Sounds like a while ago when someone in standing fleet noticed a couple of Praxises on a nearby wormhole and called for bombers. We quickly formed and dropped on them. A few of us were surprised to see the fit with only plates, higgs rig and no guns in the killmail (as null sec newbies don’t really know much about rollimg wormholes). I didn’t know we were griefing. ---
**Author:** ![Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arcturen_sanguis/32/261712_2.png) [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arcturen_Sanguis)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/32 "2022-01-02T08:45:47Z")
I use the praxis solely for rolling, so if there’s a cheaper way to do it, I’m all for it. I’ll look at tempest/typhoon fits and compare prices. Thank you for your help! ---
**Author:** ![Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arcturen_sanguis/32/261712_2.png) [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arcturen_Sanguis)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:47am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/33 "2022-01-02T08:47:08Z")
Nullsecc’rs are given a pass. This was a wormhole corp, but losing the praxis isn’t a big deal, it happens all the time. It was the holding for ewar and then podding that got to me – thats the part I consider griefing Podding is against what we call ‘wormhole bushido’. Because of the way Jspace mechanics work getting a pod back in takes a lot of time, so its generally frowned upon unless they have a clone after a fleet fight or capital tackle. ---
**Author:** ![Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/zhalyd_lyehin/32/358574_2.png) [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Zhalyd_Lyehin)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/34 "2022-01-02T08:49:00Z")
They are all more expensive. Much more expensive. And that’s the problem with the Praxis. Every BS has become more expensive but the Praxis is still as cheap as ever, while providing ridiculous capabilities for tank, dps, mobility and utility. ![REDNES](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/9/6/5/96524d53cb22e8d34dff925203908c55729b363e.png) ---
**Author:** ![Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arcturen_sanguis/32/261712_2.png) [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arcturen_Sanguis)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 8:49am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/35 "2022-01-02T08:49:53Z")
Ahh yeah, that does sound like a problem. The thing is: the roller is going to die to 10-15 people regardless of what it is, so I decided to fly the cheapest I can… which is the praxis 🤷‍♂️ ---
**Author:** ![Dracvlad](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dracvlad/32/444126_2.png) [@Dracvlad](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dracvlad)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:00am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/36 "2022-01-02T09:00:05Z")
I much prefer to play on the “No Threat Don’t Shoot” basis or NTDS as I call it. I like to have reasons to shoot someone in game. Though I would not call that incident griefing, more like desperation in that there is so little to actually shoot that everyone wants to get on that rare kill. > [@Zhalyd\_Lyehin](#): > > They are all more expensive. Much more expensive. And that’s the problem with the Praxis. Every BS has become more expensive but the Praxis is still as cheap as ever, while providing ridiculous capabilities for tank, dps, mobility and utility. Don’t say that too loud or CCP will notice…, the same can be said of the Gnosis and the Sunesis too. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Offensive](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/dr_offensive/32/401971_2.png) [@Dr\_Offensive](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Dr_Offensive)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:05am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/37 "2022-01-02T09:05:05Z")
You could have self destructed to deny all the other members the glory of the mighty Praxis kill ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:06am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/38 "2022-01-02T09:06:12Z")
> [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](#): > > They hold you there for 3-4mins You could have denied them the pleasure and also conserve a lot of time and “frustration” in the process with a few simple clicks… [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/9/b/9bace38cf5406bbbc00b9bae6e45f11cb1daf2d0.png) ](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/3X/9/b/9bace38cf5406bbbc00b9bae6e45f11cb1daf2d0.png) ![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/original/4X/6/2/e/62eb428fc994bdf7495dafec826cfa9c294d5cf9.png) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/arcturen_sanguis/32/261712_2.png) [@Arcturen\_Sanguis](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Arcturen_Sanguis)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:07am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/39 "2022-01-02T09:07:08Z")
Yeah next time Ill have to do that. @Uriel_the_Flame I kept expecting just to die but they just didn’t kill me. I was like ‘ok time to die now’ every 15sec and it kept going lol Next time they all stop shooting ill just initiate self destruct XD ---
**Author:** ![Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/uriel_the_flame/32/490165_2.png) [@Uriel\_the\_Flame](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Uriel_the_Flame)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:09am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/40 "2022-01-02T09:09:23Z")
You can cancel it any time as far as I know so not even a reason not to start it if you see overwhelming force as if by some miracle you see a chance to survive then you can just cancel it… just be sure to pay attention to the countdown, which can be quite tricky in the middle of combat though. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Muppet](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/eveonline/user_avatar/forums.eveonline.com/not_muppet/32/302935_2.png) [@Not\_Muppet](https://forums.eveonline.com/u/Not_Muppet)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2022, 9:34am UTC](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880/41 "2022-01-02T09:34:19Z")
If I had the foresight to know the tears, heartache and grief that killing this poor defenseless praxis would have caused… Him coming into our pub channel after we left to continue his barrage of harsh criticism… pointing out all of our flaws and reminding us of how trash we are really did a number on us. After a few hours of deep soul searching we met as a leadership team to discuss our path forward. Moving forward the wild alpha praxis will be free to roam wspace… free from our rabid assaults. We will also begin to honor wormhole bushido and never again pod anyone. Please forgive us for our misgivings. “Did someone say Praxis?!” -AMOR 2022 [Previous page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.eveonline.com/t/griefing-ruins-the-game/343880.md?page=3)